Children should not start school until they are 7 - discuss...

[CountessDracula]

article here

my 2 started (school/formal education) at 6.8 & 7. (after 2 years of 5 mornings kg).

My youngest will enter the british ed. system and start at 4.10 and am feeling very unhappy about it. still, we'll see.

Think the 7 start is fantastic and am very happy with this system. IMO & (limited e) it is superior and the children benefit from it.

That's a very confused report - is the emphasis on not ferrying children around or being at school out of the home, or the type of education they enter into?? How do they get the outdoor play she suggests? ime nursery is the last place they get adventurous outdoor play! Structured indoor play and a shor period outdoors on very safe manufactured play things (i.e not trees, slopes of mud etc)

ernest where were you when they started at that age.

it is for this reason i am considering the local steiner lower school where he can go up until he is 13.

I don't agree. Ds started nursery (2 mornings a week) when he was 2.5. He has just started the nursery class at school (5 mornings) at 3.5 and was more than ready. I stared school when I turned 5 (september birthday) and I was gagging to get to school.

All children are different but the majority of children I know have been ready between 4.5 and 5.

in switzerland.

and the kindergarten time was really just focussed on social stuff, learning to get on with each other, increasing confidence a etc. they'd regularly go to the woods, build bonfires etc

Didn't start literacy (reading etc) till school. even now in school they only have 5 mornings & 2 afternoons. plenty of time for playing outside after

they might be ready and starting school at 5 doesn't harm them but do you not think a less formal education would be more beneficial in general for the early years? early years should be about learning through play and only learning if they want to. most will want to learn by age 7 of their own accord. surely it's better for them to come forward and say i want to learn to read now or i want to learn my 3 times table now rather than the government dictating to them when they will be ready to learn this stuff. i just think pushing kids into doing stuff when they aren't ready will just mean they will dislike it, try to avoid it and do the bare minimum. i think it's better for them to decide when they are ready, rather than being spoon-fed. i think if children decide of their own accord they will be more motivated to find stuff out by themself rather than waiting for it to be given to them iyswim.

Well, give me a few months and I will probably have very strong opinions.

My son started school at 4.5, april child, amongst the youngest in his class. He has taken to it like fish to water. He is in year 1 now. He goes to tennis and karate after school, and has violin tuition. He is bilingual English Norwegian, and also speaks some polish and enjoys french.

We are moving to my native Norway in March, where children start school at 6.
Nurseries are usually full time from the child is 1 years old (when mum returns to work from maternity leave) till 6, where they go up classes every year, and do different things. The do a little number and literacy work, but, as in Switzerland I take it, the focus is on social skills, independence, crafts, such as woodwork, knitting, pottery, and home economics, and the outdoors. A lot of time is spent outdoor, a little rain does not scare a norwegian child from playing outdoors, they just dress up differently. They go skiing, and treking, they go to beaches and look at rockpools, make fire, in fact they learn a lot about nature and the natural world. Sorry I am not good at speaking briefly.

Now, my son who is half way through year one here has to start school in Norway. Even if he has gone to school for 2 years, he would have to start together with his age group if he starts in august.

Luckily he will be able to join a "fast track" class that integrates with current norwegian year one (they dont have reception) for gifted children. (weird) But will join his NEW year one in august where the rest of the children for year one starts. I guess time will tell how this will go.

But I think the key here is that you cannot really compare early ears education in a country that is so industrialized and so urbanized that only the very few have ever walked up a naturally occuring hilltop, with the kind of early years education you get in countries such as switzerland and norway.

Hey, my cousin takes her shotgun and wanders in to the mountains after work, if she fancies having grouse for supper. Or equally takes her boat out if she wants cod! Affinity with nature and learning about the difference between elg poo and hare poo, is vital to stay safe! This knowledge is not just superfluous in London, but utterly bizzare.

qs - you're going to have the opposite experience to us then! You're moving from a system to an early start to one with a late start, dunno if that will give you a very good view of the 2nd system tbh, cos your ds may well be bored I suppose if he's backtracking.

We're moving from a late start to young start system, so eg my ds1 will be moving from 2nd class to Yr 5 . I am quite worried about how they're going to cope with several years of missed education (he'll be 9 when he starts british school and never had any english education at all. I'm now trying to teach him to write, but , well, yikes and double yikes.

I agree. My dc were ready for something more at 5. But school? Full time? No.

They are doing well at school and have coped (well they have to) but I can't help feeling 'what's the rush?'

A couple more years of no pressure pre school type activities, obviously geared towards 5-7 year olds, would have been wonderful.

My dc have been lucky in that they were all Autumn birthdays so they had the maximum time available at home.

I really feel for the little dots with Summer birthdays going off to school though. There should be far more flexibility about not having to send them at that age if they're not ready. They're just babies.

i agree. people say well mine would have been bored not being at school til they are 7, or mine went at 4 and they've managed ok. yes they might have done, but would a couple of years extra of preschool be so bad?? how many children do you know that get bored playing? they wouldn't be bored because they would still be getting interaction and doing things just in a less formal way that means those that aren't ready aren't rushed too much and those that area can learn at their own pace if they want to. there's plenty of time for targets and tests and homework when they are older.

