Move school to an oversubscribed one

[Yats17]

Hi, I'm wondering if someone can help me understand how school preferences work.

We have decided our year 1 son probably needs to move school unfortunately to somewhere with a bigger focus on behaviour and attainment. Current school is v warm and a 12 min walk away. However the challenging demographics, high number of SEN, and the fact my sons are bright but easily led and overly boisterous, means that we think things will become worse for us at this school.

However it seems most schools near us are similar (we are in southwark london). Ive found one possible school and put DS1 on the waiting list, but im not optimistic as we are number 41.

We have DS2s primary place applications coming up now, so I wonder if I put him down for this over subscribed school as 1st choice, and current school as second choice? Then my thinking is if DS2 gets a place then that would bump up DS1 on the waiting list too. But if DS2 gets a place, and they can't find a place for DS1 we would have to go the original school as we can't logistically manage them at 2 different schools.

So would we then be able to reject our 1st choice school and go for the second choice school?

Email Southwark they will give you their space in the waiting list

No, we are no. 55 in waiting list for charles dickens.

I would be surprised if there wasn't movement for your 1st and second choice sufficient to get you in for September. Fingers x for you.

Charles Dicken was also in my choices but that is miles away. Still added 😂

With 62 kids in the year, the school might be waiting to see if anyone leaves in order to reduce to 2 classes for next year. I don't know if they are officially allowed to.

You probably know this, but in year admissions are usually for an immediate start, or within about 3 weeks. There is a chance they will offer you a space earlier than September and expect you to take it ASAP. Although maybe not in this case, given everything is complicated over the number of classes they have.

Ah I did not know this, thank you for flagging. I thought they had to offer a space ASAP to a kid not currently in school. Our kid is in another Southwark school so I didn't think there would be the same urgency. But maybe they would push it for budget transfer reasons. We wouldn't object necessarily to a quick move.

Well not an issue for us right now at any rate 😅

Ive been reading the school admissions code and it states clearly that schools must admit children upto their PAN. Unless they can't for school efficiency reasons. I have asked the question of Southwark admissions team but no response yet.

Ive been reading the school admissions code and it states clearly that schools must admit children upto their PAN. Unless they can't for school efficiency reasons. I have asked the question of Southwark admissions team but no response yet.

But is their PAN actually 60, and they are two over after appeals/EHCP, FAP etc, hence having to form into three classes?

Their current PAN is 90. They have just this year finished consulting to reduce PAN to 60 from Sept 2027.

A PAN only applies to a normal year of entry. As this is an in-year admission, not reception, it does not have to be adhered to in the same way. The school can refuse admission if it would "prejudice the efficient provision of education or use of resources", even if the year is under what would have been the normal intake at reception for that year group. If they decline to admit, you would need to go to appeal where you could make your case for your child and they would need to make that case.

if they are indeed running with 3 classes (each with a qualified teacher) for 62 pupils, this would not be an infant class size appeal. However, if they are in fact now running 2 classes (or will be in september, as ICS also looks a future prejudice within infant years) with 2 excepted children, it would be.

If you get offered a space, they usually expect you to take it within about 3 weeks so it is not sitting empty. Otherwise it could be tricky if child 1 is offered a place in May to start in Sept, but then in June child 2 applies to the school. They would be rejecting child 2 as they are full, and might then find child 1 never even starts, as they change their mind or a house sale falls through.

In your case the school are likely to drag things out whilst they decide whether to run 2 or 3 classes next year. If they run 3 classes, they presumably have loads of space, so might be more flexible about when you start. If they run 2 classes, things might be trickier. They could also decide to run a combined class with the year above/below depending on numbers.

Those pupils would be 'excepted', though, so no requirement to split the cohort into 3 classes. However, if PAN for that cohort was actually 90, the school would have had to run three classes if the number of children in the cohort exceeded 60.

Thanks @MarchingFrogs

Just as an update for anyone else in such a strange position in Southwark:

• the school DS2 got into for Reception say they will be in touch next week about the waiting list. I think they're just trying to deter us as they want to drop to 2 classes. This is despite us explaining the situation to the head at a school visit and he said they'd definitely see what they could do and encouraged us to do an in year application.
• we have as of yesterday added DS1 to an in year list at a religious school. We feel bad about taking a space there as we aren't religious, but DS1 has friends there at least, and we would have to suck up 3 years of split drop offs to DD3s childminder. Southwark have agreed to add DS1 to the wait list for this school now.

Our priority is getting both boys jnto the same school. Southwark have not answered my question about PANs school 1 so I guess they won't bother. We will have to see where we are end of May.

V anxiety inducing!