Please talk me through the admissions system, especially if you're in Islington

[MrsNorthLondon]

Feeling a bit muddled.
My DD is only 20 months but i've just had a conversation with another parent who has been talking about school tours and putting names down for schools (her DS is 24 months, so a bit older than DD).

Should I be doing something now?
And does anyone know about the following schools: Yerbury, Grafton, Tufnell Park Primary?

TIA

I am in a neighbouring borough to you, we put names down in the December prior to them starting the following September. For admittance to Reception in Sept 2009 your child needs to turn 4 between Sept 08 and Aug 09. For school nursery they need to turn 3 between Sept 08 and Aug 09....Hope that helps.

DH works in a primary school near Essex Road, behind Upper St he said those schools you named are all good but not sure about the value added aspect as they tend to draw from the leafier parts of the borough.

HTH

Ring your admissions dept. Everyone applies on the same form on the same day for primary school places so they can let you know when & how you can get such forms.

Islington council's website will have all the details (and probably the forms to download or fill in online, once you reach that stage).

Currently, Islington application forms have to be in in the February before your DD is due to start school in September. You hear where she's got a place in May. There's no way of jumping the gun so you've got loads of time. (She'll start in the September after she's turned 4.) HTH

Thanks everyone.
I've calmed down now - guess I've got some time before I need to start worrying.

Lulurose - what's "value added aspect"?
And, a few Mums I know are talking about moving into the Yerbury catchment area - does anyone know if it's really worth the hassle?

I don't know anything about Islington but I do know that for entry to all state schools in the country you apply at some point in the year leading upto Reception entry. So for some LEAs it will be Dec 08 for Sept 09 entry for othersit may be Feb 09 for Sept 09. All applications received before the deadline are treated equally according to the admissions criteria.

Value added is how far a child comes from entry to leaving. So 2 children may achieve level 4 at Y6 but one child was already Level 1a on entry to Reception whilst another was Level W (working towards L1) The 2nd school has more added value because of the stides the children make are greater. You should always look at value added scores when considering a school otherwise SATs results mean nothing.

A school may get far fewer L4s than another in the same LEA yet if you consider they may be working with children who have had little input from home compared with the kiddies up the road in a more affluent, professional area where it's usual to be reading on entry to Reception then you realise why value added scores are so important when judging schools.

Re Yerbury and moving - I don't think you can know if it's worth it to you until you've been in to see what it and other schools are like (which might be a reason for going to look round earlier than you need to, if moving is genuinely on the cards).

Yerbury is seen as a 'desirable' school and is high up the league tables - but that doesn't necessarily mean it'll be the one you like the feel of best for your DD. (Unless, of course, you're sure that 'desirability' and league tables are your main criteria - but even then it would be worth checking... )

Thanks for all your advice.
should I just phone up school and ask for a tour? The Mums I know who have had a tour said it all happened by accident when they just popped in to ask something or other.
What's the protocol - don;t want to be bothering school unnecessarily.

Also, what am I looking for?
Is the look of the building important? I know the Yerbury looks a bit run down from outside - does this matter?

Sorry, so many questions. I'm just really worried I'll get it wrong for my DD.

I'm not in Islington, but in our area you can put children's names down for school nurseries at the age of 2. Securing a school nursery place does not guarantee you a reception place, and you have to apply separately for this. Perhaps your friend was applying for a nursery place, or perhaps she was looking at independent schools.

madsometimes - you;re right. have confirmed with my friend that she was putting her DS down for a nursery place at said school

Chill out MrsNL!

You will not be bothering school by ringing and asking for a tour, that's how it works. But tbh, at 20 months I wouldn't bother -you will have a much better feel on what is right for your child when she's nearer school admission age - I toured a load of schools when my dd1 was a baby and hadn't a clue. By the time school application time came round, her personality was much more defined and the choice was easy.

In our case, t my surprise this was not the very fancy private school we were geared up to send my dd1 to but the state primary (not nearly as good a rep as Yerbury) down the road with v dilapidated buildings. You get an instant vibe from a school- how happy the childre seem, how motivated the teachers are, how they respond to each other and you know pretty instinctively if it's right or wrong.

I know children at Yerbury and to me it seems an excellent school.

fwiw the best advice I can give is to relax about it now.

At the moment the whole idea of your dd going to school will be terrifying - she's not even two yet - so unless you really really think you definitely want to move I'd give yourself a break from thinking about it at the moment.

If you do want to think further, there are lots of threads on here about what to look for when you go round a primary school. The main thing is that different places suit different people, and you'll get a much clearer sense of what matters to you once you've seen a few schools on the inside.

