I've been so stupid

[Sonicknuckles]

We are within walking distance to the school my eldest child goes to even so we are out of catchment. I didn't understand the admissions process and my youngest hasn't got a place at the school. I really thought she would get in. I've been so naive.
To make matters worse I didn't choose a 2nd or 3rd choice as I clearly want my kids to be together at school.
Youngest goes to the village preschool and she comes with me every day to drop her brother at school and pick up (I am SAHM).
We have integrated into the local community. My youngest has made friends and their siblings are in my eldests class.
It is all so horrible and heartbreaking.
We have been offered a place in a village in opposite direction that you have to drive to.
How can I be in two places doing school run at the same time when there is considerable distance between them.
The system is a joke.
If I could turn back time I would have chosen catchment school for my eldest but there wasn't much in it distance wise and we didn't know the area that well or understand the processes.
Please help

So is sibling priority under catchment?

I had this same issue. CoE school who's criteria had SEN/looked after, linked church attending siblings, other church attendees, siblings, distance.

So even though ds1 was already at the school my friend who had no children already there, got in ahead of ds2 as she attended the linked church.

All was fine and ds2 did get in, but I'd already looked at which primary schools had breakfast and after school club so ds2 could use them if needed as l too couldn't be in two places!

Yes that's right snapes. I only realised this once I'd applied already and by that time it was too late. I just assumed she would get priority but I was wrong

that would make it an ICS appeal OP which as explained up thread by others would mean that an appeal is more restrictive. Winning an appeal on ICS rules would mean you have to demonstrate an error was made in admissions process (which doesn't seem to be the case here) or the decision to not admit your DD was perverse - I think there is a specific connotation to "perverse" in this context..

So whilst you can appeal, you should go into it with your eyes open to the chances of it being successful and perhaps but energy into looking at practical solutions to either the allocated school or the preferred catchment if that becomes available.

Ok thanks for everybody's help

OP I am not going to point out the error of your ways, you aren't the first to presume how admissions go and be wrong and you won't be the last.

What year is your older DC? Again the ICS could apply to them if you try and move them to a different school. Arrange to visit the offered school, get a feel for it and consider the possibility of moving your eldest DC there too. Speak to the catchment school too about both children.

I am not sure how realistic getting a place is from the wait list, it depends on how the places move in your area, so you need to have a plan for the youngest not going there. What is before/after school provision like? Either in school or with a cm.

A word of caution though if you are planning to try and move your eldest a space generally has to be accepted straight away, they couldn't 'hold' a place until they both had one. I have this issue with my youngest as I am trying to move school for her and whilst the school has a place now, I don't want to move a yr2 child at this point, plus I still have a yr6 at her school (we've moved up the road)

Good luck, take stock and work out a plan
It will pan out one way or another.

I am however one of those people that did only put one school for my youngest, but I had a child in the school, plus we could see the school field from our house, so the chances of 56 children with either looked after status (etc) or lived closer with siblings was pretty slim (especially as I knew that really wasn't the case) I would never advise others to do it.

I think siblings should take priority even if out of catchment if it is still close to the school

Let me guess what you think the cut off should be for close - slightly further than you live from the school.

It's absolutely right that all in catchment children should have priority over out of catchment siblings, otherwise lots of first-born or only children would never get a place at their local (catchment) school. It's the risk you take when you put your eldest child into an out of catchment school.

Why on earth would you not put a second or third choice? Can you really not conceive that there may be 30 other children the same age that live closer (if we forget about the catchment thing for a moment, though you do apparently know about the catchment issue)?
Baffling.

Why on earth would you not put a second or third choice?

Believe it or not, some parents actually think by NOT putting a 2nd or 3rd choice, we have to give them their first choice. Crazy, I know

You are all right and I am obviously learning the hard way now. I would have put a 2nd and 3rd choice but stupidly I listened to someone else who said they weren't bothering but she is in catchment and of course she got it. I'm not blaming her though it's my own stupidity.

I just think siblings shouldn't have to go to separate schools but that's my opinion

You chose to send your chid to a school that you weren't in the catchment for. Why do you think people that do live in the catchment should travel further to school because you want both of your children to go there. If having them both at the same school was important to you, you would have sent your oldest to the catchment school.

I don't even live in the UK, or have anything to do with the UK school system, and even I know more than you do! Parents need to do their own research, and not rely on 'but it's not fair!'.

I would look into how the waiting lists work in you area and get your younger child on the list for any schools you would be happy for her to go to. It's brilliant she will be number 1 at catchment school. I think you have made a mistake and have your mindset on being so involved with this village and school which is lovley but it was never your catchment school and it seems you think as you know the head they can bend the rules but this isn't how it works the council allocates places. Did you not read the information when you applied? Obviously it was a mistake but you can't change it now so you need to visit the school offered then look into childcare options could your older child go to before and after school club/ child minder ECT? I would also research options for your catchment school as you may get a place at that school if your first on waiting list. You are going to need to put on a brave face and sell it as a positive to your children so they dont see it as a horrible expirience. It's not the systems fault you chose out of catchment and took a huge risk it didn't pay off for you this time but it's not a joke or the systems fault but i understand you are probably shocked and assumed you would get in again

It is fair that catchment children are prioritised over non catchment children with siblings in school. Why should we have to send our children to schools further away an inconvieience to us when we have a good school in catchment? Esp when you messed up your application to begin with.

