In year school admissions and appeals

[Mino123]

Hi, sorry in advance for the long post. I need your advice please. My daughter is starting year 2 and we have just moved into a different area. I applied for the 3 schools in our area and the council school admissions sent me a letter stating that all 3 schools don't have spaces and that if I wanted to appeal it would be an infant class size appeal. The thing is I contacted the nearest school and they actually don't have 30 children in each of the 2 year 2 classes. They have around 20 in each class. I asked why they can't take my daughter and they said that they are capping the year 2 classes all the way to year 6. The school is 1 class in reception and 1 class in year 1 and then 2 classes in each year from year 2 until year 6. They have said that they want to make the current year 2's into one class when they go up to year 3 next year as there is no limit on how many children in the one class from year 3 onwards. My question is can they refuse a child's application on this basis? Is it legal and how do I proceed? I want to appeal but do I have a strong case? Also if I appeal what are the school going say in their defence? I have sent an email to school admissions explaining what I have found out but haven't had a reply yet. Also are there any legal documents I need to be looking? Please help with any advice or similar situations. Thank you

In which local authority are these schools situated? Are they the three nearest schools to your home? Has the LA offered you a place or told you where there may be vacancies?

We are in Bristol. These are the 3 nearest to our home. The LA haven't offered us a place or told us where there are places. We are just waiting.

So, the school told you for the coming academic year (24/25) they are proposing to teach the two Yr. 2 classes separately but neither class contains 30 pupils, then in Year 3 they are proposing to have one class in excess of 40 pupils; this does not sound right.

The reason schools do this is economic viability or sometimes difficulties with teacher recruitment or delivering the curriculum, but this does not seem to fit with what you have said. Say the original Published Admission Number for Reception was 60, I.e. a 2 form entry school (so 2 classes, each taking up to 30 children), then if the school only receives 32 acceptances, they have to pay for two teachers to operate 2 classes but only receive funding based on 32 pupils, whereas a 2FE school with 60 pupils has broadly the same costs but receives funding for 60 pupils.

Was your DD in school right up to the end of the summer term? Based on the information you have given I would say you have a fair chance at an appeal, but this is not my area of knowledge; hopefully others can help. If you are having continued problems ask the LA about taking your case to the Fair Access Panel which will consider a child out of education for 4 weeks.

@prh47bridge may be able to advise.

Bristol has a falling population of children. There are a few schools that have reduced PAN. The one I'm thinking of has reduced their PAN to 30, so it makes sense that they would want to reduce to one class for the year 3s once they're out of the ICS restrictions.

However, if there are 20 in each class, it's not an ICS case. There is a thing called 'future prejudice', which can happen if a year R or year 1 class has 15 pupils and the school intend to combine the classes in year 1 or 2. This doesn't apply here because they're already year 2 and ICS doesn't apply in years 3-6.

40 in a class isn't ideal and I would think carefully if you want to appeal in case they do go ahead and end up with a class size of 41/42. I guess if you win, though, they might keep it as 2 classes.

Thank you for your reply. My daughter was at her old school in Birmingham right up to the end of the summer term. We moved in August to bristol. Her old school have said they can't take her off the register until we find her a school place here. What is the fair access and how do I apply for it? Can I still do the fair access if she is still on roll at her old school in Birmingham? Of course we have moved so impossible to attend.

Agree with @Lougle

Assuming the information you've got is correct, this is not an infant class size case. You can win by showing that the disadvantage to your daughter from not being admitted outweighs any problems the school will face through having to cope with an additional pupil. If the LA fail to come up with a place, that should be easy. There is no way she can attend a school in Birmingham if you are living in Bristol.

The Fair Access Protocol is a way of ensuring that vulnerable children and children who are hard to place get allocated a place. Your daughter will be eligible to be considered under this once she has been out of education for four weeks without a suitable offer being made. If she qualifies, she should be dealt with that way automatically, but some LAs are poor at this so you should keep chasing them.

