what to look for in primary school, what questions did you ask

[rigkiuowbskjs]

Just started looking around primaries for Sept 2022 entry but would be great to get any insight from other parents into what you think is important when it comes to picking a school. I've had a look at results, proximity and general atmosphere. Obviously like every parents, I would like my child to do well and have a lovely time. Results matter but I guess not at the expense of everything else. What else did everyone else look for? What sort of questions did you ask?

We are currently looking. Saw one today and to be honest you will "just know" as cliched as that sounds. For me, I was seeing how well engaged the children were, how work was celebrated, what enrichment opportunities are available, breakfast / after school club. How they differentiate the lessons and their stance on behaviour and bullying.

The one I saw today just didn't feel right. The more you see, the more you will be able to benchmark.

Good luck.

you will "just know" as cliched as that sounds

I found this was absolutely the case. Looked around three. First two were good on paper and ticked boxes (one of them was the outstanding school everyone wanted to get into so I was assuming I would love it,, but didn't particularly) but when we came out of the third DH and I were almost in tears, we loved it so much. It was really inconvenient as well because it was the furthest away!

In terms of what I was asking/ looking for - my priority was how child-centred the early years classes were. How important was learning through play? How well did the school support additional needs and also how well did they support brighter children? Did the classrooms seem designed for children? (the one we chose had toilets in the infant school classrooms). Was there good access to outdoor space (the one we chose was all on one level and every classroom had doors out to an outside space, also lots of playing fields, and they did Forest School every Wednesday)?

I agree. When I asked about supporting additional needs for all abilities, the focus was heavily on SEN. No mention of how they stretch the more able children, so that is definitely an excellent question to ask.

EYFS should also be predominantly about learning through play. The first school I looked at how just created a brand new reception classroom with canopied outdoor space and it was very much child led which really is the best way children of this age learn.

I didn’t really look for learning through play. My DD needed more structured learning. Every child is not the same so you need your list of priorities by evaluating your own child. Some children who start school need more time to settle and play but others don’t. I’m not sure how you teach reading and writing through play.

Looking at results tells you how good other DC are and might tell you how engaged the parents are! Look at the government stats on progress for meaningful info. Look at free school meals stats and how many are SEN? If they are high numbers, what do you think about that?

Are work displays good? Are the classrooms well resourced? Are children engaged? Do they have a library? Plenty of clubs for the older children? A busy parent body? Will you fit in? Are the parents like you? What do they think of the school? Do you like the teachers you meet? Do you feel confident the school is well run and has high quality teaching? What’s the head like? Is the learning environment stimulating? Is there an interesting curriculum? Does it feel plodding and stale?

Very few schools have toilets attached to classrooms in my experience. Also don’t forget when DC are in juniors, what you wanted at 4 might not be relevant. Older children needs might include better sport, music opportunities, drama and great art for example.

Very interesting insights from everyone. Will have to sit down and think a bit more about what we are looking for in a school. Results are obviously important but so is a happy child. It's a bit annoying because DH's position is basically 'whatever makes you happy dear' which is infuriating ;-)

Most DC are happy in YR! When they become discerning, you might get some issues you had t thighgt about right now. . A teacher they don’t gel with, not getting into the race they targeted at sports day, friendship conflicts, not being in the top table, finding work a challenge etc. Therefore keeping them happy will be over 7 years! So whatever you do, look at the whole school. Not just what suits in YR.

Definitely agree with TizerorFizz, it's very important to have a long view. The point made above about displays is a good one especially for older years, is good achievement celebrated beyond a weekly award, and on the wall as an example to self and others, do they display work to inspire.

I’m not sure how you teach reading and writing through play

It's a bit of a derailment to the point of the thread, sorry, but by learning through play I don't mean just putting toys out and letting the kid rip - I mean having a range of activities out on tables and free flow between them, and adults on hand to extend learning where necessary and provide "teachable" moments - perhaps children are playing in the home corner that they are having a party - why don't we make some birthday cards? What do we normally put in birthday cards? Yes, you could have a go at writing your name couldn't you?

Hardly any school will be doing that kind of thing in Reception all the time, and I would expect the amount of freeflow to go down over the course of the year, but I was looking for somewhere that understood this form of teaching, that had a strong mix of this alongside more formal phonics/ maths, and really followed the child's lead.

I do agree though that you look at what is best for your child, and also of course look at higher up the school, although the school we chose was an infant school.

We found it was like buying a house - very personal and a gut feeling more than something you can do pros and cons on paper.
Same at secondary - we loved the vibe at the big flourishing comp much more than the second rate rather dismal private and the very strict grammar - but we know people who made other choices and were equally happy.
If school is an extension of what you try and do at home then you will pick up on a feeling that suits your family ethos.

Trust
Your
Gut

Biggest thing I've learnt. Infant school I just knew they would fit in there - the Head knew every child, there was a buzz and joy about the place - and the school turned out to be fantastic for them.

