Families are leaving our primary school. What can we do?

[Gruffalowings]

Does anybody have any experience of significant numbers of families leaving a primary school? And is there anything we remaining parents can do about it?

It seems that 10% of our year group left at the end of this term (to neighbouring schools), and I think there are others to follow.

It is two-form entry. Gets very good results - the best in the area. Is long-established in the community.

I am feeling a bit shocked about the movement. Is there anything those of us remaining can do to support the school community?

I was going to ask are you in London? & see you are.

My DB lives in South London & the school my DN went to, her year group shrank from 40 to 6 by Yr4! This was replicated across the school & it eventually closed - a bad Ofsted & financial mismanagement.
The school she moved to also has a lot of movement - with a lot of different nationality children moving back to their home countries, or moving to a better feeder/catchment school, work changes so needing to relocated. It seems very common in London.

We live in Somerset & have some movement too, but generally it balances with the new incoming students either in-year transfers or new starters.

What’s important is that the school is viable, which you believe it is. Otherwise, if your children are happy, thriving and doing the best they can, the staff are generally happy and there isn’t a mass exodus of staff and you’re happy with the results, then that’s enough I think.

Others might find the grass isn’t greener when they’ve moved.

Are you sure all of the children are moving to this neighbouring school? A two form entry school in London with a 10% turnover at the end of the year means six (maybe seven) families are leaving. That doesn’t strike me as excessive at all in a major city when there is always movement.

I don’t really think people can advise you on any steps that could be taken to improve Retention at the current school, if you don’t know why people are leaving. Also, what counts as a neighbouring school? In London if the school is half a mile away and a family moves house half a mile on the other side of the school then they probably consider that’s an already unacceptable commute and they might as well just move to the new closer school, particularly if you say it is part of the same trust.

@Bluevelvetsofa Thank you. What you say is absolutely what I think.

I just wondered if people felt they should make an effort to build community when the setting becomes dynamic in this way. Drinks for parents, parties that invite everyone (like in Reception) and so on.

I just wondered if people felt they should make an effort to build community when the setting becomes dynamic in this way. Drinks for parents, parties that invite everyone (like in Reception) and so on

Of course you should. Live in the moment. At the moment these are your DC’s friends. A few may become life long close friends (as may their parents to you) but even if the majority are just casual friendships that work in the moment, that’s still an important part of day to day existence surely?

What's wraparound care like? Are people moving somewhere they can get breakfast/afterschool club or more childminders pick up?

You cannot force people to value a school community though. It’s their choice to move and it can be for many valid reasons. The main thing is that plenty are left and your dc are thriving. Theres often a grass is greener view but frequently it’s not one that stands up to scrutiny.

We withdrew a DC in y5 plus younger sibling to a neighbouring primary. We weren’t the only ones - by start of year 6 so many people had taken their kids out the school and moved to other local schools that the year was 40% empty. Start of y4 the class was full.

It had been a very popular school but poor new leadership, weak teaching/high staff turnover and rampant bullying the school was unwilling or unable to handle caused parents to take their kids out. My only regret was not doing it sooner.

Obviously it is great your kids are happy but that doesn’t mean others were.

It seems improbable that there’s anything you as a parent can do to find out about or influence other parents’ decisions about their DC.

If you personally already know people who have chosen to leave and know them relatively well you could ask why, but they might choose not to tell you or to lie, eg to minimise risk of gossip about their or other DC.

It is such a shame when your DC's friends leave; sad for them but also has budget implications for the school. If I were you, I would make sure you have an active PTFA who fund raise and add value to the school and work closely with SLT to maintain numbers. If people leave to join schools which feed into favoured secondary schools, the school has to establish good links and partnerships with popular secondaries too.

We’ve had a big influx of kids from another couple of schools for various reasons, but mostly parents not getting on with the school leadership, teachers not being experienced enough to deal with more troubled kids and bullying making kids want to move. If your school doesn’t have any issues and feeds to the same secondary it does seem a bit odd. Maybe try and ask someone who has moved why they did so?

I moved one of mine to a neighbouring school in Y2 because I was unhappy. My polite, curious, eager-to-please child was suddenly constantly in trouble for fidgeting and poor presentation of his work (subsequent dx of dyspraxia, and suspected ASD). Tried to work with school to fix it, got nowhere. He was the problem and they just needed him to change.

Moved him and he absolutely thrived. He's just finished Y9, so been in two other schools in that time. Never had this sort of issue again. I believe that his (relatively mild, easily supported) SEN was treated as poor behaviour because he was a Black boy. Unprompted, other parents have raised similar concerns about the school with me since. Meanwhile the school still has a strong "community" who think it's warm and welcoming and wonderful, and of course it has such a diverse intake, blah blah blah. Maybe it's all of those things for their White children, but it wasn't OK for my son.

