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Primary education

Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

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Original poster

constant battles on the subject of private versus state education, so why didnt anyone mention this before?

153 replies

vvvodka · 09/10/2009 13:05

dc just been put into private school. and they do games. lots and lots and lots and lots of games. and i dont have to scout around for decent footie, or karate or whatever, they just do it all at the school, coz the school organises it. he now does about six hundred percent more sport than he ever did in his ofsted outsdanding state school.

and he meets a bigger variety of people. more skin colours, more accents, more cultures, just more variety of everything. not just in his school, but also in the schools that they go off to play matches against and that come to their school to play matches with. in dc1's entire seven year career at the outstanding state primary, he never once met another childf rom another school in an event organised by the school.

so far, i am very very pleased with it. i just am surprised that no one ever mentioned it on the state versus private threads on here. or maybe they did, and i had tuned out at this point? or is ofsted fibbing about that particular state school being outstanding?

OP posts:

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MintyCane · 09/10/2009 18:45

LOL Seeker

Miggsie · 09/10/2009 18:50

The private schools are more ethnically mixed if they are single sex, due to the number of ethnic cultures that have a tradition of educating boys and girls separately.

My friend's boys private school: 50% asian.

My middle class white area state school: very little Asian, quite a few European parents though.

Local girl's schools private and state: very high Asian and Chinese quotient.

Strangely the Catholic girls school has a lot of Catholics.

Does this actually prove anything?

wicked · 09/10/2009 18:51

My DD is now in Year 8, but when she was in primary, she never played netball. It wasn't offered at all, even though it is supposedly on the national curriculum.

Her PE lessons were basically all 'keep fit' - no games at all.

foxinsocks · 09/10/2009 18:52

I imagine it was mentioned on a thread somewhere probably on post 568 out of 2000 which is the way these threads go

TheMysticMasseuse · 09/10/2009 18:56

it gets mentioned all the time. of course private schools offer more "services", because you pay for them.

but the more mixed backgrounds... please. that too gets mentioned all the time, and it's all posturing.

Elibean · 09/10/2009 19:09

seeker

Elibean · 09/10/2009 19:10

why is sport, and lots of it, so important? Some, yes, but lots?

MintyCane · 09/10/2009 19:20

Sport is important because it turns you into a tough nut who is happy to stamp on peoples faces to get what you want in life. Therfore, it can be very helpful for being a lawyer for example. It also gives you somthing to talk about at dinner parties.

MintyCane · 09/10/2009 19:21

So sorry about spelling cat put his bum in my face.

SomeGuy · 09/10/2009 19:21

but the more mixed backgrounds... please. that too gets mentioned all the time, and it's all posturing.

depends. In leafy Surrey - most probably. In inner London - definitely not.

I do somewhat get the OP's point, some people do like to beat up on private schools for ideological reasons, and this might give the impression that private schools are somehow bad for you. One of thse 'private schools are bad for you arguments is 'your children aren't exposed to as much diversity as at state school'. This is a non-argument IMHO, but I think it's a bit much to criticise it as posturing by private school parents, because IME it's only ever wheeled out in response to attacks by the anti-private school brigade.

MintyCane · 09/10/2009 19:26

So are you saying that there is not so much diversity in private school in reality ?

It strikes me as a bit odd that on the one hand people say they want their kids to go to private schools so that they are with children like themselves. However, they then deny this and say their are children on all types at their school. Well which is it then are there or arn't there ?

MintyCane · 09/10/2009 19:27

Sorry cats and typing do not mix well.

Quattrocento · 09/10/2009 19:28

Increased diversity is mentioned constantly on the state vs private threads. As is the massively increased provision for sport music and drama.

The mentions of diversity just get drowned out by the war cries from people upset that diversity doesn't mean people who are poor.

The mentions of the increased music/sport/drama just get drowned out by the people at state schools exclaiming that their school has a rounders team, a recorder group AND a chess club. They simply don't get how big the difference is. Or if they do get it, they don't care. Very rarely do you see a response that acknowledges the huge difference and says that state schools should do better ...

seeker · 09/10/2009 19:38

Of COURSE there is more sport and music at private schools! I don't think anyone could possibly deny that.

