Help! Accused of fraudulent application!

[NotAnotherNameChangePlease]

Sorry for the exclamation marks but I’m in a right mess. I’ve just opened a letter from the council saying that my dc2’s primary application has been found to be falsified as they do not believe we live in the property stated. A spot check was apparently carried out and the house was evidently unoccupied. I can appeal or reapply giving my current address but it will be considered a late application and I am unlikely to get the first choice school as it is oversubscribed.

My application is not fraudulent. We lived in house 1 for years, which has a barn in the garden. We have been converting the barn (house 2) and moved in officially in December. Work is now going on in house 1 as we are going to let it out as a holiday let but it is currently unoccupied. We’ve only actually had a separate address for house 2 for about 3 months and as we were still in house 1 when I applied for dc2’s place I used the house 1 address. I (stupidly in hindsight as I didn’t consider this to be an issue) changed dc1’s address with the school from house 1 to house 2 in December so I guess that’s why it flagged up as looking odd. They then did a spot check and decided I’d made a fraudulent application.

I wish they’d just bloody phoned me, or even looked at the addresses side by side - they’re both well within the catchment area and about 10 bloody metres apart! I’ve only just seem the letter as it was put through to the house 1 address by hand, if it was posted it would’ve been redirected. It was sent a couple of weeks ago which probably makes it even worse that I haven’t replied sooner.

I’m due to start my job again for the first time in 5 years from September. If dc2 doesn’t get a place in the same school as his brother I genuinely won’t be able to get to my job and back to pick them up . I’m so bloody cross with myself! The council can’t have spoken to anyone at the school about it either. It’s only a small school, I volunteer there a lot and everyone knows that I’ve just moved next door.

Anyone had any experience with this? Any chance they’ll still consider my original application?

If you moved to house 2 in December then this was your address at the application date for January 15 2020 unless you can prove otherwise?

They don't contact anyone re any contradictory or missing data.
If you moved in December I assume Council tax became payable on 2nd home?

You need to argue your point and see if the new home would have still got you a place or if placed you outside the allocated numbers?
Do you have bills to show you were still living there on the 15th January?
Is the school likely to be oversubscribed?

I’ve only just seem the letter as it was put through to the house 1 address by hand, if it was posted it would’ve been redirected

Well, that's why they do it by hand, isn't it? So people who don't live there and are just using the address for school applications won't get the letter for ages.

It's unfortunate, OP. I doubt they'll let you 'undo' this now as the rules are tight, so I suspect it will have to go down as a late application.

It's a shame, but the rules are strict because there is so much fraud.

We still have a lot of bills in for the old address including council tax but with the second home discount on. We have house 2 now as the house we pay the full amount on. We moved early December into the new house but have been paying bills for house 2 since about June when we’d originally hoped to move.

The school will definitely be oversubscribed but I wasn’t concerned as ds1 is there and we’re only about 300 metres from the actual school.

I’ll phone them tomorrow and see if I can get it sorted. Such a bloody worry and so horrible to be accused of something without being able to defend myself!

longines I see why they would have delivered it by hand I just thought they might phone to check details or something first. Surely there are other people that move house within the school application deadline?

Sorry to hear about your stressful situation but to reassure you it sounds like you have good grounds for an appeal hearing....when you explain your circumstances to the appeal panel (with lots of evidence to back it up) I have no doubt that you could win and then the school will have to accommodate your child whether it is oversubscribed or not. The final decision will be made by the panel and if you can prove that it is a mistake made by the education authority and you do fill the criteria for admission to the school you will win I had to go to through the appeal process for my son a few years ago.....I was told by the headmistress, the priest and the authority that I wouldn't win as the school was fully subscribed but when the panel listened to what I had to say and examined my evidence I won and the primary school had to accommodate my son and employed another classroom assistant as the class size was already at its maximum (30 pupils, 1 teacher & 1 TA)
It is a bit of a stressful process but worth it in the end! Best of luck xx

I think the fact you can show you own both properties, they're right next door to each other and no-one else was occupying the 'empty' one will all be in your favour, OP, so I would try not to worry too much (easier said than done, I know!).

Surely there are other people that move house within the school application deadline?

There are but most LAs require you to inform them if that happens, which you clearly haven't done.

You should contact them and explain the situation. If they refuse to shift their position you should appeal. I would argue that, in the circumstances, it would be unreasonable for the LA to insist on treating you as a late application as, unless it turns out you are right on the borderline for distance, the difference in address doesn't affect your chances of getting a place.

I do find their procedure odd. With my daughters application, I received an email stating the address given was not the one they had on record. Very odd, we had moved summer before applications but I have no idea why they had a record as was first time applying for school. Anyway, they asked to be sent one of a list of documents, so I emailed one back and they confirmed it was receivedand updated. Can you contact your council asking why you weren't offered a similiar chance?

