What's the typical level for Reception education?

[Adriana87]

Hi all
My son just started school and is currently doing settling in days. The teacher mentioned to myself and other parents some very basic achievements such as: being able to count to 20, recognise shapes and pronounce the alphabet phonetically.

My son turned 4 in April and has a speech delay but can read an entire book (basic words of course) and do addition and subtraction. He also recognises all numbers up to 1,000.

I was taken a little back as I thought they would be teaching stuff a bit more advance. Am I wrong?

My son has also had the witches read to him and didn't find that scary either. On the other hand he finds grand master grim from go jetters scary. Kids are odd.

I don't think reception children need extending. My 4 year old is good with phonics but is happy to do the phonics learning as they learn the jolly phonics songs so it's fun. Yesterday they were ordering things with numbers 1-10 and to him it was just a game. They'll learn enough at home from books, play and just general life.

If they're bored and playing up then I'd speak to the teacher but if they're happy I'd let them get on with it.

Those of you with toddlers reading, how do you find books for them?

I wasn't an early reader but I was way ahead of my peer group at secondary (I only know this because the school had us take some sort of reading / vocabulary test and my score was off the scale) this meant I read a lot of books that were not really suitable, eg I read 1984 when I was 11 and looking back it was not at all suitable.

At this stage, I assume teacher is still assessing children's ability. So the work they give children may not be differentiated yet.

You may need to speak with the teacher about his ability if he is speech delayed and if he may not be able to show it.
I would wait for him to settle, and after maybe the half term, ask to have meeting with teacher regards things not just academic but also about how they are going to help him with speech delay and other concerning factors.

@NerrSnerr

They read George's Marvellous Medicine to year 1s at my school. I wouldn't say that was scary at all- the children find it funny. The Witches is scary in my opinion.

Mine found it scary. She didn't like the mean Grandma and all the talk of crunching up bugs in cabbage! But they're all different. She loved Fantastic Mr Fox.

Loads of children love The Grinch at Christmas, and find it really funny. It terrifies my child.

DD has just started reception in an academically selective prep school. They opt out of EYFS as they select children who they can see will have covered it before they finish preschool. Assessment is similar to @IHateCoronavirus description of the teddies so they stretch to see how much they know on a 1-1 level as well as testing their gross/fine motor skills through watching them play, cutting, colouring etc

DD is not anywhere of the Witches/Dickens levels described above but one thing her school are very firm about is that reading material needs to be appropriate. Head was very clear that reading is much more than reading the words - comprehension is the skill they need to master - as other pp have said this includes understanding the vocabulary in context, inference, grammatical knowledge, cultural knowledge etc. She was explicitly clear a young child reading something like Dickens/Witches is pointless. She stated all children in the school will be able to accurately read what is on the page by mid way through reception but none would understand what they were reading and if any were exceptional and did so, it is poor judgement on parents part to expose them to the content of a book intended for a much older child.

DD is not exceptional but is definitely above average. I put her in this school because my experience in primary was similar to @PennyWus describes - I was consistently under challenged to the point where I lost the motivation and drive to learn. She is not as advanced as OP describes her son but reads to average Y1 level, knows numbers to 100 and confident with bonds for 1-10 so more than most in reception - I have confidence her school will stretch her strengths further whilst also ensuring her social communication skills develop. I acknowledge I am extremely fortunate that we can afford to send her there

@sashh

Those of you with toddlers reading, how do you find books for them?

I wasn't an early reader but I was way ahead of my peer group at secondary (I only know this because the school had us take some sort of reading / vocabulary test and my score was off the scale) this meant I read a lot of books that were not really suitable, eg I read 1984 when I was 11 and looking back it was not at all suitable.

It's tough isn't it.

I was a huge reader as a child and my mother always tells me how in Year 6 my teacher asked her to take me to the own library because the (very small then, early 90s) school library wasn't challenging me at all. I also remember her being really cross my with my Grandma who had been babysitting me and told me to help myself to her bookshelf when I was late primary age. My mum returned to find me halfway through a thoroughly inappropriate for my age due to the topic Catherine Cookson book. Oops. Didn't scar me for life though. Still, I wouldn't give my child a book like that.

Toddler/young child wise we tend to just 'age up' a bit. There are so many good children's books that aren't picture books these days but also aren't at the stage of chapter books. We've got lots of Julia Donaldson, The Oi range, some Jill Murphy - I tend to look for some I recognised from my childhood too.

sassh - Reading Chest subscription is great. We worked through Songbirds with DD (bought the box of 1-4), and now get new books weekly-fortnightly with Reading Chest. DD loves the novelty of post addressed to her, too.

