Second viewing - questions to ask and who to bring. Help please!

[VeniVidiVino]

I am turning myself over to the advice of MN for this.

We are first time buyers and have found a house we can envisage making our home. It needs some work upstairs - the current owners have chopped up the master bedroom to make a tiny poky small additional bedroom and we would want to put this back to one big room and properly convert the loft (velux and staircase already in place) to make up for the loss of a bedroom.

We have just booked a second viewing for next week, but what should we do/ask/check? DH thinks we should bring various parents to see it too but I have my reservations about this. WWYD? I am quite intimidated by the property market and would value any and all advice from experienced house vendors/buyers.

I should also mention that it's a bit over our budget but within 'tolerance' for a reasonable offer IMO.

Have they priced it as a 3 bed?

Thanks for the quick response. Yes it's priced as a 3 bed but also has obvious potential in the attic room. TBH it's a little over priced but not much, having tracked the market in my town for the last couple of years. PP to extend should be easy too as precendent set on rest of terrace.

If the main bedroom has been divided to make 3 the surveyor may down value it. I have viewed a couple of those and the 3rd bedroom is tiny. I think on 2nd viewing ask about neighbours, the boiler, if they have any drawings for a loft etc.

Hmm, hadn't thought of that. It is absolutely miniscule. Boiler, neighbours and loft added to list of questions, thanks.

I wouldn't bring anyone this time but if you are still interested, do take someone next time before you make an offer - nothing is likely to move that quickly at the moment.

Ask about planning permission for the attic, have a look at the roof/guttering/soffitts, ask if they've had any problems with damp (do you know how long they've been there?), have a look at the electrics and the position of things. Are room walls broken up with radiators/fireplaces/windows to such an extent that you can't put a sofa in? Do the floorboards feel solid all over? Are the walls straight and not bulging?

(most of this is for an older property)

Bring parents if you want- Study mantaince of things like guttering, windows, age of bathroom/ kitchen. Look at windowsills- mold/ cracks. Look at neighbours gardens- how well kept? Rented or owners? Parking? Storage? Where will your Hoover and washing go?

I wouldn't take anyone with me (certainly not parents!), unless I happened to have a friend who was a surveyor/builder.

Your surveyor will do a full report which will cover all your queries. Obv. don't just get a mortgage valuation, which won't.

Others have already said it - neighbours, very important. And not just immediate neighbours, but the street as a whole.

I would take a friend who is experienced or very interested in property with me (someone like noddyholder ideally!), rather than a parent.

Ask who owns fences. Check for any very large trees in garden (or neighbours) The state of the shed/ greenhouse. And ask about neighbours and look at their gardens. How long have sellers lived there and why are they moving.

Ask if there is planning permission or building regulations approval for the conversion work they have undertaken on the loft. If not, ask why not. Ditto the room divison (although not certain this requires BR approval).

If it's not a 'real' 3 bed house it shouldn't really be priced as a 3 bed house I don't think.

Ask if it's got cavity wall insulation and loft insulation under the boards in the loft.

Ask when it was last rewired. If more than 25+ years ago plan for the cost of a rewire (around £2000), very rough estimate).

Check out the state of the walls - if every conceivable surface is covered in textured wallpaper or woodchip, consider that underneath the paper may be lumpy walls that need skimming - expensive and messy.

If you are serious about the house, do you have any tradesmen friends (builder, plumber etc) you could take around to give their opinion?

You must must must ask about the neighbours, as PP has said. So important.

Ask whether there are any shared access arrangements or rights of way over garden - there sometimes are in rows of terraces.

Do you have children? IF so, is the house in catchment for schools?

Would only take the parents if you are considering making an offer, but prob would the next time, especially if one or other of them is in any way knowledgable about houses. Go and have a look with fresh eyes. Sometimes the first time you view a property, you are so overcome with love for it, that you ignore/ gloss over potential problems. We have looked at houses and loved them and then on second viewing when you have taken the rose tinted specs off, you realise that those 'little' problems that you could see past because you just couldn't live without this house, are actually something that WOULD be a dealbreaker. Sit down together and make a list of all the questions you want to ask and then take the list with you to the viewing and add to it as you are walking round.Definately ask if they already have obtained PP for the loft. They may already have it, but then decided to move and check dates (PP does not last indefinately and if the time period since it was granted has lapsed, you WILL need to reapply).
You don't say if the owners or an agent is conducting the viewing. If there are any questions you feel uncomfortable asking the homeowners, then definately find out through your estate agent.
Good luck and I hope you find your dream home!!