I've just re-read your post. House 2 is a converted barn part of house 1s deeds? Surely in that case you are staying at the same address?

I think once you can prove that you have just moved next door it shouldn't be a problem. Just explain the way you did here. I think if it was me I'd write a letter detailing everything, include pictures of how close the houses are and offer them to come out and see it for themselves. I think I'd only be worried if you had moved miles away.

My BIL made a fraudulent school application but before they took the place away he was given a chance to prove he did live at the address he used. (Which he couldn’t.)

Are they saying that you wouldn’t have got a school place if you had used the address ten metres away from the first address? Or are they just sweeping away your place because you didn’t tell them you had moved?

It’s not a good time to be trying to sort this out as the secondary schools admissions have just been given out so admissions will be crazy this week!

*I would argue that, in the circumstances, it would be unreasonable for the LA to insist on treating you as a late application as, unless it turns out you are right on the borderline for distance, the difference in address doesn't affect your chances of getting a place•

This.

You have moved to a different building on the same bit of land, owned by you. Explain that you have moved into a separate building in your own garden.

The point that you have not increased your chances of a place in the move, or disadvantaged another applicant because the two buildings are next door is relevant.

If they don’t accept it at this point, appeal.

Do you not nip into your old house and remove junk mail etc?

From what you're describing I'm picturing house 2 essentially in the garden of house 1? I'm hoping that you get someone on side at the council who uses common sense rather than a "computer says no" approach. Good luck!

Is there a limitation on not being able to sell property one on it’s own as part of the planning permission to convert property two? I’ve heard of that before and if that’s the case dig out that paperwork as evidence.

House 2 was originally on the deeds of house 1 but hasn’t been since about June last year. It was originally in the garden of house 1 but is now clearly separated by a wall. I do have all the original deeds from house 1 though along with loads of evidence that we did live there for years. Both houses are well within the catchment area, there’s only half a dozen houses closer to the school than either of the properties.

I only picked up the letter when I was popping round to speak to the builder. He normally just piles up all the post that comes through and I grab it every couple of weeks or so.

I fully admit I had no idea that you were supposed to inform the council if you moved during the admission period. It just didn’t occur to me as we still own house1 and receive all the post from there (unless it’s hand delivered obviously!)

Just ring them ASAP & fingers crossed logic wins out!

I think it is unlikely that the LA will accept your explanation given the timescales involved.The LA will be in the last bits of allocating all places that are on time applications. As the LA have told you that you can now only be considered as a late application, they will stick to that.
It is unfortunate that nobody at the LA had the sense to ask some questions before making the decision.
Having said that you need to appeal as PRH has said. One might expect that an independent panel may take a realistic view of the situation and agree with you that the application was not fraudulent and that living in the barn next door should have meant that you should have been offered a place. Being completely pedantic on the address seems a little OTT but you will need to get the panel chapter and verse on times, dates etc. You need to prove that you were living at the house during the period that you applied for the school in question because based on what you have said the LA presumably do not have your current address, only an empty house being used as a convenient address to get a place at an over subscribed school.

I have lots of proof that I was living at house 1 when I applied and moved to house 2 after application.

I can’t even get through on the phone to anyone at the moment - we’ve had 4 confirmed cases of coronavirus in our small town so everyone is going mad.

Even if they insist on counting it as a late application, fingers crossed it will go in my favour at appeal. I’m so bloody cross with myself. I just had so many other things to worry about at the time that it didn’t even cross my mind about school applications.

I’ve spoken to them on the phone. Apparently there’s nothing they can do as they’re pretty much finished with allocating school places now. All I can do is see what I’m given (I know already I’ll be given a place at a school that will be a 20minute drive, ferry, 10 minute drive and in completely the opposite direction to where I need to go) and try and appeal. Bloody nightmare.

Bloody Nightmare indeed

Hopefully the school is close enough that you get a place very fast on waiting list / as late application.

And failing that you appeal alongside being on the waiting list and can demonstrate that you had no fraudulent intent and that the decision to treat your application as fraudulent was a mistake as you were living on your own land, which had been the same land as owned by you when you applied, and is 10m away!

Tricky because Infant Class appeals hinge on process and mistake rather than relative benefit to child /school.

Fingers crossed, OP.

It is a nightmare but I think you have a good argument that the LA has acted unreasonably, which is one of the grounds on which an infant class size appeal can be won. As SW16 says, the fact that they intend to treat you as a late applicant shouldn't affect your position on the waiting list. If you would have got a place if they'd used your new address you should be at the head of the waiting list.