I have my Infant Class Size appeal tomorrow, nervous!

[Maxine3477]

I'm really nervous as I have my infant class size appeal tomorrow. It's happening on Zoom.
Anyone recently won this type of appeal?
I'm appealing on grounds of safety (we live in hiding from ex husband who threatened to kill me and abduct our son). Need to keep son close to home (this school is 5 minutes walk from home).
Also appealing for a school with wrap around care (the allocated one doesn't have this).
Also appealing for a non Roman Catholic school. (the allocated school is RC and had very heavy emphasis on RC practices and church things, takes up a big chunk of the school day). The teacher has said my son can be excused (which I appreciate), but this would just make him stand out as being "different". Could lead to bullying etc.
Do my chances sound remotely hopeful? lol. I know I won't sleep tonight with all the stress of the appeal :(

Are you appealing under the unreasonable category presumably? The threshold is extremely high. Remember you are appealing FOR a school not against the allocated school iyswim. The religion thing doesn't hold much sway - where I am anyway. Do you have supporting documents from police/social services or similar to back up why he needs this particular school in order to keep him safe?

I've appealed twice, it's a daunting process but the panel and chair are usually lovely ime.

@ShowOfHands

Are you appealing under the unreasonable category presumably? The threshold is extremely high. Remember you are appealing FOR a school not against the allocated school iyswim. The religion thing doesn't hold much sway - where I am anyway. Do you have supporting documents from police/social services or similar to back up why he needs this particular school in order to keep him safe?

I've appealed twice, it's a daunting process but the panel and chair are usually lovely ime.

I've submitted all the original police and court paperwork, along with report of ex's violent attack on me and theats to abduct. No "recent" paperwork, the will ONLY get involved if my ex re-surfaces and issues more threats. Every chance he might do as he knows the area of the allocated school and has friends whose kids go there!

Every chance he might do as he knows the area of the allocated school and has friends whose kids go there!

Then this is your argument. The wrap around care and the religion thing is not relevant - you’re not appealing against the school you’ve been allocated and your childcare issues are yours, not theirs.

I’m assuming that the school you’ve been allocated you didn’t apply for and this is below your top 3 choices. Are you on the waiting list for your other choices?

@PotteringAlong

Every chance he might do as he knows the area of the allocated school and has friends whose kids go there!

Then this is your argument. The wrap around care and the religion thing is not relevant - you’re not appealing against the school you’ve been allocated and your childcare issues are yours, not theirs.

I’m assuming that the school you’ve been allocated you didn’t apply for and this is below your top 3 choices. Are you on the waiting list for your other choices?

I'll definitely mention about my ex having friends whose kids attend the allocated school. Don't want to name the kids or their parents though because, in all honesty, they are innocent people but I know they are in contact with him.

I know they'll say the wrap around care is my issue not theirs, but I'm a single parent with NO family to help and I NEED to work. It's a catch 22.

Religion - the preferred school is CofE, without a militant RC doctrine that encroaches on big chunks of the school day. It's not good for a child's wellbeing or hopes of integration to have an unfamiliar religion thrust upon them with no choice in the matter.

No, didn't apply for the allocated school. I deliberately avoided RC school (so they allocated one!) :-/
Yes, on waiting list for all 3 choices.

I don't know much about this at all, but I just want to echo the suggestion to focus on the safety/security issues.

Wrap around care is massively not the schools problem and lots of parents would struggle with it.

Defo don't emphasise the religious arguments, for all you know someone on the panel could be a practising catholic and you massively get their back up.

The only thing that's relevant is that the allocate school is a security risk. You'll undermine myself if you dilute the issue by listing other reasons the school isn't to your personal taste.

This is going to be one of those cases which panel members hate. They are theoretically confined by the infant class size regulations, when they have a case which under a normal admission appeal would have a strong case of being successful. Panels normally look favourably on situations like yours where there is a danger to you and to your child.
The only advice I can give you is to go into the appeal with any original documents that show your potential issue with ex husband. Panels will need to be convinced that there is a real danger here and whilst you should mention everything else, the key is that the panel needs to consider above anything else whether the admission authority is being unreasonable in not believing that there is a real potential for you being put into a dangerous position. Under normal circumstances the panel would want to see and feel any documents even though you have already submitted copies etc from police, social services etc but on Zoom that is not really possible. It will do no harm however to be seen on camera with a wedge of documents around the situation and be confirming to the panel that there is still a real threat.
I can only hope that you are able to convince the panel to look slightly further than the theoretical narrow constraints of the ICS regs and award a place

