Would you send your bright September born to reception a year early?

[Triadpeta]

My Dd was born in August last year. DH and I were chatting about delaying her when she starts school (she's only 6 months so bit premature I admit!) as my cousin has done it for her son. By that I mean she starts in reception a year later, not putting her straight into Year 1.

A quick trawl on MN and it seems it can be quite a divisive topic. Many people seem to say that they're glad they didn't delay their bright August born as they are thriving in their year and would have been really bored in the year below, even though they are only weeks, if not days, older than some September children.

So does that mean that there are a lot of bright September kids who are also bored? And if so, would you want to have / have had the option to send them a year 'early' (i.e. when they were at the very end of being 3, almost 4) instead of them staying in nursery or preschool for another year?

I guess what I'm asking is it seems it's possible to delay a child but not accelerate them - would people want the system to be flexible in both directions, depending on what's right for the child? And if you have a September child who seems bored in their year, would you have done it?

Is that £500 because of top up fees? Or because your DC does more than 30 hours at the nursery?

It's seems a shame that she was doing work in the heat above but then when she reached the top year she didn't keep getting extended. But I'm the same as you, I don't think I'd have been particularly bored - I love a good zone-out and daydream!

@Triadpeta both, he does 40 hours a week. The funding is stretched across the year so not actually 30hours a week. Plus top up costs in consumable charges because the government don't fund the places correctly.

I think you underestimate how much it is for nursery even with the funding @Triadpeta. Ive just checked our local nursery chain and the cost with 30 hours funding is £945 a month for a full time place. It's term time only, plus there are top ups for the extra hours outside school hours, plus lunchtime. It really doesn't go as far as you think it might.

For what it's worth, I have a very bright November born 11yo. She was well ready to start school when she did, in her correct academic year. Bear in mind that it's really not just about whether they can keep up intellectually - it's also things like being able to wipe their own bottoms and put their own jumpers on. There are a whole set of skills that need mastering before school readiness is there, and my experience of a July born boy is that you can be pushing it even when you anticipate they'll start at their 'correct' time. He's now 16 but I do remember wondering how he was going to cope as he seemed so little compared to the September/October born ones, and he'd only just turned four.

Several years ago but my premature summer born DD was academically capable but certainly not emotionally ready to deal with the year ahead

You may be right, I know that different nurseries have too up fees etc, I think I just got lucky - I sent / send my other DC to preschool for 30 hours (term time only it's true) and I don't have to pay anything for that.

Holidays etc are extra if they go in of course.

Out of interest - what hours are classed as 'full time'?

When I delayed my Summer Born he had always been with a childminder since he was 1 years old and he’d only ever needed 30 hours a week. When his 30 hours funding came in we didn’t have to pay for any childcare as a result but that’s because he was term time only.

At one stage we had looked at moving him to a pre-school environment in preparation for school but they didn’t offer term time only places which meant that although we only needed the free 30 hours a week they still wanted us to pay almost £400 a month to cover fees when he wouldn’t be there during term holidays.

As a result we kept him with his childminder who carried on charging us nothing.

Just putting that out there as a childcare option for people who have worries about an extra year of costs if they delay their summer borns. Childminders as a general rule are cheaper as mine was £4 an hour which included all meals and days out etc.

The 30 hours pays for SFA in many cases now due to how the government has expanded subsidised hours it costs more to send a 3/4 year old to nursery.

Wrap around and holiday care for a 4/5 year old school age child is much cheaper than a nursery place as they don't need to be educated and the ratios are different.

This is where giving them individual lessons in subjects they are gifted in comes in.

My secondary school and others in the area use to do that for gifted children. Now it's only done for those with SEN due to lack of funding. (I have younger relatives who have gone to the schools.)

It means children can stay in their age cohort so their social development is looked after as well.

It is also ok someone quoting academic studies of countries where it is usual for children not to be educated in their age cohorts so children can be years younger or older in the same class, but when you know people who have lived it you aren't so gung-ho.

I have questioned this with my Year 1 son’s teacher as he currently goes to the year 2
class for maths and English. I said that when he goes into Year 2 he will already have done the maths and English work so he will do those classes with the Year 3 class, and she said yes.

I asked her what then happens if this pattern continues and he does Year 6 work in Year 5, what happens when he goes into Year 6 himself and he’s already done the maths and English work and there is no ‘year above’ class for him to join?

She just sort of shrugged her shoulders and I imagine they would just make him repeat the work he’s already done.

Out of interest - what hours are classed as 'full time'?

Well, nurseries usually operate on a full or half day as that's how they staff. The one I was looking at was 7.45am to 6pm, all year and that's pretty standard - 51.25hrs a week.

The funding covers 30 hours a week, term time only, which is 22hrs a week over the year.

Free preschool only works if your job is during preschool hours, which is very unusual - to do a full time job you need the wraparound care.

@NameChangeAgain0224 Do you know if any of the teachers are Maths specialists in year 6? As this is the teacher your child wants the second time round as they will hopefully give him extra work.