Unfortunately the linked Junior school I had wobbles about from the outset - I really really tried to warm to it, tried to warm to the head, tried to quiet the voice in my head by saying it was going to seem less nurturing because of being a junior only and that transitioning along with peers was the big thing. It was an absolute disaster. Bullying rife, Head would deny there was any problem and manage out any complaining parents and a year from hell with a teacher who just hated DD2 and didn't believe in special needs did untold damage.

We got them out - into a small school where things are very nurturing, the Head really knows the kids (again - a theme) and is a big kid himself basically, and the damage is beginning to be undone once more. MN as a whole doesn't like small schools - but it was definitely what DD2 in particular needed, and DD1 was a more difficult situation because of her year group being freakishly big (there mustn't have been much on telly that year) but she's beginning to settle and does seem to be thriving with the mixed-age classes meaning she's now the top class and responsible lot!

I found looking on websites at the letters home and newsletters was a semi-decent way of getting a feel for the schools - there are schools where the newsletters are just a list of moans and what the parents are doing "wrong" and then there are some which are positive and bubbly.

You def get a feel. We looked around 5 schools. 2x outstanding, 2x good and our inadequate catchment school.

We both far preferred the two good schools than the two outstanding ones. We positively disliked one of the outstanding ones. It just felt cold, the displays on the walls were awful & clearly very old. The school was laid out oddly. The headteacher was very formal, very proud of her reception class having mostly structured learning (awful in my opinion), she banged on & on about behaviour & covid policies & the focus on ‘the important stuff’, reading, writing & maths. Art & ‘the creative stuff’ were ‘valuable but not a focus’ 😒😒 she sounded like bloody Boris 🤦🏼‍♀️

The other outstanding school was lovely. I’d have been fine with it but it just didn’t have the same energy, warmth, nurturing environment that the two good schools had. In both these schools, the head teachers exuded enthusiasm & passion for the children. They knew every child’s name & they talked about the importance of each individual & childhood. Reception in both schools was heavily play based (which is not just a free for all as a PP suggests), which was important to us. Each school had beautiful displays bursting with the children’s artwork. And from the schools websites, you could see they continue to be creative with learning all the way up to yr6. Our eventual headteacher spoke of the culture of listening to every single child’s voice & supporting each child to fulfil their own potential. Be that excelling in maths or music.

Tough call between the two for us but we went for the one with the marginally better rep locally. Facebook is also your friend. I found community groups & searched for people asking questions about each school. On there I found loads of posts & comments about the schools, you could a vibe from it.

Also consider if you need wrap around care, if after school clubs are important. Consider how you’ll get your child there. We are out of catchment so have to drive but it’s 5/6 minutes down the road & no bother. Consider if you prefer a very traditional school ethos with high results focus or if you’d rather your kid was nurtured for who they are & what they are interested in. Because there is a definite difference. And there is no right or wrong there, we all think differently!

I do understand what learning through play is. Thanks for your explanation though @TheSpiral

Some DC do need this for more time than others in YR. others benefit from far more directed activities based on the YR curriculum objectives. I was happy with the latter.

In the same way, DC who are SEN might need more nurturing. Mine didn’t need this. Some small schools make transition to secondary more challenging. Very many DC are confident and need more of a challenge. So that’s why the needs of each child should be evaluated. You might “go with your gut” but if that excludes your child’s needs, it’s pointless.

My thoughts are very similar to @TizerorFizz and I looked at all the things she mentioned.

I was most put off by the local outstanding school which did a tour with more than 20 couples simultaneously and focused the entire time on EYFS yet nothing about the next 6 years they are in school. Not a mention of SEN, how able children are stretched, barely a mention of extra curricular activities and nothing on secondary transfer. I was looking for the next 7 years and wanted to know how things are dealt with later on as that is where there is more likely to be a problem.

It was clear to me my DD also needed more structured learning than predominantly play and we chose accordingly

Thank you so much for everyone's replies. Lots of food for thought - and it's great to get some many different perspectives. I definitely forget that they'll be going to a school over the next seven years and it's not all about reception.

If you can, see what you think of the older pupils when they come out of school and take a peep in their classrooms if you can. It all builds up a picture of what a school is like. Good luck!

I went to a good primary school. This is a list of things to find out about on a visit (take DC if possible too).

Exam results
Level of staff turnover and experience
Homework
After school activities and events etc
Bullying
Class numbers
Quality of the school in question
Pupil ability
Displays and work done
Food
Opinions on the school
Your thoughts

That list has some huge issues in it. When I was a governor I would know most of that but as a prospective parent you really won’t know.

Sats results are on the government web site. 11 plus results are not. Ability of the pupils??? Who will tell you x number are low achievers and x number are doing really well? Only the teachers who assess the children know this and they won’t discuss progress of children on roll with prospective parents. What other exams might there be? Prep schools will publish school destinations and scholarships.

Level of staff turnover won’t be told to parents nor the experience of staff. You can see who is a NQT but not details of experience. Some experienced teachers might not be that great either. Anti bullying policies are published but not info about individuals who bully or are bullied. Quality of school? Ofsted or hearsay? In whose opinion?

Anyone choosing a school has to be realistic about what info can be obtained. Some of the above just isn’t possible but existing parents might have an opinion of course! Ask away.