State or private...slightly different issue

[Fuzzyspringroll]

Hi,
I realise the question has come up a few times now but I think our situation is a bit different.
We are currently loving abroad. We speak in English to DS and he currently attends a bilingual nursery.

When he starts primary school, he'd automatically get a place at our local state school. We have two primary schools in town and he would be assigned to our closest one. It shares a site with the local secondary school (quite poor reputation), is four-form-entry and they do have wrap-around care from 7.30am until 5pm. All of the teaching takes place in the local language, obviously, and they have perhaps an hour of English a week. Generally, there's not much happening in English (a bit like the MFL teaching in the UK). It would be a 20-25 minute walk from our house to get there.

Our alternative is a private school, which does offer English right from the start. (They do about 2 hours/week in Year one, increasing every year and offering humanities and other subjects fully in English at a later stage.) It's an international school but he would most likely attend the class for local children, focusing on developing skills in the local language. They are three-form-entry but it's also a through school leading up to university entrance. Children can choose up to five languages to study but I would like to use it to help him develop his English skills. It's 30 minutes by car. They also offer before and after-school care.

The other option would be a bilingual school. They teach the pre-school/reception class completely in English and then teach 50% in the local language and 50% in English from Year 1 onwards. It's 20 minutes by car. However, their secondary section isn't very established and lots of children leave after the primary years to attend local state schools. It's also more expensive than the other private school.

(There's also a British curriculum school teaching only in English but we cant afford that...)

Any words of wisdom?

Oh..there's no Ofsted here and test results don't get published.

I take it that the goal is for DS to develop his English?

The bilingual school fits the bill. Or for convenience, you could go with the local state option and make sure you create plenty of opportunities for DS to develop his English, eg reading books in English and spending time with fellow English speakers.

Thanks.
Ideally, I'd like him to develop both languages. He understands both but mostly responds in English at the moment. He'll start phonics sessions next year at a club because kids don't start school here until they are 6. He'd start at age 5.5 at the private ones.
I'm just quite aware of the level of reading and writing skills he'll need in English if we move back to the UK when he's secondary school age.

Is cost an issue for you?

You mention about returning to the UK for secondary. Is that a definite? Is there a risk you could move mid secondary? I am asking as you mention you can’t afford the British curriculum school. I’m just asking because is it better to save money now (so go state sector) so that you can pay for private down the road if needed?

I wouldn’t worry too much about infants. Children pick up languages quickly.

I agree with sunshine.

My XP moved abroad when he was 2. I met him abroad. Spoke both languages fluently and went to local state school. He actually could read and write in English despite not specifically being taught to do so beyond the usual English lessons in school.

I would use the state school and save money for British curriculum school so that his education isn't disrupted should you return mid secondary education.

I would choose one of the private schools.

Bilingual kids I know who didn’t go to bilingual schools have very poor written English which effects their choice of jobs.

Thanks for the responses. I guess we have to think about this. We have appointment to visit the first private school next month and I know the second one in a professional capacity.

Cost is somewhat an issue. As I said, we cannot afford the British school. It's "normal" in terms of fees for a British independent school but completely beyond the costs for most private schools around here. We would pay roughly £350/month if he went to the international school but joined the class for local children (it's subsidised), about £700/month if he joined the English native speakers class and also about £700/month if he went to the bilingual school. The British one works out at about £1500/month for primary and £2000/month for secondary.
He wouldn't attend an independent school in the UK if we do return, which isn't certain.

I don't know where you are based but I'm a member of an expat Facebook group in a European country and there was a thread recently that made me realise that the standard of education at the International schools here is WAY below that of local schools despite being fee paying. I had always assumed the reverse tbh.

I find people are generally defensive of their own choices but if there is a similar group where you are based try to talk to people with kids of a similar age at the different schools and see what best meets your needs. As others have said you could always top up the written English support.

Do also factor in relationships. International schools can be incredibly transient although you might enjoy common cultural experiences (Halloween, Bonfire night etc). Local schools will obviously offer a real sense of belonging where you live.

I’ve worked with English children who came back to England after a number of years in a school abroad. They do need to play catch up but it’s all doable. Just don’t move back at a stupid time like Y10 or 11.

If money is a bit of an issue, I’d genuinely stick to the local school and do extra at home.

Local state school and do English language activities at home, buy the Oxford reading tree books or similar. Just a word of warning, they integrate well at primary age if you return but if you are likely to come back to the U.K. during secondary school, switching to the British school at 11 would be wise (use the money you saved by not privately schooling during primary)

@MrsWonderland how did you realise about the lower standard of education? I always feel completely at the mercy of open days when deciding between schools.

There are differences in the curriculum between different systems. So parents are probably picking out bits that demonstrate one system is more advanced than the other. Often all gossip and anecdotes as it’s usually the case doc doing things differently.

@PullingMySocksUp there were parents who had moved their kids out of the International schools and found they were put back a year in local schools. To be fair there was a good discussion about maths in particular and how problem solving in a second language could mean that their lack of strength in maths might have been down to the language challenge rather than mathematical ability but there were quite a number of parents who did feel that on returning back to home countries their kids were at no advantage whatsoever, or worse at a disadvantage following a pricey International expat school experience. My kids are not at school here so I'm afraid I can't share my own experience.

Ah that makes sense. Thank you MrsWonderland

I'm aware of the issues with proper international schools. I teach English and Maths at a local bilingual school myself and have seen the difference in understanding some kids transfer with. (I wouldn't want him at my school...he's at nursey here but we only have three classes at primary school level). The level of English is also too low at ours, which is why I'm looking for a different school.

The school we are considering is an EU-funded school. Focus is heavily on international relations, EU history and multiple languages. I'd like him to go into the English section there but it doesn't get funded by the UK, while the French and German sections get extra funding by the French and German governments, so are cheaper in terms of fees. It does mean, however, that the student population is quite stable in comparison to other international schools. It also has an excellent reputation in the area and a very long waiting list. Our neighbour's kids go there.

He wouldn't be able to transfer to the British school at age 11 because he wouldn't meet the entry requirements (not having been educated in English, so no 11+, SATs or equivalent scores) so that's not an option. He'd have to sit a verbal and non-verbal reasoning test, which is tricky enough if you've been through a British primary school and have been taught in English all the way through.

I'm not sure about the local state school. It's quite big and they don't seem to offer any tours to have a look around. It's a bit odd.

I'll have a think about this. He might not even get a place... :)