Seeing Ds's teacher after school today, how can I get across what I mean without it sounding like I am being silly ??

[IllegallyBrunette]

I am crap at meetings like this, as I get all flustered, even with a list, and especially if the person I am talking to thinks I am wrong.

So, Ds is 5 (december born), and coming to the end of reception. At the start of reception I raised concerns about Ds's pencil control, as he basically had non at all, couldn't draw, write or anything. I was reassured that he would be fine etc etc.

He has come on alot since Sept, and can now write his name and will try to write other things, but his letters are pretty much unrecognisable still, and he regularly forgets how to write letters. He has gone from having a pencil grip so light that he dropped the pencil, to holding it so tightly that his hand aches. He also complains that he is no good at writing or cutting out, and will not write anything unless made to.

His attention span is very very poor and seems to have gotten worse, and he has started to get into trouble for not listening when he should.

In reading I also feel he is struggling. He will have a go at sounding words out, but only if I ask him to, and even then, unless the picture gives a clue to the word, he won't know it. I have also noticed recently that he sounds words out and then says them back to front, for example ON becomes NO, and MAN becomes NAM etc. He doesn't always do it, but I have noticed it several times recently.
He is on ORT 1+ but has to read a book at least 3/4 times before he knows it.
He has also not learnt all of his key words, and really struggles with anything that can't be sounded out, like they, and any word with more than three letters.

Basically, I am worried that he is starting to struggle and that he will not cope in yr 1 at all, but that said, I am not sure what I want them to do about it.

I really wish there was something I could say to help.

Do you like his teacher and do you get on?

TBH I would expect more progress by now and wonder what has been said at the parent's evening?

Oh also meant to add that I could show him a word from his tin, that he has just been reading in his reading book, and he won't know it.

I do like his teacher, but I feel that she thinks that because he has progressed at all since Sept, then thats ok.

She always seems to say how much he has come on and makes me feel like I don't appreciate what he has and can do, which isn't true.

I would be of been quite happy to follow their lead, until he started to get into trouble and tell me that he didn't like school.

The first thing that I would do is to ask the teacher if she has any worries about your ds's progress. that will aloowe her to raise anything that she wants.

Then ask, 'Is he making the sort of progress that you would normally expect for a child of his age' and 'If he isn't, what do you think are the problems?'

'what are his targets, and is he meeting them? If he isn't what help is he being given?'

'is there anything that I can do to help?'

Boys' fine motor skills develop more slowly than girls', so holding a pencil and writing recognisable words will be more difficult for him. Have you tried one of those pencil grips to help with pencil control?

Also, diet can help with concentration, especially omega oils (either in his food or as a supplement). Speak to the teacher and ask him/her if they have any concerns. They will know what is within the normal perameters for this age.

Thanks MB, those are exactly the type of things I was struggling to think of.

This doesn't sound too unusual for boys of this age. I help in Literacy with Year Ones and lots of the boys will write the letters in the wrong order and find the pencil grip hard.

Freckle, I think originally at the start of reception, he had one of those thick pencils, but not actually a pencil grip.

He does hold the pencil alot better now, but it still looks awkward and uncomfortable.

TBH for a 5yr old boy it sounds about right. My DS is 6 (will be 7 in August) and has just finished Yr 2. In reception he was just not interested in anything to do with holding a pencil. His writing was appalling. Wasn't particularly interested in reading either.

DS will have extra support next year with his writing - it's very common with boys. And exercises/games you can do with him to build up the muscles in his hands will help.

The reading will probably just click one day.

However - talking to the teacher now is a good idea. I would state my concerns and ask how she feels about his progress. She will be able to judge him alongside his peers which you can't do really.

Does it mean it is hard for them to keep up though Bridie ??

That is what is worrying me with Ds, as I think that problem, combined with the fact that he doesn't actually like writing is going to cause a problem.

TBH I think in situations like this it is irrelevant what the average boy is doing. The OP is clearly worried about her son and feels he should have made more progress, so I think talking it over with the teacher is the right thing to do. I have had to speak to my children's teachers several times and my stomach is always in knots and I shake but I have to tell myself I am fighting for my kids and I have to do this.

Good luck, and let us know how you get on.

Thats how I feel Buda, if I can at least let them know I am concerned then perhaps they will keep a close eye on him and get him help if needed.

Perhaps the rest of his class are all quite advanced this year

Thanks Itati, I will update when I get back later

Difficult one - he is only in Yr R and they can suddenly come into their own in Yr 1 but it is never to early to flag your concerns either.

However, does he have problems with other motor skills apart from pencil control? It is very hard for small children, but particularly boys but it he is struggling with other motor skills it might be more than that.

Your DS does sound like my DS at the end of Yr R. He had and still has, actually, terrible handwriting and really struggled with pencil control. Somebody on here recommended 'Write from the Start' as a good course to try out at home. I haven't tried it properly but it tries to make pencil control more fun.

I think my DS had something like 23 key words at the end of Yr R and appeared to have no idea about sounding out. He did suddenly 'get it' in the autumn term of Yr 1 and then he was away and by the end of Yr 2 he was at the top end of the class for reading. It really does just click with a lot of them, the question is when will the click come!?

Thanks Niecie, I really do hope that it just all clicks for him at some point, but am worried that his behaviour will deteriorate before he gets there.

