Any dsylexia experts on here?

[Teacher12345]

DS has received his report this week and for almost everything, is at the correct age or above. The one thing he isn't and always has been behind on is writing.
From late reception onwards I have questioned dsylexia for a number of reasons.

1. He sometimes does letters and numbers in mirror image.
2. His handwriting is quite poor, even for his age.
3. He is so slow at writing things.
4. He is very articulate, intelligent - can tell you all sorts of things you never knew, picks things up quickly and has excellent understanding - but cannot produce a piece of writing without alot of prompting and support.
5. His Dad and Grandad (plus 3 people on my side) have dsylexia (plus dad is dyspraxic) and I know it runs in familes.
6. He is very clumsy, poor balance, poor co-ordination/spacial awareness. All things that link to dyspraxia which is often diagnosed with dyslexia.

So far the school have said to wait until year 3 (which he goes into in September) but I have heard from others that the school are reluctant to test for it even then because of cost.
The poor kid also has very poor sight in one eye and tinnitus so these things plus the fact that he is left handed have all been used to explain his shortfalls so far. My reason for pushing back on this though, is that he is doing so well in all other areas and it is just his writing. His teacher even wrote to me today, that he has some great idea's that he articulates so well, but then when asked to write it down, it becomes simplified and takes much longer than it should.

Does this sound like dyslexia or a disinterest in the subject?

I d be considering whether it's worth investigating dyspraxia from what you've described considering he sounds like he's got the knowledge there verbally but there's a clear disconnect with what he's getting down on paper.

Do you have the option to go down the private route? (check the LA would accept that though) I got diagnosed at 10 in 2005 and waiting lists weren't anywhere near as bad as I've heard they are now but that took a fair few months of my parents fighting for it, unfortunately it could be much worse than that now.

Your list are all related to dyslexia but it's hard to say from a paragraph. If he goes into yr 3 I would push for him to be tested. If not and you can afford to look at private testing.

I'm dyslexic and come from a family that are. When they measure they will look at intelligence and how the practical side meets up. In dyslexia it is a larger discrepancy.

I was fortunate that my parents always had lots of books in house and would read to us or got us audio books. They took us out to museums and heritage sites. I think this really helped. My handwriting is still poor, but this is less of issue as computers have developed and I've developed coping mechanisms. The key looking back for us was learning wasn't all about school and passing tests. Keeping an interest in acquiring new knowledge led me to gain my masters.

He sounds like me as a kid! I got diagnosed with dyspraxia then, but not with dyslexia because my reading was ok. Slow but ok. I got diagnosed with dyslexia at university and it fits much better! At school, I was considered "bright but lazy". I remember being so upset because I was trying as hard as I knew how!

Thanks all. I will definitley push more and if we have to, could save up for private testing for him.
When they measure they will look at intelligence and how the practical side meets up. In dyslexia it is a larger discrepancy.
This is what stands out for me when I work with him. I worry that because he is cpapble and doing well in most areas, he will be overlooked and then struggle when it comes to highschool because so much more of the lessons will then become about completing writing tasks. DH says he would have done so much better if has had the extra time they gave him at uni.

@Teacher12345

Thanks all. I will definitley push more and if we have to, could save up for private testing for him. When they measure they will look at intelligence and how the practical side meets up. In dyslexia it is a larger discrepancy. This is what stands out for me when I work with him. I worry that because he is cpapble and doing well in most areas, he will be overlooked and then struggle when it comes to highschool because so much more of the lessons will then become about completing writing tasks. DH says he would have done so much better if has had the extra time they gave him at uni.

Yep my assessment aged 18 looked at the differences. I got >95 centiles for general intelligence and spacial awareness,

They should not be using a discrepancy model to assess for dyslexia. They should be looking at failure to acquire skills of reading and/or spelling despite appropriate teaching over time and adequate access and effort (is, child isn't only attending 20 percent of the time or whatever), and that the level of difficulty is not explicable solely by general learning delay (eg the child is learning at a 3 year old level across the board including for literacy when they are 10).

Discrepancy models have been long since discredited as they disproportionately favour diagnosis in academically able children, whereas you can have a low level of general ability and still find making literacy progress much harder than it should be.