Thank you all for your replies, much appreciated, very helpful. I have decided to appeal.
I have a few more questions though if you can help. What are your suggestions for my daughter's disadvantages of not going to the school I'm appealing for other than distance, local community and friends, the logistics of getting all children to school and nursery on time? Would my daughter qualify for the fair access protocol? Can it be only on the basis that there are no places anywhere? Also what does a reasonable distance mean, how far is it? If we don't win the appeal and it goes to fair access can we still get into the school I'm appealing for even though we didn't win the appeal? I am worried it goes to fair access and we are given a school that is so far away. I have another daughter who will be starting next year in reception and I will be applying for her school place this January, if she gets a school near by and my eldest gets a school far away that would be very difficult. Sorry for all the questions, the school admissions haven't been very helpful and I can't find any advice. Thank you

They can refuse a place it if they have reached their PAN, however it would not be infant class size appeal (as there are not 30 in the infant class). This would make it easier to win an appeal x

Also I think it's advised that primary school are given a school within 2 miles walking distance.

Distance, local community, friends and logistics are not winning arguments.

If the LA don't offer a place at all, the disadvantage is that she doesn't have a school place. However, if they do, you would need to look for things the appeal school offers that are not available at the allocated school and that are particularly relevant to your daughter. For example, if your daughter is musically inclined and the school you want has more extracurricular music activities than the allocated school, that would be a good argument.

Your daughter will qualify for the FAP when she has been out of education for four weeks and there are no places available within a reasonable distance from home. However, if a suitable offer is made she will not be eligible to be considered under the FAP.

It is up to the LA to decide what classifies as a reasonable distance. There used to be statutory guidance from the government that up to 45 minutes was reasonable for a primary school child, but this has been watered down allowing LAs to set their own standard. However, that doesn't give them complete freedom. An LA that tried to argue that a journey of 3 hours each way was reasonable would lose.

The FAP is simply about finding a place for your daughter. It does not take your preferences into account at all. It is independent from the appeals process. If your daughter qualifies for the FAP, that should produce a place before you get to appeal. However, if for some reason it doesn't, losing an appeal would not prevent your daughter being given a place at the appeal school via the FAP.

I'm afraid it is possible that your children will end up in different schools. However, most primary schools give priority to siblings so, if your older daughter gets a place before the deadline for applications and you name her school as first preference for your younger daughter, there is a good chance you will get a place.

Not true. However, for children under 8 years old the LA must provide free transport if the allocated school is more than 2 miles from home by the shortest safe walking route.

What are your suggestions for my daughter's disadvantages of not going to the school I'm appealing for other than distance, local community and friends, the logistics of getting all children to school and nursery on time?

Do not use distance/logistics of getting to school. Transport is not the responsibility of the LA (unless a place is allocated over 2 miles away and no closer place was available). Look at the facilities the preferred school has. The fact that she has no school at all will weigh in your favour. You only have to convince the panel that the advantage of her going to the school outweighs the difficulty it will cause the school to have another pupil. As you are relocating, you could mention that she needs to be part of the local community and make local friendships.

Would my daughter qualify for the fair access protocol? Can it be only on the basis that there are no places anywhere? Also what does a reasonable distance mean, how far is it?

Yes, if your DD hasn't got a school place by 4 weeks, then she qualifies for FAP. It will only be on the basis that there are no places within a reasonable distance. The statutory walking distance for mainstream primary children without disabilities is 2 miles. So if they find you a school within that distance, you'll be responsible for transport. If it's beyond 2 miles, they will provide transport assistance. However, if the LA is going to make a school take an extra child, it makes sense to reduce costs and make it a local school. If they are under the PAN that was set for the year group in year R, it makes even less sense to preserve their numbers.

If we don't win the appeal and it goes to fair access can we still get into the school I'm appealing for even though we didn't win the appeal?