It would only work if pre-schools had classes. Our pre-school is great, but after 2 or 3 years even the most tolerant children are jaded by the same old toys and activities.

And most pre-schools are limited to what they can offer - but if they're going to start stretching the children who have been attending the longest and are frankly bored to tears of Peter Rabbit Farkin Whiskers and the dressing-up box, then they may as well be in primary school anyway.

I'd compromise with Year 1 continuing to learn through play, scrapping Yr 2 SATS and having all children start school in the term after their 5th birthday.

Rather than change the time they start school in this country I'd prefer if Year One and Two had a higher proportion of learning through play and hands on learning. I'm sure 6 year olds don't need to be sat at desks and doing worksheets to learn about maths, science, history and reading.

with preschool being 3 years though, the brighter say 4 year olds could join in with some of the activities the older children were doing and vice versa so they wouldn't get bored.

blueblob - that's essentially what it is but by having it as preschool it means if you feel your child isn't ready yet then it wouldn't be compulsory for them to go until they were a bit older.

it works in so many other countries. the uk, malta and hungary are the only other countries to start school at 5. it can't be coincidence that the majority leave it until later.

I think if there was optional pre-school, emphasis on playing, socialising and the outdoors like quintessential shadow says that would work very well, say ages 2-6. Free like school open 5 days a week but child can go whenever suits parents. Because some parents need childcare at 4 so they can work...

i think that would be good too. they could go half days, a couple of hours, full days or whatever suited you. early education should be so much more child-led than it is, not teacher-led.

"A group of prominent early-years authorities has recently launched the ?Open EYE? campaign (www.savechildhood.org), raising serious questions about the impending compulsory Early Years Foundation Stage (EYFS) framework, and initiating in turn a wide-ranging debate about the legitimate role of government intervention in early childhood. With a forthcoming national conference, a strongly supported Downing Street petition, and the assiduous lobbying of Parliament, our aim is to persuade the government to reconsider this flawed legislation.
Some aspects of EYFS are laudable. We are certainly not against government intervention in the early-years sphere per se, and we appreciate the resources that government has recently devoted to the field. However, several aspects of the impending EYFS legislation are strongly contra-indicated by existing research - most notably, the highly problematic EYFS literacy goals. Foundation Stage Profile data indicate that most children are unable to achieve these goals by the end of reception year. Children taught to read and write at 6-7 commonly achieve literacy competency quickly and easily, and with far greater enjoyment."

"From September 2008, the Statutory Guidance states that all providers, ?regardless of type, size or funding?, ?must by law deliver? the learning and development requirements"

Do kids REALLY get bored playing?

Mine have never gotten bored when left to their own devices.

I mean, they ask questions and so on, and ds is very into reading and writing and numbers atm, but thats fine, nothing we can't handle. He won't be going to school til at least 7 and he is definately not behind.

When my daughter was 4 and 1/4 she stood at the top of the stairs and shouted

"I want to start school now!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

She was more than ready then and was desperate to start, but had to wait until September when she was 5.
We had a german friend at the time whose child was the same age and did not start school until 2 years later. It came as a nasty shock to him as he had to go from playing all day into a formal setting. I much prefer out gradual introduction into school.

I don't think that reception is vastly different for nursery anyway. Lots of playing goes on there. The transition to yr1 seems to be when formal schooling really kicks in. I think that most pre-schools/nurseries would have to make big changes to make them fit for older children. Certainly dd who is an early Sepember baby was very bored in her last year at nursery and more than ready for school. Also ds's poor behaviour in school has greatly improved as things have gradually become more structures - not all children just decide to learn one day. Some children would go on doing their own thing forever!

My LO started last Sept and is the youngest in his class with a 31st Aug birthday. I was really worried about how he would cope but he absolutely loves it and is doing really well. depends on the individual child whether they are ready imho.

My cousin started school in the UK when she was about 4.5 and then moved to a different country a year or so later. That meant she had to stay at home for a year and apparently she hated it and became a real handful.

Haven't read the whole thread, just adding my 2pw for no particular reason as per.

dd was 4 and 1 week when she started school (Aug birthday). And I do think that was far too young, she did settle into school really well and does seem to enjoy it but it may be that its a small village school with small class sizes (12), she isnt very confident and I would have really worried if she was in a larger class, it would have been very easy to ignore her.
However, I go in to help, she is now in class 2 and she is still clearly at the bottom of the class in many things. That doesnt actually bother me, because she is the youngest, but I would worry about when it starts to bother her. I hope there is an age at where they start to catch up, she will be 6 in August and we havent got to that age yet. I just dont want her to be bottom of everything all through her school life, seems a bit unfair just because she has an August birthday.
I realise that you could get this with any age, I guess some flexibility would be good.