You have basically described my soon to be 7 year old who is also going into year 3 in September. He also mirrors his letters and numbers such as 3/6/9 d/b and reads words wrong such as who and how etc he is also very clever in but his spelling and writing are awful he just doesn't want to do it he also hates reading as he says he can't do it although he can w have read to him numerous times a week since he was born. His maths and general knowledge have been commented on by teachers as being well in front. I queried this with his teacher 2 weeks ago and she said it's normal at this stage that writing/spelling comes later than reading and that it takes up to 500 corrections to correct a mirrored letter and obviously missing so much of this year hasn't helped. I was reassured but reading the replies on your post I'm not so sure! He is also very short sighted and colour blind!

No way am I an expert, but the think that jumps out is the discrepancies between his abilities.
DS (now 11) has pretty much always scraped aged related expectations in English. His maths was much stronger. Screening said no to any issues - possibly because he was bright enough to cope.
Private Ed Psyc assessment picked up dyslexia (which due to family history I've been questioning since he was 7) and dysgraphia.

It sounds to me like something could be going on. If screening comes back as low risk, keep an eye on it, and push back if issues still exist. FWIW, I believe bright kids can compensate for learning issues in lower primary, and it falls apart when their coping mechanisms can no longer keep up. I wouldn't rule out dyslexia, dysgraphia or dyspraxia from your brief description.

My son was diagnosed at 8 and what stuck out for us was his poor exam performance in internal tests against his school report and intelligence. Another clue was that his maths was amazing and well above average but the minute he had a worded question, he couldn’t do it!
The school did an in house LASS test which showed the spikes that often demonstrate dyslexia - scoring high in one area and Disproportionately low in another, so we got a private Ed psyche done (£850). It was worth it to be honest as he now types all his work (handwriting was also down to being hyper mobile) and the pressure is off him in class, so he can concentrate on work and not on his writing. He also gets a reader for exams and an extra %20 time in exams .

I don't know that you've mentioned what his reading is like OP? This is a big consideration.

If he really struggles to sound out words compared to his peers this would be an indicator. Look up phonological processing.

But yes, if he has other visual and hearing difficulties this is often seen as the explanation rather than dyslexia. You kind of have to ensure they have minimal influence on his developing skills before dyslexia is considered. Which can be a bit of a pain because of course there could be multiple things at work.

I would also recommend looking at Dysgraphia. It’s not very well known by teachers generally. Good luck, I am having to challenge some of the “well boys don’t like sitting down and writing” comments from the SENCO at my son’s school

Agree with PP- what is his reading like? At that age, for many dyslexia would present itself as being unable to grasp phonics, blend sounds or generate rhymes. If it’s more his writing and coordination he may fit a dyspraxic profile (but as you’ve said the two can overlap!)

His reading got the same grade as writing. "Working within the standard
but not met all the objectives".
He was always quite good at phonics and alien words though.

He was always quite good at phonics and alien words though.

This, to me, would really preclude a diagnosis of dyslexia, as lack of phonological awareness is such a reliable difficulty for the condition.

His teacher even wrote to me today, that he has some great idea's that he articulates so well, but then when asked to write it down, it becomes simplified and takes much longer than it should.

Just picking up on this OP - it is really far too early to think about this now and all kids will be developing their skills at different speeds.... But if it does so happen that in the future, eg around important exam ages, he continues to display a huge difference in his ability to articulate answers vs. write them down, it can sometimes be possible for an educational psychologist to pick up on these specific difficulties and make recommendations that a student can orally give answers to questions, in those circumstances where it is appropriate (eg. if it does not compromise any of the competencies being assessed in the qualification). They might note dyspraxia, or something else altogether.

I have 2 children with dyslexia. Like you we have lots of family members with dyslexia so we weren't surprised when our children started to show signs of dyslexia too.

I think your son could have dyslexia, you could look to get him tested about age 8. These are good to find a tester, unfortunately it's very expensive!

www.patoss-dyslexia.org/

In my experience schools won't test for dyslexia as their limited ed psych budget is usually spent on things like autism (which is fair enough in my opinion).

Also be aware that the main reason for getting tested is for your son's self esteem (which is well worth it). My children thought they were "stupid" (this was unfortunately the view they had formed of themselves) and it was SO helpful for them to know in fact they weren't, they had a learning difference which gives them many advantages in the world outside of school.

