Faking it to get your DC into a good church school

[lost11cause]

Saw a documentary about parents pretending to be Christian and attending services to get their DC into a good school. The local priest said they generally stop as soon as their DC is offered a place.
I was wondering - how long do the parents have to attend services to convince the priest they are genuine?
Do they have to observe the sacraments of confession and holy communion?
If they don't - doesn't the priest become suspicious?
If they stop going to church once their DC has been accepted or soon after the start of the school year why doesn't the school expel their DC on the grounds of fraud?
This would only have to happen once all over the country to put a stop to what is - after all - fraud and deception.
If they have to attend services for at least a year and many non-believers are doing this (according to the documentary) it does not say very much for the abilities of the various priests that they generally fail to touch, move and inspire these people into becoming genuine Christians.
The C of E is in crisis as fewer and fewer people are practising Christians these days and yet these fake Christians should represent a golden opportunity for parish priests to win souls back to the faith - if they have to attend mass for about 50 times that's a lot of contact with true believers and Sunday sermons - and yet very few appear to be converted by their experience - is this because the priests are uninspiring lack-lustre preachers?
Or are the parents hard core atheists cynically going through the motions (making a mockery of the true believers praying in the pew next to them)?
I would think with a guaranteed captive audience of desperate parents the churches would be doing a better job of winning new converts - any idea why they aren't?
Does the DC end up a devout Christian as a result of going to a church school and how do the non-believer parents cope with this clash of values in the home and how do they maintain the fiction that they are Christians - do they lie to their DC or tell their DC to lie to the school?
PS I am an atheist who respects people of genuine faith so I am just curious why we haven't seen an upturn in Christianity as a result of this widespread practice.
I do not have any children.

If they stop going to church once their DC has been accepted or soon after the start of the school year why doesn't the school expel their DC on the grounds of fraud?

Because by law school pupils cannot be excluded for their parents' conduct.

Reminds self that I really do need to go to church this week..... Need to do ds2's application in October.
I do really like going to church. When I'm there I like it, it's just the mental effort of getting myself there. This why I only go occasionally.

We are currently doing our baptism classes on the run up to baptising our son,
The best school locally is a catholic school and i am baptised, so it seemed the best choice, yes I have been attending mass more recently and will probably continue to do so until we apply at the school.

But I will shamelessly admit, there is not much i wouldn't do if it gave my son the chance at the best school 😳😳😳😳😳🙄🙄🙄🙄

It's a ridiculous and out dated system. All schools should be secular. The faith (fake or real) of a child's parents should have no impact on where a child goes to school.
All schools should be secular.

My daughter went to a CofE infants and is now in a a CofE juniors. There was absolutely no requirement to attend church, they are just are local schools. I am a Catholic and know that happens within their school system. I thought the Church of England was the national faith?

Fossi if they are church schools then they are the denomination of that church (CofE or Catholic) regardless of who they accept. State schools are still ‘Christian’ schools and are still required to have assemblies that are broadly Christian in character but the school does not link with a denomination.

They are not ‘faith’ and ‘non-faith’ schools; they are ‘denominational’ and ‘non-denominational’ schools

They are definitely not "denominational" schools. That term would not cover schools of non-Christian faiths (Jewish, Hindu, Sikh, Moslem, etc.). Technically they are schools with a religious character but that is a bit of a mouthful. Faith schools is reasonable shorthand and is much more accurate than calling them denominational.

Many schools have Admissions policies that are unfair and fall outside the recommended guidelines. Have a look at all the reports of the Office of the Schools Adjudicator if you’re interested, many faith schools are on there.
It’s a shambles, very unfair and as usual it’s the sharp elbowed who thrive.
I ‘prayed for a place’ as it was the best school for my DC’s. They’re all atheists now, with a strong knowledge of Christian teachings.

I'm an atheist but I don't have any great issue with Christianity. I will strongly consider attending church to get my dc into what is the only good local school to us. The system is totally unfair anyway. Why should some children be entitled to a better education because of something their parents believe in? I don't see it as cheating at all. It's using whatever resources I have to secure my children the best education I can. If I had money for private school I could do that. I don't, but I do have time on a Sunday morning that I'm able to use instead.

It’s covert selection of children who have organised/ motivated parents. I don’t imagine the school cares much about whether the parents are true believers. From the vicars point of view better than an empty church and some may become more involved and continue to attend.

Many C of E controlled schools don’t select at all. They may just have a catchment area like community schools. Voluntary Aided schools can select on faith and operate their own admissions criteria and admin. It also has to be said that not all CofE or RC schools are great. Like other schools, they can be RI or worse. Certainly several I know have been. So even pushy parents get conned!

