Smaller or bigger schools?

[Topofthepops9]

We have a choice of 3 primary schools for DD next year, and they all look like lovely schools. One is a C of E with 350 students. We aren’t religious but we wouldn’t be opposed to her going there - it’s our closest and well reviewed by other parents.

One of the others is a well regarded school with 650 pupils, it’s attached to the preschool that DD currently goes to and they do visits there, so she’s used to the environment.

Our last option is a village primary school, with 100 students total. It’s a lovely little school. Due to only having 15 in Year R, they do lots of visits out to the beach/parks etc and seem to be more ‘active learning’.

Which one would you choose? She’s our first, I have no idea what would be best for her but she’s definitely a quieter child who can get lost in the madness of a big group. We are going to visit all 3 this year so may get a better feel then, but I’m not being swayed any one way at the moment.

I wouldn’t judge based on population size. Class size might influence me.

My Dd1 went to a CofE school and it really had no impact on DD1 - just had some assembly prayers and some visits from the local vicar.

Look at facilities and funding:

does the small school have a strong PTA and plenty of outdoor space and extracurricular activities despite its size?

Does the large school re-mix the classes every year? Does every child get a chance to have a role in the school play each year (at both my kids’ schools the answer was NO, because there wasn’t time or space to handle this)?

Based on what you’ve said I would pick the CofE school because being nearby is fabulous for having friends living close to you and being able to walk and cycle to school

You're right to visit to see what feels right. Personally though I'd rule out the village school straight away as 100 pupils would be far to small for me. While it sounds idyllic when they're really young, only 15 in a year group can become really stifling by the time they're in KS2 with very limited opportunities for friendships their own age. Children from such small schools often find the transition to secondary school quite challenging too, as it's such a different environment. The idea of making new friends can be very intimidating when you've only had the same few since you were 4. Children from larger primary schools are far more use to making new friends, especially in schools which are two form or more who mix the classes each year. Making new friends is a life skill, so doing it each year is great practise for children.

Out of the other two, either sound like they could be the right one on the information you've provided. I'm sure visiting them will give you a better insight into which one to put as your first choice.

My DDs went to a small village school a bit like the third one you describe, and there were lots of benefits for them about being in a small school. However, in our case it was our nearest, catchment school which I think does make a difference.

Small schools are wonderful! It’s great when everyone knows everyone else and the older children can make friends with the younger ones. And as a PP suggested, everyone can join in with everything if they want to - sports teams, play etc.

I would also think about which of the schools you are likely to get into, especially if you are in an area popular with families.

Where I live now is heavily catchment based- not much chance for many of the best local schools if you aren't in catchment; where I used to live wasn't, but the CofE school had so many people playing the religious advantage that non-religious .places were given only to a tiny group of children, most of whom had siblings at the school.

The sports team thing depends on a lot of factors and small isn't always best in this case. Sometimes there aren't enough children to put a team together at all if the school is too small. Age is important in primary school sports. You can't have a mixed team of Year 3-6 (for example) rocking up to play a team from another school made up of all Year 6s.

With plays, it can be very school dependent. I've known large schools who put on lots of plays, small schools who hardly put on any and all the other possibilities inbetween. Not all children want to be involved in plays (and some get roped in to make up the numbers in some schools). Many large schools get around it by having different Year groups host different events throughout the year, so all the children get to be involved in something that year whether it's the Harvest festival, Nativity, pantomime, Easter service or an end of year leavers play (for example). Then they do something else the following year in another Year group. Being involved in a play every year is a dream for a child with thespian tendancies, but an absolute nightmare for a shrinking violet. Different year groups may get opportunities to perform concerts (such at the Big Sing, a collaborative singing event for primary school children held in big stadium arenas up and down the country), or put on talent shows etc.

It would be poor form for a school to not ensure everyone has a fair chance at being involved in everything they want to be involved in at some point throughout their primary school journey. Learning to wait for your turn is good for children, and teaches an important lesson that they can't take a starring role in absolutely everything (whether that be a leading role the school play every year, or being picked for every sports team). If a school doesn't make sure everyone has their turn at some point though, that will have much more to do with their attitude rather than their size. Good schools are inclusive, regardless of how big or small.