Also be aware that having a label of dyslexia will NOT get you any extra help in school. You get help in school based on the areas you struggle in. Eg if you struggle in spellings and are below ARE (whether or not you have dyslexia) then you will get extra input in spelling, similarly if you are below ARE in reading you will get help with that (again regardless of any dyslexia diagnosis).

You only get help based on you being below ARE in an area and a diagnosis of dyslexia has no effect on whether you get extra help - it is purely if you are below ARE. If you have dyslexia and are reaching ARE you will not get any extra help (even if you are achieving much lower in an area than you should be due to your dyslexia).

It was a big stretch for us financially to get them tested, and we had to borrow, but we think it was definitely worth it. It has been a positive for us to get our children diagnosed as they understand that they are not stupid. There are also lots of positive things in the internet about the advantages dyslexia gives you and we have been able to show these to our children and keep reinforcing how positive it is to have dyslexia in so many ways.

It also helps that so many others in our family have dyslexia so it wasn't too much of a big deal.

Dyslexia is very common.

I paid privately after asking which reports they would act upon. Don't just wing it because you don't want to pay out and it be worthless.
Best money I spent.
I could see the sense in wasting years of their education. And then I was only promised a pre test.

My dd was not quite bad enough for a statement and had good phonological awareness. She loves a good rule, god forbid words don't follow rules.

Most dyslexics can read

The lack focus and time keeping and memory issues

They can be diagnosed in University as the hot a ceiling.

It’s not all about reading

Nessy has a program for diagnosing dyslexia - small charge

School have a computer programs - takes 20 minuets

You don’t need to pay big bucks

You really need to push for them to do an assessment and come to a conclusion. It took me 3 years to get someone to take it seriously and start investigating, and thats only because ds spelling and writing was so bad, his teacher assumed he was dyslexic without a diagnosis. They only just finished their investigation before school shut. They have been doing it since October! They sent him for 3 visual stress tests, over 3 years, for no good reason! Thank god they finally took me seriously and he got his diagnosis just before starting high school.

Nessy might be able to screen for dyslexia, but it can’t diagnose.

Not a specialist, but a teacher. Op and another poster have mentioned letter reversal in children under 8. Letter reversal is developmentally normal until about aged 8. If it continues much beyond 8, it might be a sign of a specific learning difficulty. Before 8, it's totally normal.

With the other signs, there might be a specific learning difficulty. However, as others have said, in most authorities, a diagnosis of dyslexia doesn't affect the way the child is taught or lead to additional intervention or funding. It can still be worth getting a diagnosis at some point, as it can support access arrangements in tests, in class, and for university.

Good luck

This thread illustrates the issue with dyslexia, doesn't it?
Is dyslexia reading and spelling issues with a phonological processing deficit, as per Rose report and DECP guidance? In which case he probably hasn't got "it"

Or is dyslexia a working memory deficit? Problems with executive functioning? In children who can read just fine, as the dyslexia institute may argue?

Is visual processing and irlen syndrome dyslexia? Or is a visually based reading deficit qualitatively different from a phonological my based, or auditory processing based deficit? Some people would call both "dyslexia" but they need very different interventions.

Is a sequential processing difficulty also dyslexia?

I have no idea.

Thanks everyone. To be honest, I don't think he needs "extra help". I do think he will need time when it comes to exams though and I have heard it takes a long time to get a diagnoses so don't want to leave it until he is half way through high-school and struggling, before getting it acknowledged and getting him extra time in exams.

@BwanaMakubwa or is it to do with patten glare - who knows? There are many different subtypes of dyslexia and there may be a link to vision/pattern glare/Irlens. I saw pre-Covid many children with dyslexia and it was very difficult to compartmentalise any of them.

OP - I'd wait a bit first, you can only do an ed psych every 3 years and so I'd wait until the end of year 3. I'd do a dyspraxia assessment first.
Til then I'd do some OT with him to strengthen his grip, improve core stability and some handwriting workbooks.

DS1 has a dysgraphia "diagnosis". The dysgraphia part of it was very basic and frankly could have been done by anyone, but they went through the whole ed psych spectrum first to check for other co-existing learning dificulties.

As a clinician, it's still very unsatisfactory for me as I still don't know why he can't write clearly. But we've done everything we could do (without going down the route of invasive medical investigations into his poor grip) and the end result was him being able to type.