My dd was reading and understanding Heidi at 4.
No pictures. She had never done phonics before that and just read using sight words. She was an amazing reader by 4. I am a teacher who has taught hundreds of children to read over the years but genuinely she seemed to be born knowing how to read.. But she just joined in with the rest of the class as emotionally she was 4 and needed to be with children of her own age and have fun and play , be creative and take turns and all the other stuff that's important in a class. Academic stuff is only a part of school ...there is so much more to learn.

@MeredithGreyishblue

Dickens is in no way suitable reading for a 4 year old.

Some strange bragging goes on here. My goodness.

Really odd isn't it?

Dc1 was great reading easily could have been reading at 4.0yo. As could blend cvc at 3.5yo. I thought school.would be ifferent and be able to move her on at her pace. They didnt and she had to read every book on the scheme at the bottom level. Also.annoying that even if you had to do this she could have done it in about a week but school drag it out over all reception year. Anyway by feb we used reading chest and so before 5.0yo shw was fluent enough to read pippi longstocking. Her comprehension also very good.

It is true though that other kids catch up with reading. Or at least they do at dc school as per the above they are not good at extending the able. Dc is still reading several years ahead but there is no advice or direction from school. (Good in some ways as dc is particular about books.)
It was more about dc than me though as dc2 isnt as good.

I dont think the line of oh the kid needs to.work.on social skills is very helpful. Dc1 certsinly did need to.work.on it but still struggles now at 9.

It's just some.kids need things repeated several times and others once. So affects how quickly they have learnt. (Dc2 was great with digraphs by jan of reception but for whatever reason not given those in books so keeps forgetting them! That wouldnt happen with dc1. Dc2 also.forgets/doesnt listen to you telling her the wrd so still doesnt know it later in the same book.
Conversely dc1 couldnt remember number bonds easily. Dc2 is very fast at.them.
Its a 60 intake school and imo setting for reading and maths across both classes would probably suit the kids better.
I do think most kids can count and recognise up to 30 when starting reception at least locally. Certainly as 50% have older siblings.

@Itsnotover

Actually, I have a question for anyone who feels kind enough to answer it….

In reception, should children be bringing home reading books that they need help with?

When dd2 (now aged 17) was in reception a parent moved their child to another school because they said that school should only send books home that a child needs help with.

My daughter has just gone into Y1, at our school, they bring home books one level easier than they read at school. This is for practicing fluency and grasping understanding, and for the pure enjoyment of it.

They read harder books at school to focus on the phonics etc.

@HSHorror this was my experience of primary. I was a fluent reader at the start but was told I needed to work on social skills and given no further reading whilst everyone else caught up so I could develop social skills.

I have no doubt my social skills needed work (I am a summer baby) but completely setting aside the skills I did have left me frustrated and I lost love for reading as a result.

I think dc1 would have liked a stretching on the reading in reception. As ive seen some state schools give 2 books 5 times a week.
Academically selective though most likely picks the eldest dc so nearer 5yo.

Eldest DC is definitely the experience in DD's intake and I feel COVID heavily influenced this as the older ones had more time in nursery/preschool prior to the assessment.
Older year groups have a more even mix of children born across the year

Your child sounds like a genius. My four year old can recognise his name written down, kind of write it, do some basic addition and subtraction and count to 100, but your child sounds way ahead!

My daughter could write her name at a year old. By two, she was adding and subtracting single numbers, reading the Worst Witch books alone, and using reasoning for why she deserved an extra biscuit. By three, she could could do long division and mastered the entire Harry Potter book series. By four, she was taking her Maths GCSE, arguing with her older cousin on whether we should keep first past the post voting system or introduce a variation on proportional representation, writing an essay about the EU and it's relationship with Britain in the 2020s, and playing Chopin's Piano Sonata in B Flat Minor.

I jest of course.

But the competitive parenting on this thread is silly.

In Scandinavia there's no formal schooling until 6/7.

Why can't we let our children play and figure out the world that way?

So he will catch up with his speech and they will learn to read/count, all will be well.

While I completely agree that socialisation etc is important, it’s also important that they understand where each child is in terms of their learning.

I felt that it shouldn’t have been a surprise that, during the presentation about Christmas, dd1 asked a question that showed she’d been reading the text on the slides which the teacher had assumed none of the YR children could read.

Why can't we let our children play and figure out the world that way?

Because for children whose inclination is reading (or maths, or whatever else) it feels intuitively right to offer more resources in that direction, if that’s how they choose to figure out the world. The same way that I’d take a child with great physical dexterity and, I don’t know, teach them to ride a bike or try out different sports to see what grabbed their interest.

