Page 2 | What to do with a gifted child?

Cheerfuldutch · 2022-09-09T07:49:44+00:00

Hi, we're moving to the UK from the Netherlands and I'm orienting myself for a school for my 9 year old. Here, we have schools for gifted children where they are being educated and challenged at their level and can interact with peers. Do these schools exist in the UK as well? If not, what are the other options? Skipping a year would place her in Year 6, which is very young to be leaving primary I think. So I'm looking for advice to do what's best for her mental, social-emotional well being and my sanity ;) Thanks for your help!

LondonMum81 · 12/09/2022 09:30

I think it depends on the child. The main thing is if they are comfortable spending much of their day not challenged. For some kids, they are happy to coast and if you provide challenge outside of school where they can develop grit and resilience then it's perfectly fine. Other children act out terribly in those situations.

It will be down I think to personality, how able the child is relative to the ability level of the cohort (all state schools aren't the same in this respect either) etc

OP, what are the issues you are concerned about specifically?

Original poster

Cheerfuldutch · 12/09/2022 10:48

Yes, I like having her at home :)
We would be moving towards Matlock, Derbyshire.

OP posts:

Rosehugger · 12/09/2022 10:53

You might want to consider somewhere with grammar schools for secondary age. There are grammars in parts of south Manchester for example.

Original poster

Cheerfuldutch · 14/09/2022 09:26

Rotherweird · 09/09/2022 09:05

State schools in the UK don’t generally support skipping a year.

My advice would be think very carefully about secondary education before you move, especially if you can’t afford private. Where I live, state schools are set up to cater for those who are struggling/average, and my bright but not off the charts DC finds it very frustrating.

Good advice, thanks!

OP posts:

Original poster

Cheerfuldutch · 14/09/2022 10:16

Thanks for all your replies, very helpful!
@BumbledBee, making the move now so she'll has time to prepare for the entrance level exams in Year 6 makes sense.
I'll look into selective state grammar schools and will make that leading in where we move to.
We've enjoyed our trip to Canterbury, so Kent might be an option. But first we'll look into Derbyshire options, since that's where we lived before
I'll discuss with her previous school about possible tutoring and those tests that may happen before Year 6, thanks for the tip @DelphiniumBlue.

OP posts:

Original poster

Cheerfuldutch · 14/09/2022 10:16

RedToothBrush · 10/09/2022 02:22

No we don't have similar schools here.

No we generally don't put kids up a year as it's regarded as bad for their social / mental well being.

What happens to super bright kids? They either rot in state education until High School, largely over looked because they are performing at the expected level or you pay and go private pretty much.

At high school level there are slightly more options depending on where you live. Some places have grammar schools but not everywhere does. You have to take exams to get into them. Fortunately you are just about the right age to do that but you need to make sure you apply in time.

I live in an area where you have to travel out of the area to go to a grammar. There aren't any in my local authority.

You can apply for them but you have to travel. High school entry here really is a lottery in terms of where you live. Live in an expensive area and the school is better and there's more likely to be bright kids. But even then you cannot get into the local good high school unless your child is in one of the feeder primary schools now. So you have to hope you can get a space at one of them. At the moment you'd be hard pushed to as they are over subscribed.

Tbh it's an issue I think is appalling. Our local primary is really good academically and holistically. However there does seem to be an issue with the brightest kids being overlooked and there being a tendency to cater to middle abilities or those struggling with special needs.

I know of three families who have been so dishearten and felt so let down they've gone private. One is on part bursary as they can't afford full fees but their son is bright enough to have got funding. All think the local primary is really good, with good staff but they just weren't giving work at their child's level and felt that it meant they weren't going to reach full potential.

We are currently grappling with the same dilemma. We would have pulled DS but for the fact he has formed a very close and positive friendship with a kid he has known since he was 4. The pair of them are unusually close and its the type of relationship that we can see lasting a lifetime. We value that social bonding highly so don't think that it is in his interests to move him at present but we are monitoring how it goes. He is settled and happy. If thinks changed in the next year or so, we'll pull him.

@RedToothBrush, I so understand what you're saying! Her social and emotional wellbeing has always been my main concern.
and friends that have known you since primary will be so nice when they're adults.
Here in school they've let my daughter work top-down since she was 6. That means hearing the explanation with the other kids, then doing the test and doing the exercises based on what she still found difficult.
Hopefully your school is able to step up and offer your son more of a fitting approach.

OP posts:

Original poster

Cheerfuldutch · 14/09/2022 10:20

Popaholic · 10/09/2022 03:48

No to skipping a year. Many, many state school children could manage it academically but it won’t happen.