@admission

This is going to be one of those cases which panel members hate. They are theoretically confined by the infant class size regulations, when they have a case which under a normal admission appeal would have a strong case of being successful. Panels normally look favourably on situations like yours where there is a danger to you and to your child. The only advice I can give you is to go into the appeal with any original documents that show your potential issue with ex husband. Panels will need to be convinced that there is a real danger here and whilst you should mention everything else, the key is that the panel needs to consider above anything else whether the admission authority is being unreasonable in not believing that there is a real potential for you being put into a dangerous position. Under normal circumstances the panel would want to see and feel any documents even though you have already submitted copies etc from police, social services etc but on Zoom that is not really possible. It will do no harm however to be seen on camera with a wedge of documents around the situation and be confirming to the panel that there is still a real threat. I can only hope that you are able to convince the panel to look slightly further than the theoretical narrow constraints of the ICS regs and award a place

The appeals team manager at the council has advised me that even when an infant class size is already at 30, the panel has the power to admit extra children (if it sees fit, if parents win at appeal). I understand 30 can be increased in exceptional circumstances. Even though the appeal will be heard on Zoom, I've emailed all the supporting documents from police and courts etc over for the panel's attention, so they'll be aware. But I'll have the hard copies to hand just for my own reference tomorrow.

@Maxine3477 how did you get on?

[quote PotteringAlong]@Maxine3477 how did you get on?[/quote]
Sorry for the late reply. The appeal hearing seemed to go quite well thanks. The 3 panels members appeared extremely sympathetic and even referred to my son's case (regarding fleeing domestic violence etc) as "Exceptional circumstances". The school representative didn't really say much, he just kept repeating "Sorry, we already have 30 children..". The panel seemed very genuine and touched by the circumstances and about how we are having to live in hiding (all documented with supporting evidence from the police and courts). The only reason I didn't mention these circumstances at the time of applying was in naive ignorance (first time parent) and also because the school was right on the doorstep (5 minutes walk from home) I just naively "took it for granted" that my child would get a place. Not getting a place never even entered my mind tbh at the time of application, so that's why I didn't provide all this information back them. The panel seemed satisfied with this explanation. They asked me about if I work (I replied yes and expanded a bit on that). They also asked the school rep he'd been made aware of these "exceptional circumstances" at the time of application, would my child have been given a place. He replied "we would have needed to have a discussion", but possibly.
The panel said my outcome decision will be sent by email in 7 days.
Now just a very nerve-wracking wait!

Fingers crossed

@PotteringAlong

Fingers crossed

Thank you! :) I'll let you know x

I'm a panel member. From what you have said you appear to have a convincing case given the circumstances. I hope the LA were able to send the panel photo-copies of all your documents.

@eddiemairswife

I'm a panel member. From what you have said you appear to have a convincing case given the circumstances. I hope the LA were able to send the panel photo-copies of all your documents.

Hi edddiemairswife, Yes the panel assured me that they'd had copies of all the supporting evidence/paperwork I'd sent to the council at the time of lodging the appeal. All the paperwork relates to the domestic abuse at the time and immediate aftermath, I've not obtained anything more "recent" as the police/courts will only get involved if my ex tracks us down and starts threatening/abusing us again. Also, do you think (under the circumstances and the reasons I explained earlier in this thread about not mentioning all this at the time of application), it could go against me? Only reason I didn't mention it because, to be honest, the possibility of NOT getting a place at the school on our doorstep didn't even cross my mind! As a panel member, would "failure to disclose" these circustmances at the point of application be likely to go against me? Also, if the legal limit for ICS is 30 children, how does this work if MORE than 30 children end up in the class (eg, if 1 or more win appeals)? Would the school be breaking the law? Sorry for all the questions, I'm a first time parent have have never had to navigate anything like this before!

In my LA documents submitted at the time of application for the health/social should have a letter from a healthcare professional or social worker stating that in their opinion the school is the only school that the child can attend.

Unfortunately I didn't have anything like that. Social services etc aren't involved, I've been managing the risk myself, just by bei g careful and living in hiding. No authorities have been involved for about 3 years. Do you think I might still stand a chance?

You might stand a chance but it depends very much on the appeal panel. If they stick to the rules they will reject your appeal. However, you may get a sympathetic panel that is willing to bend the rules in a case like this.

If you aren't successful, you could ask to be considered under the Fair Access Protocol for your authority.

It is a special panel of officers which sits to consider certain situations that would risk children missing education. Our LA would consider your case via this panel.

If you go to your LA's website and search 'Fair Access Protocol' it should come up. Follow the guidance and contact them.

Any news yet? Xx

No not yet. Hopefully on Thursday or Friday x

I've won the appeal! Got the decision letter this morning x

I just want to say that that is fantastic news.

I don't know anything about school appeals but I am so glad you and your child will feel safer.

Also I am not religious but my children go to a religious school and honestly all the time doing religious based stuff has definitely had a negative impact on what they can cover academically.

Congratulations- it's heartening to hear cases where it makes a difference can be upheld.

So pleased for you , celebration time!

Oh that’s great. Hurray!