It's because private schools have longer days, and because parents are paying money to the school for the sport and music that many of us state school parents pay directly to the coach or teacher for. The sport and music at private schools isn't free, you know!

And yes, many private schools are very ethnically diverse. That is because they don't have catchment areas, so draw pupils from a wide area. In the case of boarding schools, from other countries as well. However, they are not socially diverse - most children at private schools come from very similar socio-economic groups, whether they come from London or Nairobi.

Hullygully · 09/10/2009 19:43

Sneaks back in v briefly. There is a wide diversity of economic backgrounds at my dc's school, which may be unusual, as a lot of parents work nightshifts etc, part paid by grandparents etc etc, so that even if they manage to afford it, they come from culturally economically different backgrounds.

thedolly · 09/10/2009 19:49

I would hazard a guess that most of the parents of children in the private sector are 'older' parents. I doubt that there will be many parents in their twenties. What's the name for that kind of diversity or lack of then?

Quattrocento · 09/10/2009 19:50

"Sport is important because it turns you into a tough nut who is happy to stamp on peoples faces to get what you want in life."

Having read the thread, this is a depressing example of people just not caring about sport. You're so wrong you couldn't be wronger. Really.

My DD needs sport. It's hard to explain to someone not sporty (I am not sporty) but she physically needs to work out every day. She is much calmer and more settled afterwards. She's learned to support people, to work with people who are different, to run around and work the pitch/court to support her teammates and work as part of a unit. The essence of team sport is to work as a team. Quite apart from the physical benefits for her.

For DS too, who is less sporty it has brought tremendous benefits. Team working and a basic level of fitness that he simply wouldn't have without it.

Neither of them have ever stamped on anyone's face. Not even DS and he is a prop.

SomeGuy · 09/10/2009 19:55

I would hazard a guess that most of the parents of children in the private sector are 'older' parents. I doubt that there will be many parents in their twenties. What's the name for that kind of diversity or lack of then?

lack of 'people with limited life experience' diversity?

dunno, but dw and I are both in our twenties.

SomeGuy · 09/10/2009 19:58

However, they are not socially diverse - most children at private schools come from very similar socio-economic groups, whether they come from London or Nairobi.

but that is greater diversity. If you want to experience diversity, you don't go to Dagenham or Romford, you visit France/Thailand/Peru.

My comprehensive of 1600 pupils AFAIK had no Muslims, I didn't know what Islam was. I live in a wealthier area now (=more homogenous), but my son's class of 16 had at least two mums who were fasting during Ramadan. I didn't experience any meaningful diversity at state school.

SomeGuy · 09/10/2009 20:00

just to add to that, my state school had four sets so in practice the top sets were middle class, played together, and we didn't experience any socioeconomic diversity either.

seeker · 09/10/2009 20:00

I think sport - or at least physical activity - is important too. I just don't think you have to go to private school to get it.

Hullygully - having grandparents who are in a position to pay school fees does put you in a pretty advantageous economic position - albeit at one remove!

And I reckon it would take a lot of night shifts in packing shelves in Tesco to pay school fees!

MintyCane · 09/10/2009 20:02

I think they were probably nightshifts as a GP seeker. They must have saved by only buying a Volvo as well.

TheFallenMadonna · 09/10/2009 20:03

TBH I think that if you believe there is social diversity in an independent school then you haven't experienced it yourself.

thedolly · 09/10/2009 20:06

Someguy - are you in the minority or are there many other 'younger' parents?

Quattrocento · 09/10/2009 20:06

I think there's a tremendous amount of both racial and social diversity at the DC's schools. Take a bingo hall owner (RL example). No formal education beyond 16, salt of the earth etc. Yes relatively affluent, but not professional middle class which is what you seem to be supposing. Ditto the local fish and chip shop owner.

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