Ordering primary school preferences

[Purp1e]

Apologies in advance for the long rambling post but I feel like if I write it all down and hear what others have to say it will sort everyone out in my head and I can finally make a decision.

After a few weeks of looking at all our options, sifting through reports and visiting the schools, we have come up with three schools that we like but for different reasons. We thought we had done the hard bit but it turns out that the hard bit is actually putting them in some sort of order. We seem to keep going round and round in circles about which to put first so I’ve taken to MN to see what everyone else thinks and a bit of advice.

We have three schools; Green, Blue and Red (based on jumper colour not how much we like them). Over the last 3 years all applicants have been given a place so whatever we put first is going to be our school.

Green: this is our closest school (>400m away) so we are guaranteed a place. The academic results are poor taken at face value but when you dig into them it seem like a lot of kids missed out by 1 or 2 marks. Progress is below average. Have a lot of visitors and workshops, outdoor eduction, visits to places and give the kids lots of experiences. We like the idea of what is has to offer and that is is our local school. However, the academic side is slightly concerning. EYFS and KS1 were judged to be good. However, it is KS2 that is concerning in the long term because it requires improvement.
When compared to another school a very similar distance away in the opposite direction which has very similar results, well below average progress and is limited on the experiences they offer, green is the better school. The teachers are behind the school and the parents I’ve spoken to didn’t seem to agree with the recent OFSTED.

Blue: seems to be a very good school and is the smallest (1 form Entry compared to 2). They have very good results (110+ for the majority of the kids) and every child gets 100 (or just misses). The kids make average progress (seems strange considering high results?). They don’t seem to offer the various experiences the other schools offer with the exception of outdoor learning. We like the idea that DC will be in a smaller school and we will not have to be constantly worrying about whether the teaching is any good or not. It got good in its last OFSTED.

Red: furthest away and have to walk past green school to get there. Their results are pretty in line with the nationals averages, and progress there is well above average/above average across the board. They have a lot of visits, trips and experiences for the kids. It’s a very mixed/diverse school with kids from council estates, privately owned homes, parents who work at the university and those who are only just learning English. We like it’s diversity, what is has to offer the kids, the progress they make and the fact all the parents and teachers seem to love the school. We just don’t so keen on having to walk past our local school, the fact it doesn’t do as much outdoor learning and the KS1 teaching can be very variable in quality according to the last OFSTED.

So, the questions we have are;

1. If we put green first, is there any point in worrying about the order of or putting the other schools down?
2. Are we being completely stupid by not sending our kid to blue school with fantastic academics when we have the opportunity to?
3. By going for green have we already limited what our dc will achieve because they won’t get the higher marks later on?
4. If red school is only average in terms of academics would it make sense to go for greens and see if it improves in the next few years?
5. Does the progress score of the school mean more than the results the kids get? Ie should we be looking more at red with well above average progress as better than blue with average progress?
6. What would you order the schools if you had to decide based on the information above?

Again, sorry for rambling.
Thank you.

I wouldn't put much store by Ofsted.
Trust your gut.
DO NOT PUT DOWN ONLY ONE SCHOOL.
In the unlikely event you do not get that preference, the local authority will chose for you.

Definitely Green. It's closest and sounds like it would be a lovely school!

Catherine I understand you now.

Yes they don't put all the first preferences above all the second above all the third.

But it's not quite as simple as 'geographical order' either.

it is done in the admissions criteria order (often something like LAC, catchment+sibling, catchment, out catchment+sibling, sibling) and then within each criteria there is a tie-break which is usually shortest distance.
If catchment area isn't circular you can be out of catchment but live closer than someone in catchment - you would still be behind them.
NB Not all schools/areas use a formally defined 'catchment area', but e.g. ex LAC children will still get a place ahead of a child 10m away.

Correction (often something like LAC, catchment+sibling, catchment, out catchment+sibling, any one else )

Do the children from all 3 schools go to the same secondary? Definitely look at that as well to try to help the decision.

