Is the 11+ in London really much more challenging and competitive than 10 years ago? And if so, why??

[loveyouradvice]

I'm not sure I believe this... is it true? And why??

Do you mean for grammar schools or private school entry?

Private school 11+ less competitive and less kids overall - 5 years ago was probably the most challenging time

sorry - private... there are so few grammars in London, I wasn't thinking...

Good to hear @Roomgigi that's what I would have expected. Do others agree?

If 7+ is anything to go by, then 100% yes it is.

More students are sitting the state grammar exams in London now. Almost 2700 girls sat the exam for 2025 entry at Henrietta Barnett whereas fewer than 1900 sat the exam for 2015 entry. As for privates, anecdotally, academic requirements have been going up, at least for schools in the top half of desirability.

As for why... the value of a grammar school place or an independent school depends on the alternatives. My theory is that mainstream, comprehensive state schools have been getting worse as real-terms per-student funding has been decreasing and the number of children with SEN has been increasing, so more parents are willing to make their DC prepare for exams.

I wonder how the schools can keep raising the bar. I remember (going back 15 years,) a friend's son getting into Tiffin with a score of about 112. By the time my DC were old enough to sit the exam, the cut off mark was 122. It's probably even higher now.

well that makes sense... but wow, how tough....

The 11+ is the same as it’s always been. It’s just some children are tutored / practice to within an inch of their lives, so the threshold to get in, is higher. Really, it doesn’t provide the natural signs of intelligence that it used to. That’s why a few schools do their own exams. Eg. St Paul’s

I'd agree. Private school entrance exams aren't as difficult.

More invested parents I think. Kids of those who climbed the greasy academic ladder themselves in the 1980s and 1990s and see the benefits (me), lack of funding and concerns about normal state schools.

I was speaking to parents yesterday whose kid tests roughly average to slightly bordering exceeding but they are tutoring to make sure their kid is in top set for everything in a state comp because they know the work ethic and culture in the top set is better than the middle and bottom sets.

1 unexpected side effect from VAT on fees is the "small" number of London based parents who would have sent their dc to boarding schools but due to the £60k pa bills are now considering day schools at £30k and keeping the competition for places buoyant in the top level schools at 11 / 13 plus entry.

I expect lots of international parents think tutoring is a must so now making everything harder? As a parent, you kind of worried maybe we also need a tutor?
Spoke to one Chinese mom from football club, she hired tutors everything. She thinks it’s normal as she was growing up like this.

Because it is in the nature of arms races that they escalate. My son did 11+ for private schools in north London last year. Pretty much everyone at his prep had multiple tutors (eg different ones for English and maths) and many kids spent more hours being prepared by parents in all the school holidays in the year leading up to the tests than they spent at school. Anecdotally from friends with older sons, it wasn’t that tough 5 or 10 years ago.

There are less academic/prestigious private schools that you can get into without all of that, but for those parents aiming for any school that would appear in, say, The Times’ annual ranking of the “best” independent schools, that’s what people do. So it drives everyone to do more.

Also fewer people want or can afford boarding schools (fees are much higher than ten years ago, especially with VAT), so that increases the demand for spots at the London day schools.

Also apparently 2013 was the most recent “peak” birth year, so just more kids in the current cohort, though that will start to drop off in the next couple of years.

I feel competition for a spot at the top independent private schools remains high and I found it wasn’t as ‘easy’ for my eldest to get offers as I had expected from a naturally academic child (we didn’t tutor as much and also went away in the summer holidays with less work than some of her peers were putting it)

From my POV, if we are paying higher school fees we better try to get our child into a Times ‘top 20’ school rather than paying that fee for an average or less selective private school so if others feel the same way then the 11+ entry remains competitive

There was a mini baby boom peaking in 2012 but still with high birth rates in 2013-2015, began to drop after that. So demand is currently at a peak across secondaries.

Therefore, people are less likely to get their preferred state so may choose private as an alternative to the state option they are given.

State schools unfortunately are underfunded and many are having a lot of behaviour related issues. So more people may be trying to stretch to private if they can especially if, as above, they couldn’t get their preferred state option.

Boarding is becoming less popular as a pp said. So more demand on day schools.

Also more SEN diagnoses: if you have an EHCP then state may work better but if your child is not affected enough for an EHCP, but can’t cope in a large class or very mixed ability intake then parents may feel private will work better and again will stretch if they possibly can.

All this leads to more pressure on places, especially at the more sought after schools, which in turn has two effects

1. parents tutor as they know their kid has to be not just “good” but “standout” to get in. With so many kids applying a few extra marks can make the difference between a place or not. And then those who didn’t intend to tutor do so because everyone else is.

2. parents apply for more schools, to be in with a shot of getting at least one. 5-6 is usual whereas it used to be 3-4. If they want a bursary or scholarship it may be even more, so as to enhance chances of getting that award.
   
   What this means of course is a reduced chance for everyone of getting an offer from their preferred school, at least in the first round.

I believe this will all calm down a LOT in 5-6 years’ time as the reduced numbers from current reception/year 1 and below filter through. But that doesn’t help those of us going through 11+ right now.

As regards grammar schools - well take all the above pressures and then add in the fact that they are free… in an environment where school fees go up every year by more than inflation and have also just had VAT added… they will be insanely competitive

11+ for Grammar School entry? Yes, it's only getting more and more competitive.

Private/Independent schools? No, more emphasis is placed on the credit check these days.

As a parent, I found it tough. Mine are/were in a prep and were tutored to within an inch of their lives. I don’t agree with it but it’s what everyone does so we did the same so as not to disadvantage the DC.
There was nothing like this in my country of origin.

11+ for Central London schools is the same as was before. Probably more International kids now (mainland Chinese).
Don’t know how the VAT affected the less academic private ones.