If you have the means, avoid state school if you have a very gifted child. Even in a state school labelled outstanding, there are significant challenges associated with having 32 kids of very mixed abilities, educational needs and behavioural disorders in the classroom. Kids are graded as working below expected standard, at the expected standard and above the expected standard. If your child is “Working above” in all areas, and well-behaved, most primary teachers will be extremely grateful but find it very difficult to find time to really extend them as far as they would like to. Year 6 can feel especially slow and frustrating, as they revise material ahead of SAT tests in May (extremely dull and repetitive) and then in the summer term almost no maths or English get taught as SATs are over, the kids just mess about a lot.

if you are stuck in the state school system, consider how you can extend and enrich your child inside school (clubs, school play, making strong friendships etc) and outside school - eg private tutoring, visiting local library, cultural events and visits, watching the news together, debating at home. Also divert and distract with other activities - play dates, sports, learning to become independent by being able to organise themselves and cook/walk to the shop alone/maintain their own bike etc, drama or music lessons, science or coding clubs, Scouts or Guides to develop teamwork and leadership etc.

do you have an idea what area of the UK you are moving to?

If you can afford independent (private fee-paying)school it is likely to be your best option , offering small classes and often a higher educational standard so they expect to stretch your child further and raise expectations of academic attainment. Depending where you are in the UK they may also prepare your child for the selection tests for independent or more academic state schools (including 11+ exam for grammar schools in areas where that is applicable).

Also are you talking all-round bright, or talented in certain subjects (which ones?)? If you are talking about off-the-scale bright, some independent schools offer scholarships and bursaries which could be worth applying for.

There is excellent advice in these boards once you have a better idea where you will be living in the UK.

@Popaholic, we have an idea of area we want to move to, but I find her attending a school that's good for her most important.
Thanks for the suggestion of scholarships and bursaries. So far I haven't had her IQ tested. The bell curve can go on infinitely so she won't be off-the-scale ;)
To me it makes sense to let her join Year 5 and prepare herself for those exams in Year 6. It will already be a bit more of a stretch by switching countries and schoolsystem.

OP posts:

chickensandgorillas · 14/09/2022 10:21

Sometimes good tutors get booked up years before the child goes into Y5, so I would keep that in mind. Having said that, different children gel well with different teaching styles so you might want to find out what they are like. Not that she will need intensive coaching, but familiarity of exam type questions will help for 11+. Good luck!

Original poster

Cheerfuldutch · 14/09/2022 10:23

Anon778833 · 10/09/2022 04:14

If you can afford independent (private fee-paying)school it is likely to be your best option , offering small classes and often a higher educational standard so they expect to stretch your child further and raise expectations of academic attainment.

I think it is important to note that you don’t necessarily get academic excellence in all private schools. Some are excellent where sport is concerned, and they all have a different ethos.

Thanks@MondaysChild7 for balancing that👍🏾

OP posts:

Original poster

Cheerfuldutch · 14/09/2022 10:26

Oblomov22 · 10/09/2022 07:00

Also agree re grammar.
Or stare independent. Not particularly suggesting you move to Surrey as such! but here there are loads of great independents - including St George's in Weybridge which is mixed and all girls schools like Sir William Perkins, both of which are superb.

All girls school! Hadn't even thought about that (all schools are mixed in the Netherlands). Thanks for sharing your experiences!

OP posts:

sashh · 14/09/2022 12:59

Cheerfuldutch · 14/09/2022 10:26

All girls school! Hadn't even thought about that (all schools are mixed in the Netherlands). Thanks for sharing your experiences!

Show quote history

A lot of grammars are single sex.

There are also state boarding schools you pay for the boarding, the government pay for the education.

Outd00rs · 28/12/2023 15:27

Sadly this is our experience too... gifted? No trouble in class?many teachers see this as a bonus and a free pass to ignore that child completely - they will teach themselves , get grades and make the school look good.... but at a state school of 1500 kids what can you expect really?..

extrastrongmints · 30/12/2023 06:45

Cheerfuldutch · 14/09/2022 10:20

@Popaholic, we have an idea of area we want to move to, but I find her attending a school that's good for her most important.
Thanks for the suggestion of scholarships and bursaries. So far I haven't had her IQ tested. The bell curve can go on infinitely so she won't be off-the-scale ;)
To me it makes sense to let her join Year 5 and prepare herself for those exams in Year 6. It will already be a bit more of a stretch by switching countries and schoolsystem.

Show quote history

UK schools (some of them - mainly the academically selective ones) deal fairly well with moderately gifted kids with index scores in the 130's. They don't deal well with kids who are 145+ (highly gifted).
The British system is rigid and the teaching profession here are biased against acceleration. Funding and government support for gifted education was discontinued in 2011 and this has impacted teacher training. Delivery models in private and grammar schools are mainly based around enrichment, not acceleration. This is a suboptimal approach, and based on ignorance and a false dichotomy, but the system won't change while your child is still in it. Acceleration (subject or whole year) is perfectly legal, just very uncommon, and it can be a hell of a job to persuade the principal (with whom all power over acceleration decisions rests) to do it.
Although the bell curve in theory extends infinitely, in practice you can get ceiling effects in tests even for kids with a (ceiling-limited) overall score in the 140's. Look up test ceilings on e.g. hoagies gifted website.
I'd suggest getting an assessment. If your child is scoring over 140 then the rigidity of the British system is likely going to be an issue for you. If lower, then an academically selective school (either private or grammar) could work OK.