Year 2 - writing

[Bucks2015]

I’m looking for some advice to support my year 2 DD with writing. We were asked to book some
time with the teacher recently who explained that DC is very capable, but because of tight fit nature of the year 2 assessment she’d be working towards standard or even below key stage due to a few issues.

On writing she’s sometimes getting p and d backwards. We are practicing this at home and I’m hopeful we can get it sorted- when I ask her to write those letters she does it right, it’s when she’s writing a story/sentence she sometimes forgets.

The bit I’m more worried about is the spelling. She’s not consistently using the variety of spelling rules (eg ly, Ed at end of sentences) but there’s also no pattern in what she gets right or not, so it’s a broad refresh needed. I think alot
of it is about listening to the sounds and thinking about it, which she doesn’t do when she’s focused on writing a story/sentence. So far we’ve done a few worksheets (a bit dull), practised writing sone silly sentences and played some word games with tiles (eg how many words can you write from these letters in 5 minutes). I’ve also just discovered the night zookeeper which she was super keen on yesterday until I stupidly
called it a writing game! Interestingly, her spelling was much more accurate typing - presumably because she can’t type fast so is thinking about it. Sometimes apparently the spellings aren’t phonetically plausible either which is the below KS but (eg lettr, bottm). Any advice on what I can do to help and get her to think more about spelling whilst writing? She’s got no idea we’ve been spoken to about this.

We also got told the same could happen in maths as she’s getting 5s backwards sometimes. Im fairly confident we can sort this with a bit of extra practice and I can see it’s improved already in the last week - same issue above
though as still happens sometimes
when she’s focused on the sum rather than formation. No issues with the actual maths work.

No issues with reading or comprehension.

Teacher is great and I’m doing a follow up email to get some extra advice from her too, but just thought others who’ve had this might have some ideas. I’m also not wanting to put any pressure on Dc as fully aware she’s only just turned 7 and having looked into it more closely, I’m astounded the level of spelling rules they have to learn! I don’t mind about the designation, it’s more about putting her in a good place for KS2 as conscious once you fall behind can be hard to catch up and I don’t want her confidence or interested dented as she’s bright and generally interested in learning. Sorry for such a long post! I’ve spent loads of time looking at the various spelling rules and trying to shape something that is fun, effective and vaguely structured but feels like I’m going round in circles a bit.

One more point. This is slightly contentious and I think I'll leave the thread after making it as I really don't want an argument.

Ordinary school teachers often think their trained in dyslexia to an appropriate level but actual dyslexia specialists who deal with these issues every day will not agree. I'm in awe of my children's KS1 teacher in many ways but they were the dyslexia specialist within the school and offered nothing. They had MA degree and all the right appearances of being very experienced. They didn't think dd had dyslexia. They missed what I know now are clear signs. It didn't help that DD is compliant and caused no bother to anyone.

So we did nothing but tentatively booked a couple of sessions with two teachers who do nothing but specialise in the condition. Both advised unequivocally that there was an issue. Both said school teachers apply some good techniques randomly in a hit and run kind of way because that's all they have time for but it is not proper specialist support unless they are, say, actually taking the child out of class for significant amounts of time to work through something like the alpha and omega programme. Even for that, they'd be greatly helped by the recommendations that accompany an assessment.

I'm speaking as a lay parent who has been there. Yes the school is wonderful. No they will not necessarily say what you need to hear. Don't worry. Just get busy.

Just because your DD can do something that the ordinary person thinks dyslexics 'can't', it really doesn't mean she isn't somewhere on that spectrum.

I don't know anything about dyslexia, but what has really helped my DS who is not a natural at spelling in year 2 is DoodleSpell. It's a subscription app, and essentially they are supposed to do 5-7 questions a day (they take DS 2-3 minutes). It takes them systematically through all the spelling rules they are supposed to learn from year 1 up, and adjusts how much repetition they get based on what they get right / wrong. You can also set 'assignments' to go back over something when you notice a pattern of them getting something wrong. It does an initial assessment asking them to spell a range of words to work out what level they are - it doesn't assume they necessarily know all of the previous years' work.

DS has needed a level of repetition I think would have caused huge arguments if I'd tried to do it with workbooks, but he tolerates it with the app. He also doesn't seem to notice when I set it so he redoes bits because he's still getting them wrong, I'm not sure I'd get away with getting him to go back over old workbooks. His spelling has improved hugely.

