Wiggly Year 3 student on carpet -- how much does carpet time matter?

[thinkingtoomuchagain]

In Year 2, and now Year 3, my DD's teacher has said she is very wiggly on the carpet and takes up too much space, but is absolutely fine at a chair at her table. No other behavioral issues, average or above average in all her subjects.

I've scheduled an OT assessment for her as I want to take this seriously and am tired of thinking of ways to help her (she refuses a wobble chair and fidget toys as she does not want to be different -- anyway the problem doesn't seem to be fidgeting so much as not staying still.) At the very least an OT might give me some ideas or guidance for the teacher.

But at the same time, I think carpet time sounds kind of . . . silly? I couldn't sit on a carpet for 2 minutes, but her teacher seems to feel very passionately about it. Is it really a problem when she is fine in a chair? What am I missing here?

I work with OTs on a regular basis and the first thing they will say in response to a child struggling to sit cross legged on the floor is to give them a chair or let them sit somewhere that they can lean against a wall.
Because guess what?
All bodies are different...some people can sit on the floor for long periods of time with ease and others struggle.
Learning can happen just as easily from a chair as it does on the carpet 🤷🏽‍♀️

I’ve rarely seen a classroom full of 30 Dc at work tables with sufficient open floor space for sitting all 30 on it. Mine didn’t in y3. YR yes. Assembly yes.

I can remember sitting crossed legged on the carpet listening to Goodnight Mr Tom in year 6. Can’t imagine doing it now (dodgy back, achy knees) but in Year 6 I could also do a full split mid air, a back somersault on a beam and could basically wrap my leg around my head in some way that the photos now just make me want to wince.

Children’s bodies are incredibly flexible and can do stuff comfortably that adults’ just can’t.

Generations of 7 year olds have managed to sit cross legged before now, it really isn't too much to ask.

In this country, yes. But an OT told me recently that the majority of the world do NOT sit like this. Actually, in many other counties, they squat. She said this cross leggedness on the floor is actually unnatural. My sons struggles with it too - he is hypermobile and when she observed him she spotted his struggles. The OT may be helpful for your child too.

OP you're missing the point. Your child won't necessarily gain anything educationally from sitting on the carpet. But as a teacher it is FAR easier to deliver your input (the first 10/15 mins of a lesson) with younger children sat directly in front of you. If the children are writing responses on mini whiteboards you can see their answers easily. Young children can't sit in chairs at tables all day. As someone has already mentioned, periods of movement in the day from tables to the carpet are really important. If any children in my class had genuine issues sitting on the carpet, I let them sit on a chair. Before you spend money on a private OT please know that there is no requirement for schools to put in place recommendations from private reports. My advice would be speak to the SENCO at your child's school first.

Sitting on the carpet means they can see pictures in reading books more easily (or anything else small and detailed you are showing), and as a teacher you don't have to project your voice as far, which is helpful. It also gives good task switching time, and is a nice break for those who find sitting on chairs uncomfortable. Sitting cross legged is also apparently good for core strength, and seeing children who can't do it can flag up issues such as hypermobility. So in general it is a good thing to do if your classroom has the space.

How does she cope in assembly? In my experience in Primaries, it is only when you get to Y6 that you get to sit in chairs or benches

It's not that sitting on the carpet is a skill they need to master, just a useful teaching space. I work in Y3 and we've prioritised keeping our carpet space when adding in extra tables when we get more children. Ours come to the carpet at least five times a day, going back and forward between carpet and tables several times in one lesson to keep them focussed and allow for mini movement breaks. So for example we would do phonics on the carpet (very low attaining cohort so we're still doing whole class phonics at the moment), back to tables to write words from our phonics session, back to carpet for Writing input, back to tables to do their writing.

We have a child who struggles to sit on the carpet, so they have the choice of sitting on the carpet or a chair at the back, and regularly choose chair at the back. There's another one who has a disability and can only forcus for a limited amount of time, so they go as they please between the carpet and their desk, where they can have a sensory break. I think if we had a child who was wriggly but didn't want to look different by sitting at a table, we would probably sit them at the back of the carpet space so they could wriggle without distracting others.

You have been given a few reasons why some teachers use carpet time. Why did you ask if you are not intending to take any notice?

If sitting cross legged was unnatural, our knees would be constructed in such a way as to completely prevent it!

