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Original poster

I am so very tempted by a house, please slap me very hard and tell me it's not worth it

101 replies

BranIsLonelyThisChristmas · 21/12/2011 13:04

It's this house.

Here's the back story. When we moved back to Ireland in summer 2010 the house in the link is in one of the areas I was hoping to live in, but there wasn't anything for sale that suited our needs. We chose not to rent for a while because I didn't want to have to move again within a year, and we accepted that we would almost certainly pay more for doing this as Dubin has a very rapidly plummeting property market. The house we have is fine, but is has lots and lots of compromises like the layout not quite suiting us and the garden being a little too small, location not quite what we wanted, also there are only two bathrooms for five bedrooms. Just niggly things, and I am aware that I am being totally annoying and princessey when so many families are in such dire straits at the moment.

So, anyway, here is this house. We could afford to buy it, but it would cost at least as much again to renovate and it would be trickier to raise the money for that as the Irish banks are simply not lending at the moment. We would have to live in the house we are currently in while the new house is being renovated and if we were to put this one on the market now it would probably have lost about 10-15% since we bought it last year. Anyway I'm very reluctant to move into rented while we're renovating and then move again.

One possibility would be to buy it but not start renovations for another 4 years, this would give us time to raise the money and would also suit us better to move there when DS goes to secondary school as it is close to where he will be going. I suppose the house is in such a bad state that it can't get significantly worse, but I still think that might be madness.

Lastly, DH has no time at all so I would be in charge of all the work and I'm not really sure that I'm the type to cope with so much stress. On the other hand we could get exactly the house that we want, plus we could put a little bungalow where the out buildings currently are. I don't think my father will live that much longer as he is very ill, and my mother will be left alone in a semi-rural location and it would be good if there was the option for her to be near us if needed. She doesn't live that far from this location, but just up a difficult access mountain road, so if she had to live in this location for a while it would be fine as lots of her friends are close by.

Right, do what you can to talk me out of it please.

OP posts:
Hassledge · 21/12/2011 13:09

Well it has a whole heap of potential but I can't get my head around the price - I thought nothing was moving and people were basically giving property away? How much room for negotiation, do you think?
Also - part of the house is in an architectural conservation area. My SS bought a house in Blackrock recently which had something similar (and was similarly dilapitated) and she had nightmarish problems getting permission for what she wanted to do.

OliNIvy · 21/12/2011 13:11

I think you'd be crazy to buy it.

thereinmadnesslies · 21/12/2011 13:15

It's fabulous. You should go for it, accept that you will have a few years of stress and stretched finances, but at the end of it you will have the most amazing family home

Steth · 21/12/2011 13:16

Beautiful house but expect to add another 150k to get it up to scratch. Fire damage hmmm you'll need to remove all floors / ceilings. Hope you have good builders in mind

Original poster
BranIsLonelyThisChristmas · 21/12/2011 13:27

I think a fair bit of room for negotiation, it's a receiver's sale so presumably it's better for them to take what they can get rather than wait for ages. Things are selling if they are priced correctly, but there are very few buyers for renovation project, which puts us in a strong position. Where we are currently living (Foxrock) houses are actually selling quite quickly, albeit for about 40% of what they were getting four years ago.

There is only a conservation thingy on the outside and I would be happy to keep the gates and front elevation of the house as it currently is. My brother is almost finished doing up a Georgian house in Monkstown what had been flats and bedsits (13 of them I think) and he didn't have much trouble with the conservation lady. Although he was aiming for Georgian style in his renovation, they did let him put in double glazing and other modern bits so long as it looks original. If planning had originally allowed for a new block of 12 flats I guess a small bungalow that looks like the original outbuildings might squeeze past.

For comparison here is a reasonably priced terraced house nearby, and here is a house across the road that has been on the market from just before the crash, I think they started off asking about ?4 mill. It has less land and it hideous, but would probably sell quickly at about ?1.6 mill.

OP posts:
Original poster
BranIsLonelyThisChristmas · 21/12/2011 13:29

Steth - I was actually thinking another ?600,000 at least for renovation. I'm basically assuming a full re-build with the added complication of keeping the facade.

OP posts:
OldLadyKnowsSantaClaus · 21/12/2011 13:31

It has fantastic potential, but I'd be wary of leaving it empty with the levels of vandalism that have already happened. Is that smoke damage upstairs?

mumblechum1 · 21/12/2011 13:32

I can absolutely see why you love it, I bought something similar about 25 yrs ago without the fire damage and vandalism and it was a labour of love to restore it but my first dh and I ended up getting divorced, mainly because of teh stress of the house.

Only take this on if you have at least £350k to spend, and I don't mean borrow!

And it's awfully close to a school - the noise at breaktimes will be horrendous"

DelGirlsRingAreYouListening · 21/12/2011 13:36

at first glance I thought no but seeing the local market, I would go for it after getting initial estimates. Would your brother do the renovation? I'd be tempted to offer 450!

ShowOfHands · 21/12/2011 13:37

Buy it.

I'd take a known and trusted builder/surveyor/architect round first and see what actually needs doing but gawd, what a fab project.