I'm not sure the OP needs to keep on being told that she was wrong in both how she did the application and her opinion on priorities.

What is done is done and so she needs to have a plan for going forward. OP it is the long weekend so you won't be able to do much. Are your schools back next week? When they are arrange a visit to the offered school and look into all childcare options. This is not the time to bury your head in the sand and it is better to have a plan in place and it not be needed then scrambling around late August.

Not wishing to rub salt in your wounds, OP, but just curious as to whether you literally just went straight to the 'log in here and complete your CAF' tab? Or did you actually at least skim read all the information your local authority provided you with about how the admissions system works, but then decided that the school gate gossip must have some secret insider information 'that the LA doesn't want people to know' (like all those pop ups on FB keep trying to tell us about ways to get rid of abdominal adipose tissue) and went ahead and did exactly what the LA told you not to do anyway?

If only your going public with 'how I did it all wrong' stops even one parent of a current pre-reception or year 5 child doing the same thing next time round, some good will have come of it, of course. But, sadly, I'd be willing to wager that just as many of the same will appear on internet forums and in appeal hearings for years to come.

If it were me I’d keep my daughters name on the waiting list and Home educate for a year. Chances are at least some of the children ahead of her on the waiting list will go to other schools and be happy and therefore come off the waiting list. Your daughter could easily be in by the beginning of year 1.

It doesn't get much better by the yr 7 applications. A large number of people think they can beat the system, just presume they will be offered they catchment school if they don't get one of their choices or generally have no idea how the process works.

Trouble is there are stories kicking around of 'I only put school X and got it, so if you only put one school they will have to give you a place' rather than understanding, that (like me above) they would have got a place anyway. People rely on past years as to what will happen, the current yr 6 (so 07/08) is a boom year, in my area many people have presumed they will just get where they want, but many haven't. Fair enough the LA messed up (not enough places) but many just presumed they didn't need to even put their catchment school down. It is never a good idea to base your chances on previous years, a couple of sets of twins could easily knock things awry.

As dotthehappydance says, I don’t think people need to keep going on and on at the OP about her mistake. I think she’s being very patient at continuinally having to agree that she’s messed up. She knows she’s messed up and is now asking for help and a hand hold. Hopefully it will work out for you in the end OP. We all make mistakes.

I think what people find annoying is not that the OP has made a mistake and admits it, it's her opinion that her child still should have got a place before children who live in catchment.

You think siblings should be given priority out of in catchment children?

Don’t be silly.

Why should little Maisie who lives next door to another school simply because you chose to send your eldest to a school in a different catchment?

Catchment children have every right to be top of the list, THEN out of catchment siblings.

I’m sorry you have to deal with this and I appreciate you understand it’s your doing, not the schools, but you need to understand about children in ‘maisie’s’ situation too.

Many people hold that opinion, and her having it actually makes no difference in the end. It still doesn't need pointing out again and again. (And at many schools she would get higher priority)

I know someone who used her MIL's address to get a place in a village school.

Then I was in another school for my job and there was a little girl there who lived in the village where the school was and she didn't get a place and she had been given a place in this other school in the next town. They had to walk as it wasn't more than three miles and they didn't have a car. The mother was there at the end of the day looking like a bedraggled cat having walked in the pouring rain.

I'm not saying if the first mother hadn't lied this child would have got in but it brings it home to you.

And I absolutely don't think catchment dc should not get a place at their own schools because of siblings who don't live in catchment.

Many schools don't have official catchment areas (London, for example) so siblings do get priority no matter how far away the family now lives. The OP is far from alone in thinking that might be a better system.

OP - contact the council in the morning (on Tues) and check you're on the waiting list for the catchment school and all others that would be easier to get to, as well as the one your eldest is in. Good luck.

*I know someone who used her MIL's address to get a place in a village school.

Then I was in another school for my job and there was a little girl there who lived in the village where the school was and she didn't get a place and she had been given a place in this other school in the next town. They had to walk as it wasn't more than three miles and they didn't have a car. The mother was there at the end of the day looking like a bedraggled cat having walked in the pouring rain*

Wow! That's awful. Looking at it like that I guess the system is right. It still hurts though. Moral of the story, I should have put my first child into the catchment school.

Many schools don't have official catchment areas (London, for example) so siblings do get priority no matter how far away the family now lives. The OP is far from alone in thinking that might be a better system.

6 of one half a dozen of the other, really. Plenty of people living those areas would rather have a system where siblings aren’t automatically given priority regardless of distance. And in a lot of areas schools and LAs are changing the admission criteria slightly so sibling criteria only applies to those living within a certain distance from the school. SIblings then distance isn’t without it’s issues.

Siblings then catchment is a recipe for 'system gaming', though.

We live in an area where renting close to a desirable school, getting the first child in and then moving out into much cheaper housing while then getting multiple siblings into the same school was rife. So rife, in fact, that a move to 'siblings within priority admissions area' followed by 'others in priority admissions area', then 'siblings outside priority admissions area' freed up enough places that, for the first time in living memory, non-siblings were admitted from right up to the edges of the priority admissions area.

I think there should be an exception made where an older child is placed 'against their will' in a particular school, and their siblings should be considered as in priority admissions area. So if, for example, a child is placed in a school because their own catchment schools and all other chosen schools are full (not because the parents placed the school as one of their choices), then it doesn't seem entirely reasonable to deny the sibling priority both at their own catchment school AND the one that the older child was forced to go to.