In my class, I’ve always had ‘special chairs’ that children can sit on. Sometimes these chairs are allocated to children who can’t sit still on the carpet. At story time, I’d be encouraging children to get comfy, some will stay in their seats, some will grab a cushion and lie on the floor, some will sit cross legged. All options are fine. For other tasks such as direct teaching, the nearest children stay at their tables and the ones further away come to the carpet with their whiteboards.

Me too. I hate baby classes for that reason!

And it can be very painful and difficult to get up again if you have issues with your joints.

ETA: since someone mentioned sitting cross legged, if you are hypermobile, it's very easy to flex joints further than they are meant to go by sitting cross legged. I'm too arthritic to manage it at all, now but when I was younger, the way it bent my ankles meant that I struggled to put weight on them, afterwards.

All the secondary schools I've been in had chairs or benches for assemblies.

If sitting on a carpet square or a chair would be fine but for the fact that she doesn't want to be different, make sure the teacher knows that it's being different that bothers her. It would be easy enough to have all the children in the back row sat on carpet squares, so it's not just her. One of DD's teachers had a bench at the back of the carpet area - so a few children got to sit on that.

I don't think "adults don't" is a good reason why children shouldn't sit on the carpet - many children prefer to sit on the floor when playing. I still quite like sitting on the floor, but sadly getting up again is trickier nowadays.
However there are some children for whom sitting cross-legged is difficult or even painful, so I think teachers need to be aware of that possibility, and allow different positions or sitting on a chair/bench.

It's likely that she is struggling is to hold her attention and listen. Is she ok at her desk because that's where she is engaged in a task?

Either way you must stress to her that she needs to engage with strategies to help because her behaviour on the carpet will be disrupting others from learning too.

You are very dismissive of "carpet time" but in fact it's "listening time" and this is a crucial part of her learning.

The majority of young children do manage to sit reasonably still on the carpet to listen to the teacher and take part in whole class learning. It brings them close to the board and teacher.

Your job here as a parent is to help your daughter engage with ideas that can help her concentrate and be less disruptive. It's not her fault. She may need to develop in this area and she can be helped by sitting on a chair, a wobble mat, a carpet square or sitting in a particular space.

The OT will probably suggest these things. You can certainly advocate for your daughter with the teacher to ensure she does not feel different to the others but it will help if you also support her to accept that there is a problem which can't be ignored.

Really? I can only think of one classroom I've ever encountered in LKS2 that didn't have a carpet space. I've taught in Y3 or Y4 for most of my career and am constantly in and out of other schools.

If sitting cross legged was unnatural, our knees would be constructed in such a way as to completely prevent it!

So are you saying that the Occupational Therapist we are using is wrong and lacks adequate information? That's literally what she said.

Before you spend money on a private OT please know that there is no requirement for schools to put in place recommendations from private reports. My advice would be speak to the SENCO at your child's school first.

You're absolutely right, but it does help to identify what the problem is, and any sensible school would try to help if they know the root issue. I agree with speaking to the SENCO. It was ours who arrange an OT observation, who recognised my son's hypermobility issues in relation to sitting on the floor, and why he kept changing position constantly (wriggly).

Believe it or not, some medical doctors will tell you that a person with a penis is female - so yes, I am saying the OT is wrong.

Believe it or not, some medical doctors will tell you that a person with a penis is female

Sure, but the majority of medical doctors know more about medicine than the average mumsnet randomer, so excuse me if I think my OT might be more informed than you 🤦‍♀️

I used to struggle to sit on the floor as a child in school. I found sitting cross legged really
Uncomfortable. I used to get sent out of the room a lot for stretching my legs out but I was genuinely in pain.

I don't like it now either. Turns out I've got a twisted hip so maybe that's the reason?

Maybe check your DD doesn't have any physical reason why she can't do carpet time. And then either get her at the edge of the mat, her own smaller mat or a chair.

The wriggling will be distracting for those around her. I would say she either sits still or sits on a chair.

Seeing an OT is not OTT. If your child stands out from the rest of the class and it hasn't improved since Year 2, it's worth following up. A few people have mentioned hypermobility but there are lots of other possible issues the OT may be able to pinpoint and potentially resolve. It also sends a message to the school that you take their concerns seriously, which will be appreciated.

Seeing an OT is not OTT. If your child stands out from the rest of the class and it hasn't improved since Year 2, it's worth following up

Agreed.