Advice needed about RSJs and my new extension ceiling

[Fizzylemonade]

I need help and advice about my kitchen extension. We already have planning permission.

The current kitchen is 2.5m wide x 2.8m long. We have permission to extend lengthways so it will remain 2.5m wide but will be 5.8m long.

Does the RSJ have to protrude down from ceiling? Can it be either fully or part concealed (bedroom above)

Also the current kitchen ceiling is flat, and then the new extension ceiling could be sloped to match the new roof line, but I don't think I want that.

We are having velux windows in the roof as it is a north facing kitchen but we do get the sun due to having no neighbours to the west of us so was thinking of doing this

www.above-it-all.co.uk/pictures/tunnel_windows.jpg sorry best photo I could find. Basically having a flat ceiling with an area cut out

Has anyone else done this? Does it significantly reduce the light coming in?

Thanks if you have read this far and haven't fallen asleep

no idea on the velus etc,
but I had a small extension 18 mo ago and told the builder that if he couldn't put the rsj in the ceiling (ie not protruding) then I didn't want it done.
He huffed and puffed and said it would cost a bit more, but it was a small extension and the rsj was right in the middle and I just didn't want it coming down, so he did it like I wanted.
I also have a conservatory open to the kitchen, and for that we just took out the large window and below (so using the existing rsj above the window) but because it was two spaces it doesn't matter that the ceiling comes down in between, in my extension I felt it really would matter.

Thanks Chasing, I would rather pay a bit more to have it hidden mainly because it is the same room, just like I don't want a flat ceiling that then drops down with an RSJ then shoots straight back up and slopes back down

RSJ's can be recesssed into the ceiling but it does cost more and there is more disruption. I'd think again about a sloping ceiling - i've just had a new kitchen extension in which the ceiling follows the new roofline as a vaulted ceiling and it's fab! The feeling of space is incredible.

Oh Captain, my DH wants the sloping ceiling and I am very unsure about it.

If your extension is looking fab any chance you can pop a picture on your profile

I am usually a very decisive person, but this has me flummoxed.

We've just had a similar kitchen extension done at the back of our house and now have a gloriously huge kitchen (broke but happy!) We have the RSJs that hold up the back of the house dropping into the kitchen and it really really does look fine - I wasn't at all sure but it's quite unobtrusive now it's all plastered. they would have had to destroy the bathroom upstairs to recess them and I truly couldn't face that let alone afford it.
We have a flat roof with skylights - they are fantastic - we eat under one, and the island is under another - BUT BUT bUT, i am searching for home insurance and many many insurers are refusing to quote as we have roughly 30% flat roof now I had no idea this would be a consequence and am a bit .
Not sure if that helps!

Thanks pepperrabbit that does help. The problem with the RSJ dropping down into the kitchen is our ceiling height is only 2.3m and DH is 1.9m. We would have the RSJ boxed in but this does mean that DH would really feel the drop whereas me being a short arse wouldn't notice it as much.

Our roof will slope away from the house with 2 velux windows to give light.

I am hoping that as our kitchen is only 2.5m wide the RSJ shouldn't be very deep so we can hide it in the space between the kitchen ceiling and the floor above as much as possible.

I am wondering why they can't place the RSJ a few brick courses higher than the ceiling height, then the new ceiling carries on from the old one. The RSJ would in effect be hidden in the ceiling void.

We have 2.17m from the bottom of the (boxed and plastered) RSJ to the floor and DH is 1.87m (yes, I have just made him stand underneath it and measure it!) RSJ is 9" depth.
It's absolutely fine and DH doesn't even notice it.
Really it's all down to cost, we couldn't stretch to the cost of recessing and re-doing the bathroom, and I'm glad we didn't as of all the things I'd change about the build - that isn't one of them!
What i do wish we'd done, is have the lights in the old part of the kitchen on a different circuit to the lights in the new bit - with the light from the skylights it's lovely and bright in the extended bit even in dull weather, but the old part of the kitchen - now further from the window can seem a bit glum so we end up with ALL the lights on. Just a thought

Thank you again pepperrabbit, that is truly very helpful. I have previously put in kitchens at 2 previous houses but never had to extend.

Our plan is to have lighting on 2 circuits and lights under the cabinets on 2 circuits too just because of the sheer length of the kitchen.

Thank you to your accommodating DH for measuring himself under the RSJ

When they put your RSJ in, how much of a column of bricks did they leave to support it or could they just put it on the existing 2 skin bricks of your side wall? In my own kitchen plan that would completely ruin the run of units I had in mind

Glad to be helpful!
On the side that is the old outside corner we have a "nib" of 25cm, I have units in the recess this creates and the bin sits nicely in front of the double skin.
On the side that led into the dining cubby hole room they could sink it in to the wall so that is smooth/straight - i think the difference was the corner held more weight and they couldn't cut it back any further.