In all honestly, I don’t think looking at secondary schools will help the decision. We have that many different types round here; boys schools, girls schools, grammar schools, independent schools, comprehensive schools which take depending on which side of the school you live or are so poor you can get in from the other side of the city. It’s something that really can’t be judged at this stage, I see kids every day from the same estate that went to the same primary who all go to completely different schools.

It just going to have to be a judgement call based on the actual whoops themselves. I think we have decided that blue will be last. I’ve asked the other schools if can have another visit. It might help make my mind up but I’m pretty sure we have settled on local. (For today aha)

*schools not whoops.

An equally long response to go with your long post

It all depends on what you want. What do you value? What school best fits with your morals, values and expectations?

1. As you have gone to the effort of choosing other schools, I would put them all down. Although you say you are “guaranteed” a place at green school, you never know what will happen. It is always best to have a back up (or two) that you are happy with.

By the sound of it, you like green school for its locality to your home. If this is the case, I would go for 1) Green, 2) Middle distance, 3) Furthest distance. You also seem to like the idea of the experiences and how much people in the school are happy and supportive. If this is so I would go for 1)Green, 2) Red, 3) Blue.

1. Again, it all depends on what you want and what you value. Blue schools academic results sound amazing but you have to ask yourself, why are the kids getting such good results? Is it the result of very good teaching or is it the investment of the parents outside school? Does the school teach to the test which is why there are limited experiences compared to the other schools? Considering the school is producing exceptional results but only average progress you need to be asking, why is this? What is the background of the kids? The kids may all be from very affluent backgrounds so are already above average when they started school, so what has the school done to help them?

If you are going to be choosing a school based on academic results you need to be asking the following; Is my DC able to keep up with the academics? (Are they already showing an interest in learning, reading, counting ect). What happens if my DC does not turn out to be academic/a high achiever? (Will they fit in? What about friendships? Self esteem?) Are you interested in selective education (Grammar, Private) at secondary school? (If this is your aim, go for a school which produces results) If this is the case I would go for 1) Blue, 2) Red, 3) Green. You mention small class sizes, if this is the real draw I would go 1) Blue, 2) Middle size, 3) Biggest size. However, be careful, just because it’s 1 form Entry doesn’t mean the class sizes are any smaller. It just means the school is smaller. Ultimately no, you are not belong stupid and you are not ruining your DCs life chances. You need to understand the meaning behind the results and whether you DC will fit into the school. There are lots of DCs every year which go to schools that don’t have excellent results but because of parental support and experiences gain some excellent results.

1. Refer to the above questions answer. NO! Parental influence is much more important than school. You say that EYFS and KS1 are good. For the first 3 years your DC will definitely not be disadvantaged. By the time they reach KS2 the KS2 teaching may be good. You can always change schools if you are not happy.

1. This really depends on what you want, you mentioned EYFS and KS1 at Green are good. Why is KS2 bad and what are the school doing about it? Will they have improved by the time your DC reaches KS2? Reds may be average now but who knows what will happen. They could get better, they could plummet. This is a judgement call you will have to make based on your values, expectations and what will work for your family.

1. The progress score 100% means more than the results. The progress score shows how much effort the school have put in to improving your DC. Red school may be well above average with average results but what were the starting points of the children? For those with EAL or below average on starting, average results are very very good and shouldn’t be seen as “just average”. The progress score is reflecting this. However, you mention Red school has DCs of university workers (I’m making an assumption here) but, usually they will be average/above average when they start school. Do their end results reflect this? I would look up the breakdown for low/middle/high attainers and see their results and progress. Blue school may have the exceptional results but only average progress is telling me there is something else behind the results. I would put more emphasis on progress and how all abilities progress rather than results. However, it really does depend on what you want. If you just want to guarantee high results, do you really care about progress?

1. Personally I would be looking at each DC as an individual and making a decision. But, if I was choosing for my DCs I would put 1) Green, 2) Red, 3) Blue based on the information given but I would be looking into the information I have pointed you towards before making a proper decision.

Ultimately, you need to choose a school based on your DC, your DCs abilities, what the school can do for your DC, what you want for the future, your values, morals and exceptions, your gut instinct and how the decision will affect your family.