We went for one that isn't talked about as 'desirable' or at the top of the league tables or in a smart building. It's a brilliant place with fantastic staff, a culture of kindness and inclusion, and a real focus on each child as an individual. But we only knew how much we liked it once we'd seen a handful of schools and could compare.

You won't 'get it wrong' - it's not an exact science, so you just have to do what feels right at the time, and even if some problem does emerge with the school your dd goes to there'll always be something you can do to tackle it.

x-post juju - you said it much better than me!

Okay, chill pill taken .... it's just so hard when I hear other Mum's saying that they looked at the Yerbury when their Dc was only 6 months and knew it was right for them just by standing at the school gates??!!!! I guess people go by the reputation of a school before having a proper look.

these other mums sound like loons, MrsNL! Don't know if London is very different but I did not so much as see inside any of our local primary schools until they had their open days in the weeks preceding the application date (around Feb of the year of entry, I think). I did know a little bit about them through knowing children who attended each of the schools, but that's it.

As for putting your name down - my understanding is that you can't do this until the year before entry, and then it is only to ensure that your child's name is on the LEA system so that you will be sent the application form.

The only reason I can think of for having a tour of the school at such a young age would be if the school has a nursery attached, and children who attend the nursery get priority in the admissions procedure.

What the mums mean is they saw lots of other mums who looked like them .. and, as you say "knew it was right for them".

More important is what is right for your dc. Sure Yerbury would be right as it's so good but so will many, many other places.

I know someone who moved to near Yerbury and then didn't get in as the catchment was always changing. Someone else rented a place on the doorstep. It's bonkers - Yerbury is "good" in a self-perpetuating way, (ie people who really really care about going to one with good rep move nearby) but probably no better for any one individual child than any other state primary.
The head may change, there may be a bad run of teachers etc, etc. I worried way too much and in the end went to not a "desirable" one or the private ones we'd put name down for, but the one on our doorstep. Which is more than fine for a 4-year-old.
We're in same borough as you by the way.

MrsNL - Chill, chill, chill! Islington may not be good for secondaries but there are plenty of good primaries. Yerbury is considered "desirable", but there are others equally as good. I know, I have dc, and friends with dc's, in both Y and other schools.

And whatever you do, don't consider moving to Yerbury unless you want to move anyway. You may get a place in the nursery and then miss out on reception, because there are more applicants for reception that live within, say, 150m!

Best thing to do whilst you are chilling over the next year is to chat to other local parents you meet that have older dc who are at school already and see what they say about their schools.

Who knows, maybe we will bump into eachother in RL!

My son is due to start reception class in september but we have been thinking about moving out of london. Does anyone know if we will be able to get a place for him at a school in new area if we have missed the admissions deadline. We cant apply to new schools without living in area, bit nervous about calling education board incase they say we are totally useless and insane! Anyone had this before?

If the school(s) you like has places then should be very straightforward to apply after the admissions deadline.

As soon as you move, inform the new local LEA that you've arrived! I believe, though I'm not certain, that doing that will put your application behind those who were 'in' at the deadline but before the next tranche of DCs once the first round offers are decided.

Don't worry about calling the ed people. That's what we pay their wages for! And you can be certain that any enquiry along those lines will be nowhere NEAR the most outlandish questions and demands that have been made of them! Basically, the rules are teh rules and all you're asking is What ARE the rules in this case.

great thanks very much

Surely in Islington you can't put your dc down for a state nursery before the application date that applies to everyone else?
Sorry to suspect your friends but I'm not too convinced by the 'oh I was just asing for an application form and got dragged on a tour' story. Round here (S. London) people are registering their children at birth and touring whilst pregnant (private admittedly) and moving for their catchement areas so I would suspect your friends are doing the rounds to work out what they want. you also have to book in advance/attend open days in November etc I have been told I can't tour or can't tour for months on several occasions. (I am at the opposite extreme we've done our aplication and I'm just now trying to arrange some tours

I have a value added q I'm going to ask on another thread if anyone feels like they know a bit about it and would like to wander over......

MrsNorthLondon,

Just seen this and in a hurry so sorry if I repeat what others of said.

1.All admissions to state schools in Islington are handled by Islington Council. No advantage, or mechanism for applying when your child is not yet of the right age.

2.At the moment all state schools in Islington use these criteria

1. "Looked after Children" and children with special needs assigned to that particular school (usually because that school has expertise in the particular issue)

1. Siblings of children currently in the school. If school oversubscribed on these then those who live closer to the school get priority.

1. All others. If oversubscribed distance used etc.

This means that the radius of admission can, and will, vary from year to year. So if you are thinking of moving house you need to check that out carefully. But (such fun!) IF you are thinking about moving house what about secondary school?

No end to the middle class anxiety. been there. Done that. if you would like to email me have a look at my profile, and I would be happy to have a phone conversation.