Apart from pencil control, he also has problems using scissors. He can use them but not to accuratly cut things out. He likes cutting out at home, because I just let him get on with it, and he cuts where he likes, but at school if they have to cut something in particular out, then he can't do it, he doesn't seem to be able to control the scissors.

I think it is just his fine motor skills that he is having problems with. His gross motor skills appear to be ok.

One other thing I just remembered. Is it 'normal' for children of that age to get things like up and down, and hot and cold mixed up ??
If Ds is cold, he will say 'can i have a jumper on, i am hot', when what he means is, he is cold and wants to be warmer and visa versa.

Using scissors is another fine motor skill action. Boys in infant school are notorious for being a long way behind girls in these things. Your two older dcs are girls, so try not to compare with what they did at this age (not that you compare deliberately, but it is natural to use what you know as a yardstick).

Boys learn much better through actions and sometimes stuff just doesn't seem to stick in their brains. Too much else going on in there at times.

Don't worry yourself silly at this point. Speak to his teacher and find out if they have any worries about him. If they don't, then you can stop worrying, but keep an eye on him generally. Do stuff at home that he enjoys and just simply correct him when he uses the wrong word. He merely seems to be swapping words which work in context - it would be more worrying if he said something like "Can I have a jumper? I'm hungry." Completely different description.

In our class they will usually be on a table with other boys at the same stage and the work is set for that table. They will catch up, so don't worry!

It might be worth having him assessed at a child development clinic. DS1 had fine motor skill problems, very similar to your son's. We had him checked over by an occupational therapist before he started Reception and we were given games to play with him to improve his skills. It made a big difference. If he has a problem, you'll get help, if he doesn't have a problem, it will put your mind at rest. Speak to your GP or HV.

I think it is normal - certainly my DS at 5 got muddled with positioning pairs like behind of and in front of or up and down.

How about using a different strategy with the teacher (sorry if it has been suggested). Rather than listing all the things he is struggling with and trying to find out if DS is 'normal' (teachers never want to say), why don't you ask for ideas of games and strategies to play with DS over the holidays to help him and make learning fun again. If she is worth her salt she will think of things that you can do that will be specific to your DS's stage of development. It could also open the dialogue about what he can and can't do and his attitude to learning and you can have a chat without feeling the pressure of persuading her something is wrong.

I think I would see how it went over the summer and then see his new teacher in YR1 after she has had a couple of weeks to get to know him and his abilities. His current teacher won't have him for much longer and there probably isn't very much she can do in the remainder of the year anyway.

Well I am glad to say that it went really well. His teacher must of guessed what I was going to say, as she has his writing book out already.

She basically agreed that at the moment he is struggling. She said that after a flying start he seems to have ground to a halt where writing is concerned.
His concentration level seems to have dropped as has his ability to retain anything she tells him.

She said that his formation of his letters has improved alot, and the main thing holding his writing back at the moment is his lack of concentration and forgetting to use finger spaces.

She agreed that he struggles with words any bigger than 3 letters long and so now when he has a sentence sheet, he only needs to use words of 3 letters or less. She said this should improve his confidence as he knows most of the words by sight, and it should make him feel that he knows what he is doing.
She said that she has checked that he knows his letter sounds and word sounds and he does.

He is lucky in that he is only in a small class (19) and it should stay between that and about 21 for the whole of year 1, plus as he will be placed in the bottom group he will get alot of help.
Apparently though he has started to ask for help when he does know what he is doing, and so she said that if he comes home and says that the teacher wouldn't help him, then thats why, but for me to be reassured that they do know he is starting to struggle and they will keep on top of it.

I am happy that they had also noticed the same things as me, and that they are going to keep an eye on things and keep me informed.

Oh and his teacher gave him a cut out of a hand with a finger sticking up to help him with his finger spaces, and she is going to photocopy some sheets for him to try and do at home.

Oh also, he isn't the only one who has ground to a halt. Apparently there are 3 others (all boys) who have also started to struggle a bit.

Sounds like she is on the ball then. Ds needed lots of help with his writing in Year 1 and 2; I was really glad they gave it to him.

Glad it went well and that the teacher was helpful. Sometimes just getting it all out helps doesn't it? I went through a panicky few days last month about DS and feeling shitty for him that he was born in August - if he was 3 weeks younger he would be just finishing year 1 and doing brilliantly instead of struggling along in Yr 2. But I spoke to his old Yr 1 teacher who is fab and she really reassured me.

Building up his confidence will be key. Lots of boys struggle and I imagine that many need a confidence boost to help them along the way. Although it can be counter-productive - DS's class wrote autobiographies this year and they were all up on the wall outside the classroom and DS's was by far the worst in terms of handwriting. I mentioned that we would practise handwriting and was told that the TA told him his writing was great so he didn't need to practice!

I did a thread about DS's fine motors skills a few months ago and got loads of good suggestions. Will hunt it down for you. DS has now been assessed by the school OT and will be working with her next year.

CAn't find my thread anywhere but found this one which seems to have ideas for helping to develop the muscles needed for pencil grip.

Lego is great - as is hama beads. There are lots of threads on here about it so you should be able to find a few ideas that you can do with him over the summer.

Glad it went well IllegallyB.

I meant to say earlier, when you asked for ways of strenghtening your DS's hands, try making up games with clothes pegs. That is one of things that used when DS is in Yr R and Yr 1. They can be quite hard to open.