I've posted a photo - you can just see the RSJ in the top left..

that is really helpful thank you. I bet this isn't how you envisaged spending New Years Eve with a tape measure in your hand!

We are considering the builders doing the build and first fix electrics and plastering leaving us with a blank shell and then getting Ikea to fit all the kitchen.

The reason is, Ikea have won an award for their fitting, they are also within 10 miles so if anything goes wrong we can go and complain in person. Plus we will then know exactly what we are left with so they can plan around any obstacles.

Although that will mean we will rip out the old kitchen, we will save the cabinets and relocate them into the dining room whilst they plaster the kitchen, then put the old cabinets back in without fitting them.

I will try and post a pic of my current kitchen on my profile. The gap houses the dishwasher and then the other gap houses the fridge freezer. We have a "utility" which just houses the washing machine and tumble drier. It is more of a cupboard than a room.

Your kitchen looks lovely. The roof light looks fab.

Photo on my profile. House built in 1999, think designers were going for country kitchen feel complete with work top that looks like a teenager has vomited on it.

We have LOTS of visible RSJs

when the one that goes across the landing was put in I wept as it was SO obtrusive
but once plastered and the whole ceiling painted white and the light fitting dropped an inch to change the shadows even I do not see it any more

the two in my bedroom (that mark the old corner of the house) are a feature - again I love them now

and in the kitchen, we went for the room following the building shape up down and around. The poor plasterer nearly had a breakdown but the room looks fab - it has character and lots of nooks and crannies to pin ornaments to

the emergency concrete pillar that actually props up the back of the old bit of the house is now a feature arch

and more to the point, the big steels mean HUGE open spaces under them
which makes the new room feel enormous even with the odd shaped ceiling

talkinpeace I'm thrilled with the space we have now too, a large open plan kitchen and family space where we spend most of our time. I love the idea of an emergency concrete pillar - bet it wasn't fun at the time though
I too cried at the RSJs upstairs! I had no idea they were going to be there - i just hadn't understood the plans i guess, and none of them were 3D so until they physically appeared.....
DS2 has bunting along his, DD has a plan involving "pink" . I've got over it tbh. We too had all the odd shapes kept, so the old outside stair window is a recess in DS1's room and he's got books in it. The builder thought we were mad and kept trying to box stuff across/along.
Will you have a functioing kitchen during your build fizzy?

fizzy
the RSJ cannot go in the ceiling space as it is holding the ceiling up
and definitely go for sloping ceilings - they look fab and those bits of height make the whole ceiling feel higher

pepper
the bit of wall that was planned to support the RSJs had to be held up with ACROs once we had taken down the outer skin!
NOT at ALL fun at the time

I honestly cannot believe that people have nothing better to do than reply to my inane questions about RSJs! but I am incredibly grateful

I am glad to hear that the RSj isn't really an issue, and I think I will end up going for the sloping ceiling. At the end of the day I will get an amazing kitchen.

The plans are that we will extend to the rear of the house so if you look at my profile there is a pic on there of my current kitchen taken the day we moved in hence why it is empty.

The builders should be able to build the brickwork and then we will remove the oven unit into the dining room along with the fridge freezer. You can see we don't have many units to start with.

As there will be plumbing put in for the dishwasher and sink (we are basically moving the back wall out by 3m) we will just live without the dishwasher and the sink for a week. Been there, done that.

Once it is all plastered up we will move any surviving existing units back into the kitchen and have it free standing. I can do any prep work on the dining table as I will have no worktop by then.

At some point I will have been to Ikea and sorted the kitchen. It is all planned out already. I am OCD organised and I can cope without a kitchen for a few weeks.

Truly, thank you for all the input. I appreciate it.

Fizzylemonade we have recently done a kitchen extension incorporating a flat roof.To add height we put in a very large victorian rooflight centrally.For various reasons our old kitchen ceiling was very high,and our new extension was a lot lower.We needed to give an impression of height and space.It has worked extremely well and brings in a tremendous amount of light.
Google Reflex Rooflights to get some ideas and also the weekend supplements have lots of pictures of rooms with rooflights.

Thanks teta, those roof lights look amazing. I know it is all just nerves with us due to the sheer cost of this extension. We converted a double garage into a playroom when we first moved in and this extension is twice as much.

It is just a large sum of money that we are saving and we just want to get it perfect.