It's a separate process. Tbh, I can't think why you wouldn't win the appeal if the school has 20 less children than they could have admitted in year R. They won't be able to show that they are full. They won't be able to show that the classrooms are overcrowded. It's not very realistic to suggest that a class of 40 next year is reasonable (although legal).

I am worried it goes to fair access and we are given a school that is so far away.

That could happen whether you get a place through FAP or the standard admissions process.

I have another daughter who will be starting next year in reception and I will be applying for her school place this January, if she gets a school near by and my eldest gets a school far away that would be very difficult.

If there is a sibling priority, your DD would go up the list anyway. You may decide that whatever school your older DD is placed in might suit your younger DD. In other words, worry about this later.

Thank you all for your advice. I would like to update you. We have a date for the appeal. We received the information from the school and I was right about the class sizes. It turns out they have 17 in each of the two year 2 classes so 34 in total across year group. In year 3 in 2025/26 they want to make it into one class of 34. The headteacher has said that the classes in the junior school are too small to accommodate 35 children if they take one more child as the classrooms are 47m2 (built 1960s) which is below the recommended size of 63m2 therefore they can't take any more children. They said admitting another child would be detrimental in so many ways for all the other children (teacher and TA support, place to play, learn, computer in ICT suite). They even mentioned not enough space to eat meals. They are saying it is prejudice to efficient and safe education and efficient use of resources. They have to reduce the classes to 1 class in year 3 as they have a huge deficit in the budget due to having 34 children in a year group that should be 60.

The admissions team have said in the letter that they are looking at another school which is 4.5 miles away that may have spaces but can't make a formal offer just yet.

What are your thoughts on what the school is saying? I felt really nauseous reading the info. I thought that the prejudice would only be on the children in the infant school not juniors, what do you think? Is there any laws that I can refer to to say that they have to take my daughter because it isn't prejudice in the infants? Also these are predicted numbers in the future not now. Things can change, people may move etc. The appeal team have still said it is an infant class size case.

Also what do you think about the admissions team not making a formal offer for the school that is 4.5 miles away? That is too far, it is a village school so country roads. I still want to proceed with the appeal.

Any advice on what to focus on in the appeal given this information please

Thanks

No, there are no laws you can refer to that say they have to take your daughter because it isn't prejudice in the infants. The Appeals Code specifically allows the appeal panel to consider prejudice that will occur in future years as the year group moves through the school.

Yes, things may change and people may move on. However, the Appeals Code requires the panel to consider the situation as it stands. They cannot assume that children will leave before Y3. They are required to look at the situation as it would be if your daughter is admitted and all existing pupils stay at the school. They are also required to assume that there will indeed only be one class in Y3. They could only assume two classes in Y3 if the school had already decided that there would be two classes.

On the other hand, the appeal team is clearly wrong when they say this is an infant class size case. With only 17 in each class, there is no way admitting your daughter would cause the school to have a class with more than 30 pupils in it. You should definitely challenge this part of their argument.

They presumably aren't certain that the school 4.5 miles away can take your daughter. However, I would expect them to offer something before the hearing. At that distance, your daughter would be entitled to free transport to and from school (unless there is a shortcut that means the shortest safe walking route is considerably shorter).

On the information you've given about the school's case, it is going to be difficult to win your appeal. Most appeal panels will be uncomfortable with going as high as 35 in a class in Y3. That doesn't mean you will definitely lose, but you need to be aware that it looks like this is a long shot so you need to have a backup plan.

@Mino123 sorry, but it does seem more plausible to have a class of 34 in year 3, and it isn't that unusual. When you said that it would be a class of 40, I thought it seemed bonkers, but 34 isn't (although not ideal).

If you are offered the school place 4.5 miles away, the LA will have to assist with transport.

What shall I focus on in the appeal? I know I need to focus on how not attending this school would disadvantage my daughter, but what specifically? Receiving the letter from the school with their case has given me a lot of anxiety as they have a strong case but I am not giving up.

