In year transfer - Is it possible to get a spot in a school very far away

Justan0therm0ther · 2022-06-04T07:15:35+00:00

considering a move with my DS and DD, one in year 4 next year and one in year 1. the area we are considering is too far from their current school to consider commuting there. So we will have to do a in year transfer. *Does the council need to find you a state school option within a certain distance? *Or could they say, “sorry, no spots at any of these schools, only these one half hour away in the car”. i always thought schools always had spots, but I recently checked out Sutton for instance and they have a website that clearly indicates current availability for each year… and it’s mostly “no” across the board. The only few yes’s is schools which are very far away from the area we are looking. I’m now very worried that we could be moving to a house we love, but would need to start living a mini hell in the morning, having to drive the children far away… although we have picked an area with several primaries nearby… *Does the council need to find you a state school option within a certain distance?*

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Canyouengineerfreespeech · 04/06/2022 08:28

Council have to offer a school place. But it can be a long way from your home. They have to help with transport if the allocated school is more than a couple of miles away.

Canyouengineerfreespeech · 04/06/2022 08:29

Also, they are not obliged to offer the children places in the same school. We were allocated places in two schools in opposite directions when we moved.

ThatPosterIsSoRight · 04/06/2022 08:33

Year 1 is your difficulty because of infant class size constraints. We moved with a year 5 and year 6. There were no schools with year 6 spaces nearby, so admissions twisted the arm of my preferred school that had year 5 space to take an extra year 6.

SecondBestBed · 04/06/2022 08:33

Yes, your DC could easily be given places in different schools. How far are you moving?

orangeisthenewpuce · 04/06/2022 08:40

Council will offer a place at the nearest school that has a place. If it is over a certain distance (as measured by them, not you) it will give help towards transport costs. You can however apply for the schools nearest you even though they are full and when refused ask to go on waiting or expression of interest lists. You won't be able to go on these unless you've applied and been refused.

Original poster

Justan0therm0ther · 04/06/2022 10:16

Canyouengineerfreespeech · 04/06/2022 08:29

Also, they are not obliged to offer the children places in the same school. We were allocated places in two schools in opposite directions when we moved.

What happened then? Did you ask to be put on a waiting list? How long before you were assigned the final school option?

OP posts:

Original poster

Justan0therm0ther · 04/06/2022 10:17

ThatPosterIsSoRight · 04/06/2022 08:33

Year 1 is your difficulty because of infant class size constraints. We moved with a year 5 and year 6. There were no schools with year 6 spaces nearby, so admissions twisted the arm of my preferred school that had year 5 space to take an extra year 6.

Is there a period that is better than others to move, to have higher chances of getting a school spot at your favourite school?

OP posts:

Original poster

Justan0therm0ther · 04/06/2022 10:19

orangeisthenewpuce · 04/06/2022 08:40

Council will offer a place at the nearest school that has a place. If it is over a certain distance (as measured by them, not you) it will give help towards transport costs. You can however apply for the schools nearest you even though they are full and when refused ask to go on waiting or expression of interest lists. You won't be able to go on these unless you've applied and been refused.

Hi, what if the house is at the border of two councils? One house we saw is within catchment of a school in a different council/borough. Do you need to apply to two councils?

OP posts:

prh47bridge · 04/06/2022 10:30

Is there a period that is better than others to move, to have higher chances of getting a school spot at your favourite school?

No.

Hi, what if the house is at the border of two councils? One house we saw is within catchment of a school in a different council/borough. Do you need to apply to two councils?

Some councils tell you to apply direct to the school you want. However, if they tell you to apply to the council, you apply to the council where you live. If you want a school in a neighbouring borough, you name that school as one of your preferences.

As others have said, there is no obligation to find your children a state school within a certain distance, or to find places at the same school. However, as they are at primary school, statutory guidance is that a journey of up to 45 minutes each way is considered reasonable. If the journey to the allocated schools is longer than that, you have a case for appeal.

orangeisthenewpuce · 04/06/2022 11:03

@Justan0therm0ther Hi, what if the house is at the border of two councils? One house we saw is within catchment of a school in a different council/borough. Do you need to apply to two councils?

It depends. We forward oob (out of borough) applications on to the other council, and you can apply for schools in other boroughs at the same time as applying for local schools, but some let councils let you apply directly to them. As someone just pointed out, some schools ask you to apply directly to them. Ring your local admissions dept on Monday and they'll explain what their rules are. Everywhere is different.

orangeisthenewpuce · 04/06/2022 11:10

Is there a period that is better than others to move, to have higher chances of getting a school spot at your favourite school?

No because the only time you can get a place is when there is a space and there is never any way of knowing when a space will become available.

