Total renovation - too much of a headache?

[dobeessneeze]

We're going back for a second viewing on a house this week. From the viewings we've had so far, it's become clear that to get the type of place we want, in the area we want, our budget will only stretch to a bit of a fixer-upper. However, I suspect that this one is more in the 'total wreck' category.

It'll be our second house we've owned, but our first family home, and once it's done, I can see it being a really really lovely home, where we could stay for the next 20 years. The asking price is within our budget with a bit left over to renovate, but I'm not sure whether the amount of work needed will take it totally off the scale for us. And I don't want to end up getting in over our heads and ending up taking on much more than we bargained for.

At first glance it needs:
New windows
Rewiring
New kitchen
Bathroom
New floors
Funny old electric fires taken out and proper fireplaces put back in
Redecoration throughout

I'd also like to:
Do a 2-storey extension
Knock through some internal walls
Move the bathroom and add an ensuite
Repaint the outside (it's currently salmon pink!)
Move the staircase, but I'm not sure if this is even possible?
Move the front door (possibly to the extension)

And if we won the lottery, I'd add another single storey extension with a utility room and sun room at the back.

If we decide to make an offer, we will get a full structural survey, but just as a first impression, what sort of budget does that sound like? At the asking price, we'd have about £25k left over for renovations, but would try and knock the seller down a bit if it was going to be more like £50 or £60k, or even more than that (I've never done this before so no idea how much we're talking). How much of the list above could we do for £25k? We're in the south west, so not talking London prices or anything.

Also - it's Mundic Block, grade A. Does anyone how that is likely to affect it's structural soundness/value long term?

And finally - we have a 5 month old DD and don't want to spend the first years of her life huddled under a blanket in the garden, eating beans from the tin and bitterly regretting getting involved with a beast of a house. Does anyone have any other good advice on how we can keep this manageable and make sure that it doesn't sap all our time/money/will to live?

Thanks!

Honest opinion? Don't do it - your budget is way too low, you will be miserable and skint and you will live in an unfinished house because you will not have the budget to finish.

I agree, the scale of the work would put me off, especially as you have a baby who will be a toddler by the time you get started - let alone the money involved.

Your budget wont stretch to a total renovation - we redid our house (doing similar to what you want to do) and had to move out for 7 months and it cost way over 100k (but am in London). Go for somewhere thta doesnt need as much work.

Thanks. It's good to have some other opinions as DP and I are at two extremes of the scale. He automatically thinks everything will always go wrong all the time and I always tend to think everything will be fine and it never even occurs to me that I can't do something.

So given that everything we've looked at so far needs at least some work doing (perhaps knocking through a wall or two, opening up fireplaces and redecorating), should we be revising our ideas about the size/location of the place we want?

Out of interest - what sort of budget would be enough to do that type of work?

By looking at your list, I would imagine you could get either kitchen, bathroom or windows done, along with rewiring. And that is about it.

Full scale renovation and knocking through walls would be in the region of 100.000, not including your 2 storey extension.

You'll need much more money to do all that, probably more like £75K, we've done a similar renovation but not as big and we have spent the best part of £60K. It has also been incredibly stressful, and I feel I've neglected my kids this year, just doing the bare minimum with them, ie feeding them as 'The House' took up all mine and DH time. My kids are 10 and it has been bad, I definitely wouldn't want to do that with a baby and feel like I missed their early years.

Sorry x-posts dinky. 100k and 7 months? Wow.

Yep, I'm another in the don't do it camp I'm afraid. I wrote a post earlier and deleted it because it sounded so negative.

To give you an idea of costs, I did a new kitchen, bathroom and oak flooring laid on decent concrete floors in a 2 bedroom flat and that cost £15k. The floors were around £5k of that.

You really can't live in a house that needs that amount of work and your budget is far too small. I agree that you're looking at at around 100k to do everything on your list. A single storey extension alone will be around 20-30k

I wouldn't do it unless we had somewhere else to live while work was being done. The most we've done is a loft conversion with a 2month old and a toddler and i nearly lost the plot. never ever again. dh has been banned from any more projects and diy! and we had fantastic builders who turned up on time every day, nothing went wrong until the last bit when other contractors had to get involved.

anticipate things going wrong, going over budget and being late with every single thing that needs doing. could you really cope with all of it on your own with a baby/toddler to look after?

we have considered it with a house that didn't need as much renovation and could be lived in for a few years before we start work.

The other possibility would be to get it up to scratch in the short-term, with a cheap once over decoration and the wiring/windows, and then do the rest in a few years? It's definitely habitable in the short term and we'll probably have a bit more money in about 5 years time. Would this be a better idea than buying somewhere else that has a limited life span and then having to move again in a few years? I'm fed up with moving!

Do a viewing with a builder, and ask for an estimate!

And perhaps revising my list of stuff that needs done? Maybe just the essentials list, plus a single-storey extension?

