Landlords - any experience of retaining part of the deposit?

[Murtette]

We became accidental landlords 18mo ago when DP's job moved and we couldn't sell our house. We've had the same tenants in for the entire time. They moved out last week and I went to inspect the property today (the management agents had already signed the tenants out). There's a lot of wear & tear (possibly beyond what constitutes "fair" but I realise different people have different standards and that I'm probably a bit close to it given we used to live there). However its also clear that they've blue-tacked pictures to the wall (bits of poster and/or blue tack attached to wall or bits of paint and lining paper missing) in the two bedrooms and reception room and that a bike has been kept in the hall way (handle bar, tyre and pedal marks on the hall wall) both of which are a direct breach of the lease.

The management agent agree that the bedrooms, reception room and hallway should be repainted before new tenants move in but have told me I can only reclaim half of the "standard" cost from the tenants as the Tenant Deposit Scheme take the view that properties will be re-decorated every three years anyway. Is that true? And does it apply even if the damage is a direct breach of the lease? If it was just fair wear & tear, I would expect to be able to re-let it without re-decorating but, due to all of these marks & damage, it needs re-decorating now. The entire property was re-painted the week before the tenants moved in so the damage/marks have definitely been caused by them.

Any advice would be appreciated! The managing agents have been useless throughout (for example, "forgetting" to do an inventory!) so I'm not sure I entirely trust them.

Oh, and if anyone is thinking "but where else where they going to keep their bike", there is a separate bike shed at the rear of the property.

I think you need to step back and stop seeing this house as your old home, it's now a commercial business and people are going to do a bit of damage to it, blue tack and paint is nothing compared to flooding the entire downstairs ruining the carpets and taking chunks out the plaster we had to endure and we still only got to help half the deposit to put things right.
You'll also need to prove it was in very good repair ie receipts for the painting when they moved in otherwise you've got 0 chance of keeping any of it.

Oh and I would forget to pay the management company as the inventory is extremely important document you might need to rely on in court one day. Completely unacceptable of them.

Without an inventory, I think it will be extremely difficult to claim anything at all.

This is a hard lesson for you Murtette but as the others have said an inventory is key. Did you register the deposit for protection yourself or did the agent do it for you?

I would be looking to hold the agents responsible if you are not able to retain part deposit because of their negligence (ie not carrying out inventory if they were supposed to etc).

Did you take any pictures of the property after decoration and before tenants moved in? I don't know how strict the rules are regarding what will be accepted as evidence of condition of property but I would also make enquiries about this.

Thanks for your advice. Naively, I presumed that as the management agreement said that the agents would arrange for an inventory to be done, they would actually do it. As the tenants moved in the same week that DD was born, I never double checked to see if they'd done it. I don't have any photos of what it looked like post-decoration but do have the receipt which specifies that walls, ceilings & woodwork were painted in all rooms and the agents looked around immediately after it had been done as, when I went and checked the work, they met me there.

Mamotomany - you sound as though you had a complete nightmare with your property. I hope your subsequent tenants have been better.

Not a landlord but from the other side of the fence.

The tenant deposit scheme will look to avoid betterment. Charging the tenants the full cost of the repainting after 18 months would be betterment as you would have newly painted walls rather than 18 month old walls, working on the basis that paintwork would only have an expected lifespan of 3 years then 50% seems fair. I also think that if the tenants will agree to 50% that might be better than you will get if it went to arbitration and you lack a valid inventory.

Are you claiming the tax allowance against the rental income for fair wear and tear?

If you are claiming 10% wear and tear in your tax return and have no inventory you have no way of proving the condition of the property when these people moved it. That being the case I believe the tenant should have their deposit returned (even though they caused the above) and make a claim against the agent for not doing an inventory.

You need to tell the tenancy dispute service that the management failed to supply an inventory, and lodge a claim against them.

You need to get the receipt from the repainting and evidnece of condtion before and after.

It MUST be an open and shut case re: duty of care by the agent?

But basically, the tds schemes are not just for claims against tenants/landlords. You can claim against the agent too.

It's all free.

Tyler - that's a really interesting point you make about betterment and makes complete sense. We're living in rented at the moment and I certainly wouldn't want to feel our landlord was going to make a profit out of us. I feel a bit stuck at the moment as the tenants are refusing to "pay" anything and, of course, I don't have a particularly strong case due to the lack of inventory.

Call the tenancy deposit scheme, they will tell you what to do. They are brilliant.

I think I'm right. Call the tds.

MN does solve all problems! I'll call the TDS tomorrow. And you're right, I did do the wear & tear tax deduction so have obviously recovered part of my "loss" through that.

Not sure having an inventory actually helps anyway. We had tenants who left after 6 months. Hallway was redecorated before they moved in and had to be done again after they left as it was in such a state and the inventory company recommended 50% only as 'reasonable wear and tear given they had children' which I knew! The thing was, the children moved out after 3 months. Heaven knows what they were doing to do so much damage. We'd lived there with one and then two children and not done as much damage in 3 years.

Irony was I only accepted a family with children because they well well settled in the area and therefore likely to be a longer term tenancy.

I've been a BTL landlord for over ten years and I think blu tac marks and a bike in the hall are minor. I personally wouldn't withold part of a deposit for that.

On a practical note, get some blu tac and roll it over where they had the pictures on the wall. For the bike marks, try rubbing the wall with a pencil rubber - gets most marks off. Then you can wash the wall down.

I think on balance, that's reasonable wear and tear after 18 months. Oh, and use a different agent next time!

You may well not have to redecorate. Ask the agent to show it to potential tenants with the promise of redecoration before they move in. I've done this many times, especially when replacing carpets. Many tenants don't want it newly redecorated as they don't want to be held responsible for wear and tear themselves. They're often the best tenants.