LoveInASnowyClimate · 21/12/2011 13:39

I think you should make an offer - what an amazing project and how lovely to bring the house back to life.

ZZZenAgain · 21/12/2011 13:39

I wouldn't have the energy to tackle all the work that needs to be done, planning, organising and overseeing it, dealing with builders etc. It is more than I would personally be prepared to do

LoveInASnowyClimate · 21/12/2011 13:40

Do you work or can you spend a lot of time project managing?

mumblechum1 · 21/12/2011 13:41

It would be a full time job to project manage unless you outsourced that.

Original poster
BranIsLonelyThisChristmas · 21/12/2011 13:47

My brother wouldn't do the renovation, but he is wonderful for advice and knowledge and has great building contacts.

The noise from the school might be an issue, but primary school days are short in Ireland so they would all go home at about 2 or 2.30. Ironically that is the school that I had initially wanted the DC to go to, but we weren't in the parish. I am immensely happy with the school that DS now goes to, and DD will start in Sept, so I would keep them there. It's only in the next parish, so it would be a 15-20 min drive instead of the current 8 minute drive. It suit us better to move just before DS starts secondary school though as I would drive past the secondary school on the way to DD's primary school. Where we are currently living it's going to be quite logistically tricky to get them both to different schools.

OP posts:
Original poster
BranIsLonelyThisChristmas · 21/12/2011 16:02

A funny thing happened on the school run. I was chatting to my friend about this house and she said that she has often noticed that I refer to where I live as "the current house" and never "my house" or "my home", and it's true that this house doesn't really feel like home, even after 15 quite pleasant months living here. We bought this house because it was the best of the options available to us and not because it had the x-factor. I never felt the desire to make it mine that I felt for our flat in London (the previous place we lived).

OP posts:
HollyGhost · 21/12/2011 16:10

That is a project and a half, if you do buy it, have this thread deleted.

Before you put an offer in, consider how you would go about finding a reputable builder to do the massive amount of work you have in mind. I would think that this one could be a job for a professional project manager.

Original poster
BranIsLonelyThisChristmas · 21/12/2011 16:32

Yes, would definitely have this thread deleted if I do buy it. But I had to link to it to get opinions.

There hasn't been enough slapping and getting me to see sense. I might run this past my Mum and my brother, I'm sure their derisory laughter will put me off. Grin

I showed it to DH and he would definitely rather live in that area, especially with a bigger garden than where we live now. He doesn't drive, and although we chose our current location for ease of access to the tram, that location would be better for all sorts of things. It would be a much shorter tram journey into town and it's walking distance to a big shopping centre with a cinema. He wasn't put off by the condition (but then he wouldn't really be involved at all in the renovation).

I would definitely throw money at professional people, have a project manager etc. I'm pretty good at making decisions and sticking to them (as I understand it changing your mind adds hugely to the cost and timing of work like this). I don't work so do have time, but I wouldn't want to actually manage any of this myself as I don't have the knowledge necessary.

OP posts:
HollyGhost · 21/12/2011 16:42

It has fantastic potential as a family home Xmas Smile

you might want to run it past a mortgage advisor, unless you have sufficient cash for renovations - as I understand it it is extremely difficult to get finance for the that in the current climate.

It is difficult to understand how it would make financial sense to buy it and leave it derelict for four years, while raising money, as you would have the associated liability, and probably two mortgages.

EtInTerraPax · 21/12/2011 16:48

Gosh- I couldn't take on that amount of work!

...and you've only just moved!

Original poster
BranIsLonelyThisChristmas · 21/12/2011 16:58

We wouldn't need a mortgage to buy it, and we don't have a mortgage on this house, but we would need to organise money for the renovation. We have some other assets we could sell, or we could perhaps raise a mortgage on the house that we live in now to be paid off when we sell it. I wouldn't want to start the renovations until we were completely ready to see it through. As it is now it probably can't get any more derelict, especially as I suspect that we would take it all down except the front facade and rebuild it. I also think it will take a surprisingly long time to get plans finalised and approved by the planning office.

OP posts:
HollyGhost · 21/12/2011 17:02

Friends in a similar situation were advised that the simplest and cheapest way of raising finance was to take out a mortgage on the new property, and use that money for renovation as raising finance for the purpose is now very difficult.

But it should not be impossible for you, either way. And I suspect that it being such a wreck will make it a lot less complicated, as you will effectively be starting from scratch rather than having constant surprises as you renovate.

pootlebug · 21/12/2011 17:58

My first thought on opening your link was you.must.be.frigging.joking. But actually having read your posts I'm not so sure - if you can afford for someone else to project manage the whole thing etc. and to live elsewhere until it's all done it sounds much more achievable. So it really comes down to the finances - it sounds like it is affordable, but I guess it is hard to adjust what is 'reasonable' price-wise in the current market.

MrsLL2B · 21/12/2011 20:15

Wow it is amazing, if you can afford to live elsewhere and have the time to do it all up I say go for it! I was actually shocked by how cheap it is...I am Irish living in England and am aware of how expensive that would have been a few years ago!!

Good luck, hope it works out for you.

gobblygook · 21/12/2011 20:26

it has such character, it looks wonderful

if you can afford it, do it. Why not?