All your posts are definitely making me realise how much I like this house! Hopefully DP will knock some sense into me when we go to view it.

No way. I had a kitchen and bathroom done when my DS was about your DD's age and I really felt like I had no home. It was horrible.

Dobe - once you open up a building you can find a whole load of other stuff that needs doing - and urgently. So our original budget was a lot less than what we ended up paying.

If its just superficial stuff (new kitchen, bathroom, fireplaces and windows) then go for it - anything more I'd say have a word or two with some builders first to get an idea of costs - and contingency costs - before you commit!

Conservatories are often cheaper than full extensions.

Ours were 4m x 5m, had one full brick wall (party wall) with 40 cm high windows on top of brick wall before the pitch of the roof. We paid 18k in total. This was 6 years ago. London prices.

You can do a nice kitchen on a budget, if you chose Ikea, for example. I know plenty of people have fab kitchens from Ikea. And if you are minimalist in your bathrooms. But I would advice tiles both on floor and wall around bathroom fixtures, for durability.

In July we bought a house we loved but had been tenanted for 15 years and was in crap condition. It needed everything doing - rewiring, plumbing, kitchen, bathroom, total replastering, plus we had walls knocked down and some structural stuff like chimney removals.

We chose good builders because my DS was 6 months and we rented a flat - I wouldn't even have considered living there or having very cheap builders who were a nightmare because I work and also didn't want to compromise my time with DS. Yet it's still been:

A. V stressful at times - some things are just not straightforward
B. Constant decisions that has taken over our life
C. Expensive - we'll end up spending the good part of £70K with VAT, but admittedly we've gone for nice things
D. An added pressure in the first year of our baby's life

I don't think our DS has been compromised as we don't live there amongst it and I don't take him there - my DH does the site visits and I go in the evening sometimes when DS is asleep. I was very clear to my DH if we do it, I don't want to get involved in any of the work, my DS comes first. Only two or three days at the weekend have we taken off for a few hours without DS to look at stuff. Otherwise we've done it online at night.

But it's a total life/time stealer, a money pit and a very challenging place to put you and your DH at a time when you're probably under baby pressure.

I have done similar in the past but in 2 different houses. First one, cheap DIY job, total cost for whole house around £10K.
Second one, extension, kitchen, bathroom etc £100K. Awful experience, I do not reccommend it, esp with a baby.
Sounds like you need at least £100K, without the sun room etc. If the numbers don't stack up... at the moment I wouldn't I'm afraid...

Isn't mundic block the thing that they say is unmortgageable on Homes Under The Hammer?

Hi,
Is it possible to live in the house as it is? If you want to live there long term you could do things a bit at a time. Forget about the structural stuff and extensions for now and just rewire before you move in and put in cheap kitchen and bathroom and paint all white for clean, fresh look!

We've just rewired our house (victorian, 4 bed semi) and it cost about £5-6k. What new floors do you need? Are there floorboards that could be sanded or painted? How bad are the windows? Do they need replacing immediately? New windows can be expensive especially if wood. UPVC are cheaper but not sure how much for a whole house. What about plumbing? Does it need a new boiler and re-plumbing? If so that could be another £5-6k. So, I think for £25k you could do the essentials. I think if it's the perfect house and you don't mind waiting a few years to do non essential things then it could be worth it!

agree with most of the other posters that you're looking at 75-100k. we did up a victorian house needing not quite as much work as that, started just before ds2 was born, took 18 months and the whole thing was a complete nightmare, i'd never do it again, every bit of building/decoration work uncovered yet more problems.

also isn't the mundic block a bit of an issue? could make it very difficult to sell on in future if it deteriorates?

I think you could do your first basics lists without the extension for £30 but that would be an ikea kitchen and bathroom (which can be nice!)

But mumdic block sounds like it may be a major problem that nay put me off...

We are about to do a very similar project and are looking at 60-70k with extension.. With 2 children under the age of 4. Eek.

Yes, it's certainly habitable, and quite a nice size as it is (I was just getting carried away with the rest), and I even reckon we could squeeze another 5 years out of the kitchen. The main things would be the windows and the wiring I think, though would want a survey to check. I may not last very long with the funny fires, and would like to put in proper fireplaces/woodburners sooner rather than later, but could make do with the kitchen as it is, to have fireplace money.

The mundic is my big question mark too. I'm not sure whether once something has been graded as A, whether it may still deteriorate over time, which would obviously be a problem long-term. If we could know for sure that it was going to be ok, then I'd be happy to take our time on the rest of it.

So please, pray, tell me, did you do it Dobeesneeze. We are just about to buy a house in cornwall that is mundic block, and everyone is against it, but we can see the massive potential it has. For the money we have, we can not afford much more than a doer upper, cannot get a mortgage now as we are nearing retirement, but both feel we have tons of life in us still, plus hubby used to be a builder when he was much younger and can do this project slowly. I would love to know if y ou actually did it, and how you got on?