That's quite a specific example, but I'm mentioning it because the principle might apply here too - different children and families can have systematically different experiences of the same school.

No. It went at the rate of about 10% a year with new children joining. The classes were mixed up every few years. As one of the school mums on the playground daily, we would chat with anyone around. Never any lack of cohesion.

Without n owing why each family has chosen to leave it’s difficult to know if there is anything you can do. People move for lots of reasons and it’s normal to a certain degree in my experience families move because-
some elements within the year group are dis functional, some year groups are simply an odd mix of characters that don’t work well for some people.
Issues with SEND support or ‘bullying’ that you are not party to.
clashes of personality with staff
because their best friend is moving - yes this happens, sometimes to be regretted.
some parents are simply never content, the grass is always greener…
If your kids are happy then that’s all there is to it. I would expect some new kids in September and for life to go on.

There needs to be a reason. Had it during covid when so many left London.

@Gruffalowings if they are moving to other local schools are they feeders for secondaries? Are they moving house for secondary & want a closer primary?

An outstanding primary with great results doesn't normally lose loads of dc to neighbouring schools.

In general primary schools in London are seeing falling rolls because people not staying in London & having fewer dc.

it’s undersubscribed, but will replenish, I think.

It's not good to be undersubscribed because funding is based on headcounts

We - and many quite a few other parents - moved our children to a nearby CoE school when we realised that the preparation for secondary school was woefully inadequate.

when the old school’s Chair of Governors moved his kids to the CoE school, the Head of the old school finally woke up and they eventually turned the ship around.

I've noticed something similar in falling numbers at our London primary. I find it odd- its a 'good' school by Ofsted and was revisted this year. It achieved highly its SATS results. Higher than the school the parents think is 'better'. My child is insanely happy and thriving there personally and looks forward to going in each day. I don't understand why they are leaving. I also worry a bit about the impact on the schools cash flow, but in the short term I guess the smaller class size will be good for his learning!

but in the short term I guess the smaller class size will be good for his learning!

Parents think it's a good thing but it's not unfortunately. Fewer children means less money and things get cut.

I cant see how old your DC is in your post but there are certain parts of the country where moving school around yr3/4 is very common (especially in parts of London). This is when parents start thinking about secondary schools and where they would like their DC to go.

There is the state until 8 brigade who send their child to state school until around yr 3 or 4 and then chose private schools for pre prep and prep for any selective exams their chosen private school may have to gain entry from age 11+.

Then there are those who look carefully at the state and grammar offerings nearby and weigh up private vs comprehensive state vs 11+ and grammar school. They then research the catchments for each option (the very good comprehensives often have very tight catchments) and make the decision to move somewhere within catchment.

There is also those who find London no longer suits their needs as a family, they want more space/ less crime/ bigger gardens and move out of London to the commuter belts for "cheaper" housing with "more space".

Some schools experience significant movement for different reasons - a change in school
management is a common one. Especially where parents feel like management has changed for the worst.

There can be significant pupil movement that only affects a couple of classes, this is usually due to sustained poor pupil behaviour or sustained poor teaching which parents do not feel are been managed well. In other cases it can be that there are lots of SEND pupils in a class without appropriate levels of support for their needs which stretches resources and impacts other classmates - I once supplied in a school that had over half of the class with various SEND and 1 part time TA. The class did not have a full time teacher and instead had a revolving door of day to day supply teachers. Or one child who has very significant needs that are not been met (usually due to lack of funding or awaiting assessments for funding) and is having a significant impact on the rest of the class (perhaps endangering other pupils/ regular evacuated classes/ regularly severely disruptive) and the school is struggling to safeguard the rest of the class or educate the rest of the class.

mine are in a London primary school too. It amazes me how many children come and go throughout the year, every year.

There can be significant pupil movement that only affects a couple of classes, this is usually due to sustained poor pupil behaviour or sustained poor teaching which parents do not feel are been managed well. In other cases it can be that there are lots of SEND pupils in a class without appropriate levels of support for their needs which stretches resources and impacts other classmates - I once supplied in a school that had over half of the class with various SEND and 1 part time TA. The class did not have a full time teacher and instead had a revolving door of day to day supply teachers. Or one child who has very significant needs that are not been met (usually due to lack of funding or awaiting assessments for funding) and is having a significant impact on the rest of the class (perhaps endangering other pupils/ regular evacuated classes/ regularly severely disruptive) and the school is struggling to safeguard the rest of the class or educate the rest of the class.

@Icecreamandcoffee I have a hunch that this might have been the case for some classes. And this is not what anyone would want for their child (and it’s not an environment that I would wish to work in, either).