I had a look at the school that may have a place. It is actually 6.3 miles by car on maps and 6.1 miles walking takes over 2 hours walk, not on a bus route (not 4.5 miles as the school admissions have said). We have one car which my husband uses for work, he can't take public transport and he works shifts so won't be able to do drop offs or pickups.

If the school that is far away offers us a place before the hearing can I mention why it is not suitable in the hearing? (Distance, transport as well as other things)

If they don't offer a place before the hearing, should I mention that my daughter has been out of education for 4 weeks at the hearing and also that all other 4 schools in the area are full therefore due to the infant class size law she wouldn't get a place in any of them anyway?

Sorry for all the questions I'm trying to prepare and it is quite overwhelming.

Thank you

Don't focus on transport. The panel will know that, given the distance, the LA is required by law to provide free transport for your daughter. And don't be negative about the offered school. The panel will be independent from the school for which you are appealing, but it is possible that they may have ties to the offered school. If they offer a place at this school, concentrate on the things the appeal school offers that are relevant to your daughter and that are not available at the allocated school.

If they don't offer a place, you don't need to talk about other schools in the area. Your case is simply that the LA has failed to offer a place anywhere and therefore your daughter is not receiving any education, so you want the panel to do what the LA hasn't and give her a place.

Either way, make sure you point out that, with two classes of 17, this is definitely not an infant class size case whatever the LA thinks.

Hi, I need some help please. Our appeal date is quickly approaching and I'm trying to be prepared.

In the procedures to be followed document sent us, in the first session it says that I would only get to ask the admissions authority representative questions. Also the panel may decide to not proceed to the second session where I get to sum up my case.

My questions are: what questions do I ask? How can I ask questions to benefit my case? I thought I was going to talk about my case at the beginning to talk about our situation and talk about my daughter. My written statement in the appeals application unfortunately doesn't have everything I want to talk about. I didn't realise that they don't listen to what the parent wants to say. Also if it proceeds to the second session it says that I have to sum up my case without adding new information. Very confusing.

I wanted to talk about my daughter, her social and emotional well-being, how this has had a negative effect on her and that this isn't an infant class size case which they have said all along.

What shall I do? I'm really disappointed I could have put more in the statement but I didn't have the data from the school and all the details that came in the appeal pack. I have done a lot of research now but didn't do as much at the beginning as I wanted to get the application in as quickly as possible.

Sorry for the long post. Hope someone can help. Thank you

The only reason why the panel will decide not to proceed to stage 2 (the bit where you present your own case) is that they decide that the school has not made a sufficient case at stage 1 not to admit any extra pupil to the year group. If that happens the school will be instructed there and then that the appellant’s / appellants' DC must (all) be admitted.

So not proceeding to stage 2 is a good thing for the appellant.

Don't worry about this. It sounds like the document they've sent isn't very clear. The panel cannot reject your appeal at the first hearing. There will be a second hearing unless you win at the first stage, which is unlikely but not impossible.

The first hearing is about the case to refuse admission. You should ask questions to try and undermine the admission authority's case. After hearing what the admission authority has to say and their responses to any questions, the appeal panel will decide whether the school will be prejudiced if more pupils are admitted. If they decide it won't be, you will have won and there will be no need for the second hearing. If they decide the school will be prejudiced, there will be a second hearing.

The second hearing is about your case. This is where you argue that the disadvantage to your daughter from not being admitted outweighs the prejudice to the school. You can make any argument you want regardless of whether it is in your written case. The only thing you can't do is introduce new evidence.

This process is so confusing thank you for explaining. I understand now. Thank you so much.

@Mino123 You might find this helpul (some LAs / clerks do actually provide links to it along with details of the appeals process locally).

www.gov.uk/government/publications/admission-appeals-for-school-places/advice-for-parents-and-guardians-on-school-admission-appeals