Wow, thanks for all of this!

Patti What is a soffitt? [stupid emoticon] they have been there about 6 years (have seen last sold price on find a property) and are moving to a nearby village to get more space for their money (they have two kids).

It is an older property so will check damp, walls etc. as suugested by buggy. Their furniture seems to fit in fine so I expect ours would too but will double check positions of radiators. There are no huge trees around and gardens are private - there is access in front of and behind the terrace, not across any of the plots.

narmada I will ask about PP for the loft and room split, thanks for that one. Walls are all painted, need a new lick of paint to tidy up but no obvious issues there. We have no kids yet but are TTC so plan this as our first family home. School catchment not an issue here.

I'm getting very excited just thinking about owning our own place!

X posted with blacklashes I am now compiling a list of things to ask. EA are conducting viewing. Oddly, when we went for first viewing we felt like it was a 'no', but on reflection this was due to the upstairs issues, so if they are relatively easy to solve it could be ideal for us.

Obviously, if you go as far as making an offer, have a survey done. The best you can afford especially if this is an old house (those walls can hide a multitude, believe me, we live in a Victorian terrace). It is an investment and will save you thousands in the long run if there are problems, you can then try to negotiate on the price. If the survey throws up damp/ rot problems do not be dismayed. If you love the house, work out the cost for rectifying this and use a reputable company that will provide you with paperwork and guarantees for when/if YOU decide to sell. Also if there has been work done by present owners, ask for paperwork/guarantees. And please don't feel intimidated. You may be a first time buyer, but your money is as good as anyone else's and let's face it, you'll prob never going to see these people again, so don't be shy in asking those awkward questions. Buyers expect them and it IS the biggest investment you are ever going to make!

Thanks, that's made me feel far more confident! I didn't know there were different 'grades' of survey, how can I ensure that I'm getting the best survey, not just the most expensive?

Soffitts are the bits of wood between the roof and the walls - the fascias are the bits on the front, the soffitts are the bits underneath. They are a pain and expensive to repaint so check they're in reasonable nick.

The most expensive survey is the best generally - they spend more time and actually climb up ladders and stuff. I don't tend to go for the most expensive - I go for the mid-range one.

Be warned that with an older house, surveys can look terrifying. There is very rarely a house that they will come back and tell you is in perfect condition.

Your mortgage company provides, one which is basically just 'is the house worth what you are paying for it ' I think. I am not a surveyor, but the think there is a middle one and then a full one that goes into everything. Do your research now. Whatever house you go for, you are going to need a survey. Go in and speak to a few in your area. Ask them to explain the different surveys to you, and what you get for your money And when you get the survey back, don't be afraid to go in and see them or call them and ask them to explain or clarify anything in the report. I remember getting ours back and feeling horrified and saying 'that's it, we are NOT buying that house!'. I rang the surveyor in a state of confusion and he reasurred me that the house was not a complete right off and went through and explained it to me. We DID end up buying the house...

Ah, ok thanks Patti, I will check those out too

Sorry to keep asking new questions but how much should I budget for a full survey? (It's a Victorian terrace) At the moment our 'fees and stuff' budget is £5000, is this wildly under what we may need (we should be getting a fee free mortgage)?

Should you bring your parents? That entirely depends on what your parents are like.

Next time I buy a place I'm definitely not buying till my Dad's seen it. He came with me to see only those flats I was serious about when I bought my first place, and he noticed all sorts of things I'd missed (extremely wonky outside walls, for example, obvious once he'd pointed it out but I'd completely missed it.)

About surveys, the bottom one is basically "yes, it's a house. Looks like it's worth the asking price".

For the middle one, they'll come and have a look, but not very hard. They will note things they can see without investigation - e.g. cracks / obvious damp etc. However they won't go out of their way to look at anything that requires any effort to get to, so can easily miss stuff.

The most expensive one is the only one that's a proper survey.

I gambled when getting my flat that the middle one would be OK, as I knew that the roof had been redone very recently and that was my main worry for a sudden expense. It proved OK - been there 10 years and nothing major has needed doing (yet!)

However we will be moving this summer and I think I will probably go for the full one this time round. Not sure yet - I may change my mind depending on the house.