School on the doorstep?

[SnugSheep]

We’re unlikely to get our top choice of primary (very tight catchment and big sibling year), so we’re trying to figure out the all-important second and third preferences!

School A is our current second choice but I’m wavering. Tbh it’d be front runner if it wasn’t a bit further away. It’s still walkable at around 20-25 mins with a slow 4-year old, and we could also take a bus in a rush/bad weather, but the commute may be a little annoying. There’s a small chance we might not be in catchment.

School B is third choice. It’s closest to us - 5 min walk. It’s a lovely and popular school, but smaller than we’d like and not as standout as school A. It also doesn’t have a nursery attached to it which would help us a lot when it comes to our youngest. Due to tiny size and catchment, if we don’t list this as a higher preference, we actually might not get a place! I.e. it’s actually possible there are 30 kids who live as close we do but for whom it’s first or second preference. The price we pay for choosing a neighbourhood chockablock with preschoolers 😂

I’m still trying to decide the order so I’m thinking now about friendships and whether it’d be better for DD to attend a school where her friends all live on the doorstep. As I say, school A isn’t miles away so idk if the distance matters?

I'd personally pick B in a heartbeat. Do you have other options for a nursery, or would you still want to use the one attached to A? Does your first choice have a nursery too?

Schools don't prioritise applicants who list a school as first preference etc. They don't even know. Preference only comes into play if you qualify for more thN one school then you get your Higher preference.

So if you prefer A to B, list them in that order.

Due to tiny size and catchment, if we don’t list this as a higher preference, we actually might not get a place! I.e. it’s actually possible there are 30 kids who live as close we do but for whom it’s first or second preference
Assuming you're in England (I don't know about elsewhere as have no experience) this is incorrect. The "equal preference" system has been law for many years now, and the order in which you list schools has no impact on your likelihood of getting into a school, other than if you qualify for a place at more than one you will be offered your higher preference. Everyone who applies for a particular school is ranked according to the published admissions criteria, regardless of whether it was their first, second or third preference. They are not allowed to give priority to applicants who have given them a higher preference.
Put your schools in your genuine order of preference, but first look carefully at the admissions criteria for each one, and find out what has happened in the last few years eg where the furthest away child has been offered a place. You need to make sure that there is at least one school on your list that is acceptable to you and that you are as sure as you can be that you'll qualify for. If you aren't eligible for a place at any of the schools you listed the LEA is only obliged to offer you a place at the nearest school left with places at the end of the application process, which obviously tend to be the less popular schools and could be anywhere in your borough. So don't use up all your slots on places you are unlikely to get into as you then risk getting a poor school a long way from home which is probably the worst option of all.

Put them in your order of priority.

I'd still put your favourite (the one you don't think you'd get) as your first choice.

Yes as @MrsAvocet says, putting the closest one third (if it is genuinely your third pref) won't harm your chances of getting a place. If you live nearer than Child B who has listed it first, then unless you are given your first or second pref, you go ahead of Child B. Does that make sense?

A lot of people don't fully understand how it works tbh, which is not helped by schools promoting the idea that you won't get a place there if you don't list it first.

But yes I would want to be sure that I would get a place at School B if I miss out on best school and School A. Check how far away ppl were allocated places last year. If you are well within that distance then no worries.

In terms of the walk to School A, I am thinking that's about a mile and a bit? 20 mins with a slow walker? That's fine. And as they get bigger they will walk faster. Walking to a local school is a big benefit but that is certainly walkable. How far away is your favourite top pref?

Whatever schools you put down don't give up hope if you don't get what you want come April. There is a lot of movement between then and September.

Yeah. We live in an area that has grown massively in recent years. Both of my DSs (now 28 & 24) went to primaries with a one class entry. Indeed, all local primaries were one class entry.

DD (14) went to our local village school which was one class entry when she joined but 1.5 class (45) by the time she left. Neither DS felt as though they were from a small school but DD did. Two class entry (60) is now normal in the area.

I would still put the schools in your order of preference, just make sure the closest school is there somewhere. DD has coped, just Year 7 felt like a small fish in a big pond.

thanks everyone!