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You can also do a very cheap Nessy evaluation that will indicate if an assessment might be helpful. I wouldn't discount the idea if she 'passes' though as it's very cursory. It did help us prepare for the probable diagnosis and give the push we needed to invest in an educational psychologist.

I second what @Steamoutmyears says above. I have the utmost respect and gratitude for the amazing and skilled job my DS's teachers do, without exception, but none of them (whisper it quietly, not even the Senco...) are experts in dyslexia - either in spotting it or supporting it. Especially when the presentation is on the subtle side. None of DS's - mostly very experienced -teachers spotted it and all reassured us repeatedly that he could not possibly be dyslexic. There were clear warning signs, though, if you knew what to look for, which luckily we did (to a small and limited degree) and I am so glad we trusted that knowledge and our gut feeling and had a precautionary assessment done at 7, against school's advice. So I agree, no need to worry (not even if she is dyslexuc) but it pays to be proactive and get in early. DS is doing well post-diagnosis btw, with better understanding from his teachers and specialist intervention outside school. He's "exceeding" across the board now (well, except SPAG ;-)) AND more importantly it did wonders for his self esteem and motivation to understand why he was finding certain things super frustrating and hard, and that it wasn't because he was stupid.

DS passed the Nessy screener btw, and the DEST screener at school. Screeners are a useful tool but not perfect especially if children are finding ways to compensate through their strengths. Full assessment by a qualified and experienced specialist assessor is the only way to be sure what is going on.

One other thing - my dyslexic DH took ages to see it. With hindsight, because he so very much wanted to be reassured that he hadn't passed on to DS this thing that had caused him so much difficulty throughout his life. I was the one reading up and ringing the alarm bells.

As a teacher even with a MA in special needs education I would never diagnose a child in anything as I am not qualified or say they haven't got a condition either. I will talk about issues with reading or spelling, maybe handwriting and fine motor skills then refer on for specialist support. I have had parents ask me outright and I have to say I have concerns in this area but cannot say what is causing them. This can be very frustrating for parents but I would rather do it this way than mis diagnose or not recognise need.

Thanks everyone.

@Cockerdileteeth what were the main signs in your case? I’ve looked at the standard lists and she doesn’t fit any of the criteria other than possibly this spelling one. The only other thing I can think is sometimes when she’s reading she’ll get similar words mixed up eg there and where and correct herself when she gets to the end of a sentence and realises it doesn’t make sense. She’ll also sometimes guess at longer words but gets it right when I pull her back to look properly - generally fluent and confident reader though and on chapter books.

Interesting point about your DH. Mine would certainly be the same as he’s had such a rough time with it and it still impacts him now. He asked at every pre-school and reception parents evening as he was so worried about it (with no evidence at that point).

@Bucks2015 pre school, had a few persistent muddled word pronunciations eg aminal for animal, was quite slow to "get" rhyme, didn't remember nursery rhymes and also found (finds) sequences hard to memorize, despite having a memory like an elephant's for most other things. Whdn he started Yr R, he loved books and stories, had a great spoken vocabulary and very much wanted to be able to read, and he did learn but it was just that it was more effortful than you'd have expected from his general ability. In year 1 and 2 handwriting and spelling were the biggies but also, with his reading he was very unobtrusively guessing from context and word shape quite a bit - it wasn't that obvious but was something the assessor picked up on. And reading stamina was and still is an issue - he officially has a reading age well ahead of his numerical age but he tires quickly or doesn't remember details he's read, because of the cognitive overload. Rote memorizing sequences is still a bugbear (times tables, I'm looking at you...). Though turns out his handwriting issues were mainly self-sabotage due to the poor spelling etc and it's improved rapidly since he understood about the dyslexia and stopped messing up his own work.

Thanks @Cockerdileteeth - will see what the teacher thinks initially and go from there. She’s very occasionally mentioned words moving on page so might try and casually find out more from her about that as it’s very infrequent and I don’t want to suggest things to her! Really appreciate all of the advice you’ve given.

Hello - thought I’d give a quick update in case it’s a help to anyone else who stumbles across this in the future. We worked with school across the end of 2 and year 3 to monitor the situation and they agreed it was worth getting the assessment done. She recently had this and she is indeed dyslexic - report is great with loads of useful suggestions to support her going forward. Thanks in particular to @Cockerdileteeth and @Steamoutmyears for your previous advice which helped us onto this path. It feels a little daunting right now but I’m glad we know relatively early