My child has always been into food - easiest kid to wean ever. So whenever it was feasible I tried to build on that, introduce her to new foods, have her cook with me etc. It interested her, she enjoyed it - why not? A friend’s son is hugely into volcanoes, so she has lots of volcano-themed resources around the place.

I’m not sure how I feel at this point, with regard to the thread. My daughter is 4. Early September birthday, so in a (lovely) nursery for another year. Reading (and understanding) at around Y1 level. We’re a bilingual family, so she can do the same in DH’s language (non Latin alphabet). Very verbal and afaik also meeting all social expectations for her age. So in a year she’ll go up to reception and by the end of the year be expected to, what, read “The cat sat on the mat”, because that’s the outcome level of reception? I don’t think she’s gifted - it’s perhaps some innate intelligence combined with a particular home environment and a mainstream skill that’s easy to identify and build on - but I’m battling to understand how this will interact with school. And then when you suggest on here (and perhaps to the school, hopefully not) that that’s where your child is at, you get raised eyebrows.

But the competitive parenting on this thread is silly.

I agree. I don't get what people want from this thread when they post about how advanced their children are . Your child may or may not be reading chapter books and doing trigonometry when they start school at 4, but truly no one is going to care much except you. They will most likely be one child in a class of 30, alongside other children who may not be school-ready, may not be properly toilet-trained and may have behavioural or developmental issues. Gettting the whole class to the point where they can read "The cat sat on the mat" may represent a huge achievement for the teacher. Given other systems don't even start formal schooling until much later, I don't think we're expecting too little of our children overall as a group.

@IHateCoronavirus
I really liked your post, until the last bit:
"The first question I always want answering when I hear “x can read fluently and knows all of their numbers up to 10,002” is “how are their social, emotional and communicative skills?”"

If you had a very socially/emotionally mature child, your first question wouldn't be "but can they count to 10?" There seems to be a bit of an assumption that a child who is very able academically is likely to be behind in other respects.

Obviously all children have strengths and weaknesses, and it's unlikely that the child will be ahead in very single aspect of their development, but this instinctive reaction seems very unfair. I think there's sometimes also a bit of an assumption that a child who is reading is doing so because someone has pushed them and not allowed them to develop naturally. In DD's case, it was very much child-led.

I am slightly horrified at the number of teacher friends who have actively discouraged their children from reading early (when the child has been showing a real interest), and I think it is because of the negative attitude some of their colleagues hold towards early readers.

That depends what you mean by y1 level?
As in dc1 class at least one other kid was reading chapter books.
The ort chart is probably a bit in accurate now as by end of y1 the target at school was band 7 turquoise. And lots of free readers year 2.
Reception was bad but i think that depends on the school. Ours it's TA doing the listening to them. And teschers only once a term.
Now with phonics kids can learn young and quickly. Some schools seem to try to keep the books at a certain pace with all of yr r reading at the same level ( or almost all). Other year groups vary more.
Our preschool didnt teach any sounds or numbers really. All free play.
I just see certainly reception as just getting the books the school gives but ignoring then if they arent right and working at dc pace. They can't really know what a dc is capable of in a class of 30 with only listening 6 times a year. What is i guess more annoying is the in class groupings. As dc2 will be grouped with kids who dont know the digraphs (when she has been able to do them 8m). I have tried to raise her getting the wrong books but was ignored. She insisted on sounding out every sound when she was able to read words. Though that shouldnt have held her back as it's meant to be aligned with phonic knowledge not fluency.

The statistics are that eldest in the year do better (on average) as they are more ready to learn.

Also the oxford parent surely it's because it intelligence is partly inherited so the dc have inherited the maths ability. My 9yo could probably work out the seconds in a year. Well the theory and then the calculation on paper. (Primary maths actually gets quite stretching from y4.

If you had a very socially/emotionally mature child, your first question wouldn't be "but can they count to 10?" There seems to be a bit of an assumption that a child who is very able academically is likely to be behind in other respects.

Yes! Thank you! So tedious and narrow minded.

In Scandinavia there's no formal schooling until 6/7.

My Y1 aged son only had 2 months of formal schooling and since then he's been home educated. We don't do any formal sit down lessons and he has ample opportunity to play all day if he wants to. He mostly chooses to read or practise numbers - often Incorporated within his play, but he's still a lot further ahead academically of his cousins who are at school.

Play doesn't mean they don't pick up these things. An early reader hasn't necessarily been drilled by an overzealous parent who doesn't encourage play.