I doubt anyone feels good about doing it, but I agree with PPs that no one should have to make this choice and I can't blame those who do. I'm just thankful that the best schools in my town are the secular ones.

I saw an interesting documentary about, I think, a Catholic school in France where most of the students are Muslim. I'd much rather live in a world where this is ok, than one in which it's a problem.

it is 3 years for the 2 church schools my children have attended (primary and secondary) That is 3 years of regular 3 times a month attendance.. Both highly sought after schools now. However when we moved to the area the primary was the only one that had spaces for our 3 children so they attended. I did attend church to get dd3 into the secondary school. She is now about to go into year 10 and I still attend church 2- 3 times a month.

I don't see myself as a fake christian because I started attending church again to get her into the school it was more the thing that got me back to church. I have always seen myself as a christian and used to attend church regular.

My friend calls it God points for the secondary school always makes me chuckle.

My oldest DD has got into a CofE school without needing to attend church. However the secondary CofE school does require church and in all honesty, if the other secondary schools don't pull themselves together I would jump through any hoops to ensure she gets in.

@stucknoue Do you ever get parents kicking off that you won't sign the form or do they just accept it?

OP Catholic and Church of England school are generally different.
Free schools can only have 50% of children who gain a place by faith, therefore there are not many Catholic free schools.
When administering school admissions I have met many, many, atheists who attend church for the required time to get their child into a Church school.
If the parent or child, for that matter, stops attending church once they have gained a place, that not the school's concern. The clergy signs the form to say the parents or child have attended the church enough times to cover the schools requirements. What happens after that is not relevant.
So if an atheist parent has had to attend church for a year or two and gained a little understanding of the way a church is, perhaps that's not a bad thing.

The real question is: why on Earth does a modern, developed, advanced liberal democracy allow such a basic state-funded service like education to be provided on discriminatory criteria? AFAIK this would be against the (written) Constitutions of most, if not all, advanced democracies; AFAIK it doesn’t even happen in countries like Spain or Italy, which are more religious and in which the Catholic Church has always had way more influence.

I think the churches own the land of the schools but the state pays for all the salaries.

Imagine a situation in which a Christian patient can go to both Christian and non-religious hospitals, but a non-Christian can only go to the latter. That would not be tolerated, so why do we tolerate it when it comes to education? It beggars belief.

PS I don’t think schools can explicitly refuse non-religious families, but practically they do, because most schools are oversubscribed and religious families have priorities.

@SouthLondonDaddy modern, developed, advanced liberal democracies generally have the rule of law preventing any person, organisation or charity from being deprived of lawfully owned assets without compensation. Also the law requires that charities do what they say they will do and don't unilaterally change to doing something different.

Church schools were generally charitably founded for the purpose of educating the children of the churchgoers of the parish, long before the government decided that actually universal education was a good idea. They could have bought the existing schools from the churches but have no legal grounds to just appropriate them without paying a fair value. Given that they won't do that, the charities are legally obliged to use their resources in line with the purposes for which the original donations were received - providing a Christian education.

Meanwhile there is no faith requirement. The admissions criteria are based solely on whether you are physically in church on Sunday - no one is checking up on whether you join in with the prayers or claim to believe anything.

@lost11cause
You have conveniently left out a tiiiiny detail: it's the State, ie we taxpayers, that pays for the salaries of the teachers at religious schools. It's not the Church of England or the Catholic Church!

So, I ask again, why should all taxpayers contribute to paying a basic service which priorities such a minority of the population?

Also, one of the key criteria tends to be being baptised within 6 months from birth or so, so no, just sitting in a church all is not sufficient - leaving of course aside the discussion on why/whether it should be in the first place.

So, I ask again, why should all taxpayers contribute to paying a basic service which priorities such a minority of the population?

The primary reason is cost.

If the government stopped faith schools prioritising on faith grounds all Catholic schools would close. I doubt any CofE schools would close but schools of other religions may close. That would mean over 2,000 new schools would be needed. The cost of setting up these schools would be in excess of £10 billion, possibly double that number. Even if the government gave itself compulsory purchase powers to buy the existing land and buildings, it would have to pay the full market value so the cost would be much the same. The only advantage of going down that route would be that it would be quicker than finding land and constructing new buildings. Since the relevant faith provides at least 10% of all capital costs there would also be an ongoing impact on the education budget. So either taxes would have to go up to fund this policy or cuts would be needed elsewhere.

Also, one of the key criteria tends to be being baptised within 6 months from birth or so, so no, just sitting in a church all is not sufficient

That is true of many Catholic schools. It is not true of CofE schools. They generally do not have any requirement for the child to be baptised within 6 months of birth (or, indeed, at all).