Our first choice is a 2-form entry with a school nursery attached that a lot of kids DD already knows will definitely be attending (due to siblings already there). It’s not necessarily the ‘best’ school we saw (which is school A), but it’s the only one that ticks every box including convenience. It’s just sensible for us to put it first and hope for a spot off the waiting list before September rolls around.

We seem to have landed in a tricky location. On the edge of a few catchments in an area where almost all schools are massively oversubscribed. We’re only just inside the catchment for school B, which is the closest to us! The second closest school to us is out of catchment thanks to additional faith-based criteria and an estate on the doorstep. They went out less than 200m last year. School A is exceptional and very popular but it’s in an extremely affluent neighbourhood where houses are huge and lots of families send their kids to independent schools. More uninhabited space around it, fewer kids, bigger school (3 form) so magically the catchment does extend to us!

It sounds like you have 3 good choices. People are saying that the priority you put them doesn’t matter but I thought it does (maybe it differs by area) as they will give a place to everyone who meets the criteria and put it as first choice first. If it is then full, then people who put it as second choice wouldn’t get a choice so you could potentially miss out on first and second choice. I know someone this happened to. She was quite close to a school A but put it as second choice and put a very popular school B that she had little chance of getting a place as her first choice so she missed out on both. She would have got a place at school A based on her distance if she put it first.

This is not how it works around us and I haven't heard of it being done this way (but it might). I suggest the Op checks exactly how it is done in their area.

The Admissions Code in England means that all areas are the same - if you put school B third, and you don't get either your top school or A, you will still get school B ahead of those who put it first if you meet the criteria better than them.

The equal preference system is English Admissioms code. It happens everywhere.

No, if OP is in England then it doesn’t work like that. Schools are not told what preferences people have them. Preferences are purely to allocate places if you meet the criteria for more than one school.

It’s a very complicated system to administer, but essentially the schools rank all the applicants based on admissions criteria. Essentially each time they want to offer a place, they said “did they put this school first, or have they been rejected from their higher preferences?” If so, they get the place.

The school could have 150 first choice applicants, but if 30 kids who put them third meet the criteria better they would be higher on the list and get the places.

When you say school A is exceptional, are you basing that on Ofsted findings? If so, don't, because in my experience that can be misleading. Our DC go to the nearest school which until recently was consistently "Good" in Ofsted's eyes for several years, but at the time of making the decision for the oldest we dithered about a school 20 minutes' walk away which was Outstanding. This year they have both been reinspected and have swapped over, so that the nearby school is outstanding whereas the further one is good.

Yeh as others say @Katiebaby3009if you are in England and you are talking about the last ? 15 years or so then that didn’t happen. Your friend must have been further away than the last offered at her second choice school.

Yes, as I understand it, we’d get school B if we didn’t get our first two choices and were closer than others who’d put it first. My issue is that we might not be closer than the number of people who might list School B first or second. Thanks to popularity and oversubscription in our area. It’s anyone’s guess really.

Our fourth preference (second closest school) is also a bit of a punt because we don’t meet its faith-based criteria and we’re out of its (tiny) catchment. But it’s another good school and if we don’t get our top choices we do want to be on the waiting list. We want to be on the waiting list for any school we would genuinely prefer over whatever we might get. Literally none of the schools we’ve chosen are a huge distance away and totally impossible. Theres likely to be movement as others have said, so there’s a chance we will get lucky with waitlists.

No, we’ve been to see it twice now and I’m a qualified teacher so I know what I’m looking at. It is Outstanding but so are four other schools on our list.

Well there’s nothing you can do about your second point, so it’s not worth worrying about. If you’re close enough to be offered a place, you’ll get it whichever preference you put it as. If you’re not close enough, you won’t. The only thing that’s certain is that you won’t get a place if you don’t list it at all!

Yes as pp says, where you put school B in the list makes no difference- if others live nearer, they get first bite even if you list it first.

(this assumes no one is getting a place at a school they listed higher)

Both my children have gone to primary school that is a 10 min walk away and there is something so special about having friends close by for them both. That goes for mum friends too! We have a lovely community where we are and that is worth so much. It helps that the school is one of the best in the city we live in but seeing my neighbour have to drive every day to their school in a village just up from us and have no local friends etc I would pick the closest one every single time. There is something so special about it.