Mine went to a small school. The class size can be a disadvantage if it’s too small, eg two girls in the class, but mostly it works out fine. If the child is a bit different (eg one of mine didn’t like football in a football-mad school) then it can be harder. One of mine struggled a bit, the others thrived.

One teacher taught two year groups which has its own challenges.

I did find that they got to take part in things more. If the school has to select one quiz team of four from the eldest kids, then obviously their chances are higher if that’s a group of 20, rather than 100. The chances of winning are lower though 😂

Thank you everyone! This is really helpful insight, and some cons of smaller schools I hadn’t thought of. Hopefully my gut will just tell me when I go and visit..

I would rule out the small school because it will teach in mixed year classes (1 class per year group means 210 pupils). With those numbers it’s probably Reception (on its own or with a Nursery group); Y1 + 2; Y3 + 4; Y5 + 6. Classes still of 30 but with double the age span, twice the National Curriculum and, often, a larger than average number of SEN pupils because parents may tend to choose smaller environments for them, especially if Reception is small.

None of the above is a problem if the teachers are excellent and experienced with mixed age classes; the school has its own dedicated Head and the school’s funding is healthy (any class below 30 is a strain on the budget). However, especially if there is only 1 adult in any class or if any of the staff are weaker, that can have a real
impact on your child for 2 whole years.

I’d go for the mid-size C of E, then the very large school, depending on classes per year group. If the C of E has any mixed-age, and the large school is 3 full classes per year group, I’d go for the largest.

I know many children do fine in mixed-age classes, and I know in many areas mixing is inevitable (I have taught a class covering R, 1 and 2 in a 2 form school), but given a choice, I’d favour a school without them.

I would have always said smaller until I’d actually had some experience of primary schools. if I had a complete free choice, I’d go small for infants and bigger for juniors.

I’m moving a child out of a small one form entry school. When it works it is wonderful. The children and parents all know each other well and there is a lovely community spirit. If you have challenging dynamics it is a nightmare as you can’t move children around to rebalance classes. By the upper end it can feel very small socially.

In times where school finances are stretched I would pick a bigger school given my time again. There is more opportunity to pool budgets across more children, better provision for clubs etc.

I would go for the mid sized school. It sounds like a good school and it's also your closest school, which is a huge plus.

My children have attended to 2 different small village primary schools with a PAN of 15 per year. If I had the choice again I wouldn't send them to a small school.

I've found both schools have been very cliquey and in both schools there has been blatant favouritism towards children of staff and governors.

I think in larger schools there are often better systems in place.

Socially it is quite limiting, although it means my children have had to learn to get on with everyone rather than just children they would naturally gravitate towards.

We had 4 1 form intake schools to view with between 15 and 30 kids per year.
I picked 3-4 questions that I asked each school and assessed each school on its merits.
2 schools that typically had 30 children per year were on small footprints and it was obvious that they were struggling for space. 1 of these was more religious than we would be happy with.
The third school deliberately only had 15 student intake and had no wraparound care and we didn't like the head teacher.

We went with the 4th school which historically has small classes (smallest just 9 students) as it has been needing improvement for a long time. In recent years it had been rated good and class sizes were now forecast to be ~25 a year intake. The school building was over 100 years old with lots of space and capacity to be a 30 a year intake without them on top of one another. We went with this school and it seems that others felt similar as that year they could have filled the class twice! The religious school only had 20 students. We have been very happy with the school. When we started looking at schools we only included this school on the list to view as it was walking distance and for completeness.

I wouldn't recommend the tiny school.

I think they sound very idillic but the reality can be different. Children are very limited in friendships and 'forced' to be friends with the kids in their class, instead of organically picking children they bond with over a larger pool. One falling out can be a disaster, instead of your child being able to find others to play with.

Mixed classes means youve got just turned 5 year olds mixed with 7 year olds, which is a huge span education wise. There also won't be other teachers in the year group who can help out with lesson plans if the teacher is unwell for example.

Small school does mean smaller budget, and the teachers often wear many hats. For example the head / deputy head also having their own classroom, SENCO having their own classroom... bigger schools will tend to have staff members for these roles who are just focused on that and not teaching their own class too.