Aroundtheworldin80moves · 04/06/2022 11:24

What happened when we moved...
-applied for three nearest schools

one child offered a place, one not
contacted council, they confirmed that they were trying all schools in the area, going outwards from our address. Meanwhile we appealed for a place at the school that accepted one child.
a few weeks later offered a place at a school we didn't particularly like. With their help, we stalled as long as we could waiting for our appeal date, but she did have to start there a few days before the appeal date or we would have been classed as "home educating" due to refusing the place. She was given council transport to the school.
won appeal on grounds of application not processed properly

What we learnt...

its a lottery. We moved again a couple of years later, and same child spent one day on the waiting list for a very popular school as she was top whereas others had been on there for ages.

they only have to offer you one place. That is their obligation, however unsuitable it is. (Religion, distance, bad ofsted etc)

waiting lists are priority not time based

Good luck.

orangeisthenewpuce · 04/06/2022 12:37

Aroundtheworldin80moves · 04/06/2022 11:24

What happened when we moved...
-applied for three nearest schools

one child offered a place, one not
contacted council, they confirmed that they were trying all schools in the area, going outwards from our address. Meanwhile we appealed for a place at the school that accepted one child.
a few weeks later offered a place at a school we didn't particularly like. With their help, we stalled as long as we could waiting for our appeal date, but she did have to start there a few days before the appeal date or we would have been classed as "home educating" due to refusing the place. She was given council transport to the school.
won appeal on grounds of application not processed properly

What we learnt...

its a lottery. We moved again a couple of years later, and same child spent one day on the waiting list for a very popular school as she was top whereas others had been on there for ages.

they only have to offer you one place. That is their obligation, however unsuitable it is. (Religion, distance, bad ofsted etc)

waiting lists are priority not time based

Good luck.

Waiting lists can be actual waiting lists and kept in application order or they can be expression of interest lists where if a place becomes available all the applications are considered on admissions criteria order. Schools don't have to keep either if they don't want to.

TeenPlusCat · 04/06/2022 12:47

Waiting lists can be actual waiting lists and kept in application order or they can be expression of interest lists where if a place becomes available all the applications are considered on admissions criteria order. Schools don't have to keep either if they don't want to.

I don't think that's right. If a waiting list is kept and a place becomes available, it goes to the child highest up the criteria not the child who has been on the list longest.

Phineyj · 04/06/2022 15:18

I don't know if this applies to in year admissions, but don't you normally have to be living at an address in the relevant Borough before you can apply? Or is that just for 4+?

prh47bridge · 04/06/2022 16:04

orangeisthenewpuce · 04/06/2022 12:37

Waiting lists can be actual waiting lists and kept in application order or they can be expression of interest lists where if a place becomes available all the applications are considered on admissions criteria order. Schools don't have to keep either if they don't want to.

Show quote history

No, a waiting list for a state school in England can never be kept in application order. That would be a breach of the Admissions Code. They must be kept in admissions criteria order.

prh47bridge · 04/06/2022 16:05

Phineyj · 04/06/2022 15:18

I don't know if this applies to in year admissions, but don't you normally have to be living at an address in the relevant Borough before you can apply? Or is that just for 4+?

If a school has a place you can apply from wherever you live and they must offer it to you. You may have to apply through your local LA, but they must pass the application on to the school's LA. If the school deals with its own in-year admissions, you can apply direct to them from anywhere.

schooladmission · 04/06/2022 19:46

Hi

if you are looking at schools in Sutton, they will find you something. You will not be provided with transport as all children resident in London travel free on busses so anywhere you can reach by bus would be appropriate. If you live in Sutton there will be no schools within in the borough that you cannot reach by bus within what they will deem a reasonable time. Not sure what part of Sutton you will be but you can apply to other Local Authorities too and there may be schools closer to you with vacancies in those boroughs.

I am aware that places in Sutton are tighter than some other areas so you may be better off looking at other areas for a school place.

Some authorities will accept an application now for a place in September and it would get you on waiting lists - all-be-it from your current address to be updated when you move. Some will have a date before which they wont process a September application. You can apply to more than one authority (I suspect that all schools in Sutton and surrounding areas will be through the LA rather than the school itself - but you can check with the schools as they may have a supplementary form as well as the LA application).

If you have moved and can no longer feasibly travel to the old school, you new home authority will find you something - but it may not be a school of choice, or you may only get a preference for one if your children. The LA may discuss this with you if they can different preference schools but offer both of them an alternative.

There is often a bit more movement over the summer as many people will wait to move their children at the end of the academic year.

LittleMissA · 04/06/2022 20:02

We had to apply for an in year transfer when we moved when our DD was in yr 5. We applied to the 3 closest schools and none had space so we lodged an appeal for the one that would have been our catchment school. We weren't given another place but we're advised on a few schools we could try.

We hadn't moved really far (30min drive) so we kept DD at the school she was already going to and there was no point moving her to the ones they suggested we try as were same sort of drive just in the other direction. At least at her current school we had a childminder in place.

We luckily managed to win our appeal as we argued we just wanted DD to meet some of the local kids which she would soon be going up to secondary school with and settle into the area. They did a check on what school places were available and decided they were too far so made the school find her a place.