Staff Redundancies as a result of VAT on schools

[BarleyMcGrew]

Can anyone tell me if schools are starting to make redundancies as a result of VAT? As in, actually cutting staff?

I know of two schools that have run this process supposedly because of VAT but they actually just ended up hiring everyone back but on less good terms.and conditions. Everyone kept a job, even if it wasn’t on as good pay/hours as before.

Cuts across the Sciences?! That seem counterproductive.

https://schoolsweek.co.uk/harris-blames-unfunded-pay-rises-as-it-plans-redundancies/

https://schoolsweek.co.uk/schools-warn-of-staff-cuts-as-reeves-snubs-sector/

Unfortunately, teacher redundancies are also happening in the state sector. There are lots more academies considering staff cuts as well. A quick google suggests this is a country wide problem, with education leaders blaming the funding position.

Well said! Why any government would go out if its way to damage an industry is beyond me. It is particularly galling to see how quickly they jumped in to help the steel industry (again). I’m glad they did because, you know, people’s lives, but to actually make a point of damaging an industry that was actually managing to get by and saving the country money by existing, is incredibly frustrating. As long as Keir appeased the left of his party though…

As long as Keir appeased the left of his party though…

Labour was elected with a large majority on a manifesto that included this policy. Fine to disagree with it but I don’t think there’s much point in suggesting only a small group of especially left wing folks support it.

They only won a majority because of the way our electoral system works. Labour received just 33% of the vote share, which is lower than any post war government. 2 in 3 voters did not vote for them, presumably because they disagreed with their policies. Yes, they have a large majority, but let’s not pretend that this means the majority voted for them. They didn’t.

Oh, come on. People voted for ‘not the Tories’. This was not a ‘WOW’ pledge of the Labour manifesto. As is repeatedly mentioned on these threads, most people don’t give two hoots about independent schools, the children in them, the parents who pay for them and those who work in them.

Those of us who are in the sector (in whatever capacity) are being affected. Those effects are negative. The government of our own country has chased a stupid policy which is damaging an industry which provided significant benefits to the country’s economy and provided employment (in addition to educating children!). The comments about redundancies in the state sector would suggest the money made isn’t trickling to where it was stated it would go either.

Basically, it highlights Labour spite and incompetency. This, combined with ‘not the Tories’ would suggest Reform are going to do very well at the next General Election. Well done, Labour,

Sure… but equally, because of the way our electoral system works, there’s no way of knowing what vote share they would have got in another system. I wanted a Labour government but voted Lib Dem, as the best chance of getting the local Tory out (which happened).

You can’t acknowledge one thing about the current system without acknowledging the other.

Anyway, they have a large parliamentary majority, which gives them legitimacy to implement their manifesto. Just as - regrettably, in my mind, but that’s democracy - the Tories did in late 2019.

ETA this was answering @Another76543

You cannot possibly say that Labour’s policies have been popular. Even with a different electoral system, I doubt very much that their vote share would increase. There are so many voters disillusioned with this government.

I’m not speculating about the next election, I’m talking about the current government.

It was elected under FPTP and the vote share (for every party) would have reflected tactical voting to achieve what was many people’s GTTO goal.

The coalition government had a half arsed stab at proposing a system of proportional representation and it didn’t go through. So there’s little point considering other systems - this is the one we have lived in for years and will continue to live in.

We also live in a system where the largest party has been and likely will be Labour or conservatives. Possibly Reform continue to make advances to the extent that that isn’t the case, but I can’t see that happening quickly. Either might have their manifesto modified by coalition, but would still be implementing the majority of it.

Labour have a democratic mandate for their manifesto that doesn’t simply come from a group of left wingers, is all I am saying, and I have now said it.

Have a great day.

The fact remains that Labour received a relatively small share of the vote (barely any more than they received in the previous election, which they lost). To suggest that their parliamentary majority shows that the majority of voters agree with their policies is disingenuous.

It is good thaf I didn’t say that then, isn’t it?

To quote myself - and I am hiding the thread after this, because it’s too nice a day to waste on those wilfully misunderstanding:

Labour was elected with a large majority on a manifesto that included this policy. Fine to disagree with it but I don’t think there’s much point in suggesting only a small group of especially left wing folks support it.

You take care now.

Just in case you do peep at Mumsnet when you come in for a drink, would you accept that this policy hasn’t worked out well? I wouldn’t take any glee in supporting a policy which is affecting people’s livelihoods and I can’t get my head around why anyone would, so I’m still keen to hear supporters’ reasons.

That’s without any need to discuss why anyone would support a policy which deliberately disrupts children, which is so odd, I don’t need to hear any justification.

i think it isn’t clear whether it is the VAT policy that is having the effect on staff redundancies, or whether it is National Insurance.

Why is this relevant to this thread?

Because the broader picture IS relevant surely? Unpicking what is as a direct result of VAT and what the result of a punishing economic environment ISN’T straightforward.

I'm support staff in a pre prep,on a zero hours contract (teaching assistant), I've had 3 days work there since September! Last year they were calling me in practically every week, I know from other staff there that they desperately need me, but aren't allowed to call in any support staff. Luckily I'm also a trained invigilator so have lots of work at the moment.

It is the triple whammy of: NI, increased NMW + increased business rates along with falling rolls due to VAT

School #1 has made several redundant. Lots of crying. As part of this, a language was removed as an offering.

School #2 is undergoing voluntary redundancy. So they’ll lose people who are able to capitalise on that - people who were thinking of going anyway. Either to another school or retiring or to private tutoring. A (very competent and respected) teacher who’d just had a baby has just taken voluntary and will tutor privately instead.

Both are struggling. Each department is stretched thinly and the staff are a revolving door. Lots of unstaffed cover lessons. The rot is really setting in.

This is all from staff POV. My own kids are grown up

All this will do is increase the numbers doing state+tutoring (and pretending they are disadvantaged). It won’t actually tackle inequality. The sharp elbowed always elbow their way to what they want. Mummy and daddy went to Oxbridge and earn ££££££, have me tutored, but little me, I’m a “disadvantaged state school applicant”. And it’s lapped right up. And the people who are actually disadvantaged remain disadvantaged.

.

The broader picture was meant to be VAT funds state, instead it’s damaging a sector and not even helping state.

I think more the tax raised will be plowed into state school so the influx of private students don’t stress an already stretched system? VAT on private schools represents a tiny proportion of the cost of the state education doesn’t it?

Yes. Some local private schools have or are planning on shutting soon. Our own school staff have been informed that if you are academic staff your position will be protected and not lost even if someone leaves their post. However any other form of support staff from the ground up should be aware that if someone should leave, the position will not be filled, work will be expected to be absorbed amongst any remaining staff. This policy is starting to cause chaos with running the school and as a lot of back room staff are very discouraged and looking to move on, the chaos will only escalate. Non of us are any longer prepared to go the extra mile/pick up overtime etc.

What tax raised???
It was never hypothecated for state schools and in any case, £0 doesn't pay for much!!

Can I ask which language @Elnaan ?

I don’t think tutoring can replace what is being provided at private schools - no-one has their DC tutored in pottery or any/all of the valuable sport offerings. I guess it is here that schools will concentrate. The state sector just cannot provide the breadth of extra-curricular.

I am in a state school and am taking voluntary redundancy. I can access my pension early as a result of it. So many state schools in Wales are haemorrhaging staff due to redundancy/shit budgets.
a local private school is also closing. Has been opened for decades. Around 75 yrs that I know of. Sad times.