Help understanding school applications

[EdPops]

Hi,

My DS will start reception in Sept 2023, i'm in the middle of completing the enrolment application and wondered if anyone could shed some light on a question i have...

Essentially we have 6 schools we can list in order of preference, however our preferred number 1 and 2 schools are possibly just out of reach in terms of distance. Our strategy was to keep these as 1 and 2 on the off chance we get in knowing we have option 3 as our more likely default, our assumption being that if schools 1 and 2 reject us we'll simply be given our 3rd choice.

However, looking at the statistics from previous years of the schools we're looking at, 0 places were given to anyone listing them in 3rd, 4th, 5th or 6th position.

If our preferred schools 1 and 2 don't accept us due to distance and all our other choices are filled by children who's parents put them higher on their list, what happens? Does the council just pick any old school for you that has spaces left regardless of your list?!

Thanks

Wrong information alert! Schools haveno say in allocating places or offering them. The whole shebang is done from the information provided by the parents and fed into a computer programme run by the local authority. Don’t believe schools who say you won’t get in if you don’t put them first.

but yes, use all your preferences, and use them sensibly, you are not going to get into Wonderkid Academy if it is situated ten miles away from you with ten other schools closer, even if you put it as your only choice thinking that will force the LAs hand. Always include a banker school even if you decide to use one or more of your choices as a wild card.

OP's scenario was that the school only had one place left. It is therefore almost certainly the case that the two children in her scenario are in the same admissions category. They definitely won't be LAC or EHCP.

Inappropriate wrong information alert!

The information given by @Dontsparethehorses is correct for most schools these days. The LA ranks the applicants for community schools and VC schools. For all other types of school (academies, VA schools, free schools, etc.), the LA sends the list of applicants to the school, and it is their job to rank them. However, the school is not told where they are in each applicant's list of preferences. They must rank the applicants purely based on their oversubscription criteria. Once they have ranked the applicants, they return the list to the LA. The LA then make sure that anyone who has qualified for offers from multiple schools only gets offered the highest preference available. Finally, they make sure that those who haven't qualified for a place at any of their preferences are offered a place at the nearest school with places available.

I often come across people who think the whole process is automated and dealt with by computer. It isn't. It isn't amenable to full automation in this way. Partial automation, yes. Full automation, no.

Apologies.

Hello, everyone. We offer people the right of reply on threads and have received the following post from Locrating, which we're posting on their behalf:

Hello all. I'm Lewis, a co-founder of Locrating.

I came across this discussion by chance and, as there is some suggestion our data is inaccurate, I just wanted to add some comments to reassure people that it is not. All our data comes from official sources and we go to huge lengths to ensure its accuracy. The admissions data being discussed on this thread has come from an officially produced dataset and includes all applications and offers, where the application was made on time, via the common application form (CAF). It does not include children who have a special education needs (SEN) statement or education, health and care (EHC) plan, nor does it include appeals. The data should match exactly that published by Local Authorities (LAs), as LAs are the originating source of the data. It should be noted however that LAs may publish second round (or later) offers and appeals, online and in their brochures, which will be different from what we show, so it's important to make sure you are comparing like-for-like when making any comparisons. Please rest assured though that our data is official and completely accurate.

We operate a 7 day a week member's helpdesk and are always happy to assist in explaining the data that is shown on our site. Paid or non-paid members are also free to email us on our support email address, which can be found on our website; we're a small family run business and very approachable and helpful. It is far better to ask us directly about our data, as we know exactly the data sources.

I note that mmmmmmcheeeesssseeee has posted two sets of numbers side by side, to illustrate we are incorrect. Unfortunately, I cannot look into this further, as it is not stated which school this relates to, but just at first glance the LA comparison data looks incorrect to me. I think the comparison is supposedly between our offer data and the LA's offer data, but looking at the LA's data - how can there be 315 offers (128+130+57) for a school that has only 180 spaces (the top row)? That makes no sense at all. I'm having to guess what the data is, as the screenshots aren't clear, but from the limited information available, I'm actually wondering if our published number of offers is being compared with the LA's number of applications; which clearly won't match. If mmmmmmcheeeesssseeee is able to share the source of the data, then I'm very happy to look into it and feedback the outcome.

Anyhow, I just wanted to say that our data is most definitely trustworthy and we are always available to help with these kinds of queries.

Best wishes,

Lewis

In the data he refers to, it's quite clear what the disconnect is - the Locrating data says "Total Offers 169" and and LA data says "Offers on National Offer Day 177" - which clearly don't match. No guessing required.

The LA data may include EHCPs, LAC etc, which is why the data differs - but they do differ.

I also criticised the data for 2022 as every school in Co Durham was listed as offering 100% of their places to first choice applications last year. Not a single one of those I looked at had any second, third or other applications.

This year's data looks much more credible so perhaps they've got their house in order.

The weird thing about Locrating's data pointed out previously, which Lewis's reply doesn't attempt to address, is that 1st pref/2nd pref/3rd pref is totally irrelevant information because it is illegal for admissions authorities to take that info into account and it has no bearing on admissions.

It's quite normal for a school that's not very popular to have very few 1st choice applications because all the nearby families apply for further-away options as a first/second choices, and name the nearby not-very-good school as their last choice because at least a not-very-good school that is nearby is better than a not-very-good school that's also a pain to get to.

If that not-very-good school is your 6th choice but you live right next door, you are guaranteed a place there if all your other applications are unsuccessful.

It would be genuinely useful if Locrating compiled the actually relevant information about how many places are allocated to each category of admissions (different for each schools but often some arrangement of siblings in-catchment, non-siblings in-catchment, siblings out-of-catchment, non-siblings out-of-catchment) and just a bit odd and offputting that they go to the effort of compiling and advertising irrelevant and illegal-to-make-relevant information like this without including published and useful relevant information.

Being SEND won't help with a school place. Having a named EHCP will.
We do our own admissions as some schools do and then send them to the LA to administer. We don't know if we are first or fifth choice.