My daughter is October born and the wait for her to start school is loooong. She has been ready for months. I would definitely base the decision to delay or not much closer to the time when you can get a feel for your child and if it would benefit them. There's a big shift at 4, all of a sudden she was much older seeming.

The difficulty is that you can’t make the decision at a point close to when they’re going to school because the process of delaying a child's start can be long and complicated and it has to be prepared for well in advance.

For late summer borns you are applying for a school place not long after they turn 3 years old so how at such a young age can you know for sure if they are going to be for school?

In order to delay their school start it’s not a quick and simple process and again, it is a process that has to be started about a year before they are due to start school.

A parent can aways take the risk of applying for their summer/born child’s school place as normal and then just pulling out nearer to the time if the child doesn’t seem ready, but there is absolutely no guarantee the school will then accept the child into Reception the following year. A deferred start agreement has to be in place long before the child is due to start school.

I think that’s why so many people worry about delaying their child’s start because it’s a decision you are making about your 3 year old child so you have absolutely no idea if they will cope with school when they have just turned 4 or not.

Parents have to just make a decision (based on not much) and then hope that it turns out to be the right one.

I think that’s why so many people worry about delaying their child’s start because it’s a decision you are making about your 3 year old child so you have absolutely no idea if they will cope with school when they have just turned 4 or not.

Parents have to just make a decision (based on not much) and then hope that it turns out to be the right one.

This is where your child's nursery and/or childminder comes into play.

They should hopefully be experienced enough and telling you whether your child is reaching milestones and what they are struggling with.

Lots of July and August borns do reach the milestones at the right time however many seem younger when they start school simply because they are younger than those born in September and October. It's interesting to see in my DDs reception class, where she is the eldest, who has matured since Autumn.

I have a child in Y2 who is currently being advanced. She’s doing her core subjects with year 3 and will make a full move up into year 4 in September. I didn’t push for this, the school suggested it and it’s working fine. Doesn’t seem to be causing any problems socially, it’s months different, not a generation!

My son’s childminder was very supportive of us delaying him because although he was exactly where he should be in terms of his developmental milestones, she agreed that our worries about his emotional and social readiness for school were justified. We knew our son would be fine with the academic side of starting school but there’s so much research out there about the long term affects on a summer-born child’s confidence and mental health as a result of starting school at just turned 4 years old, that’s what was the basis for us delaying him.

Plus, reception is mainly just play based so it’s very unlikely any summer born is going to struggle in that environment. The question that really needs to be asked is whether they will be ready for the more formal schooling that emerges in Year 1, and coping in that kind of social environment, when they have just turned 5 years old. That question however can be very difficult to answer when you’re looking at a 3 year old child and trying to decide what to do for the best.

My son is the oldest in his class by about ten days and then another 6 children turn his age within about another seven week period. On the opposite end of the scale there are about 3 children who are a whole year younger than my son as they started school at just turned 4 (when they ‘should’ have as opposed to being deferred) and the difference in those children and my son so evident to see and they just seem so young. I can’t imagine my son being in his current learning environment whilst being a whole year younger.

It’s the same with the other oldest children in his class (those who were born throughout the autumn and winter months) there is a very clear difference in how they behave and interact when compared to the summer-borns of the class.

My son plays sport with the school year above him, I.e the academic cohort he ‘should’ be in and there’s a big difference in him compared to them in terms of his ability to focus, ability to take on board instructions and maintain his concentration. He’s just so much younger than them and when I see those differences I’m glad we deferred his start.

Although by cohort he should be in Year 2, when it comes to his emotional and social skills he’s far more on par with the Year 1 class.

That’s just my experience though and I’m sure there are millions of summer born children who went to school at just turned 4 and did fine so I’m not saying my experience is the only valid one.

My whole point though is that when it comes to a child’s readiness for education and their ability to cope in that environment, it’s near impossible to predict that when looking at a 3 year old.

Plus, reception is mainly just play based so it’s very unlikely any summer born is going to struggle in that environment.

They actually learn to read in reception.

Also some kids do struggle in reception though regardless of where they are born in the year.

My DD's school is alerted to it like other schools I know people work in/send their children to. Some of the struggling kids have diagnosed SEN or it has been noticed they likely have it so need a diagnosis, while with others they are social and/or developmental factors at play.

I have a very early Sept child- a few days earlier and she would have gone to school last year. She has been bored at nursery, and would have been fine last year, but the extra preschool year (where she has been bored stiff in some ways) has been great for developing kore mature social and interpersonal skills, as well as just letting her be a kid for a bit longer.

I wouldn't even try to advance a kid a year earlier as they could be at a huge disadvantage in terms of softer skills and sometimes readiness- the reason people sometimes defer summer borns is because a year often makes a huge difference in the skills needed to progress and enjoy learning.

It’s such a misconception that Reception is all play. It really isn’t. They learn to read, write and do Maths and topic work. My daughter was doing spelling tests during the second half of the year.