Private Schools Y2 & Y3 - what level of teacher support?

[WimMum2015]

Hello All,
Parents with children in private school Y2 & Y3 - what in-class support do the children have - especially for English and Maths? Is there a full time TA? What is the class size?
When do they ability stream them for English and Maths? And are there specialist teachers for these subjects or are they taught by a generalist teacher?
My daughters school has 22 children in class. In Year 2 they have a shared TA - who is not always around for the English Maths classes. So the class teacher solely manages a class of 22 with a wide range of abilities (including 2 SEN) quite often. In Year 3 they will have a shared TA again.
The School is trying to push back saying that the teacher is supposed to be able to handle all 22 with all abilities. However, on asking around we have realized that other Private Schools have a full-time TA at these classes, or at least additional support for English Maths.
We would like to go back armed with some facts to try and change the situation. So if you can share your school name (anonymously) as well, that would be great.
Thanks in advance, and sorry for the overload of questions!

My DD is older now, but the structure is still the same.
Year 2 up to 20 in class and a TA. Year 3 up to 25 in the class and no TA. The junior school years 3-6 had a floating TA who went where she was needed when she was needed.
I don't know any private schools locally who have a full time TA in year 3.

In Y2 my DS was in class of 12. There were two classes of 12 in the year group each with a teacher and they shared one TA between them.

In Year 3 they started specialist teaching so had different teachers for most subjects, but form time and Prep every day with their form tutor. Class went up to 14.

Learning support is by withdrawal and costs extra.

My Dd is Y3. 20 in the year, 10 in each class. A form teacher each and one full time TA shared between the two. Maths and English are not streamed but are split in the class into different ability groups and extension groups are often taken by the TA. Learning support is provided separately (sometimes at a cost). Specialist teachers start in Y3, for French, science, computing etc.

My son is in Y2. He shares a TA but is in a class of 12. Children are moved into Maths and English sets in Y4, they will then have 'specialist' teachers.
My daughter is in Y1 and is in a class of 17, she has a full time TA and we've been told that this will be the case in Y2 as it is a 'larger' class. I would not be happy with a class of 22 sharing a TA.

My children are at state school and have generally 27 - 30 in a class. They have a full time teacher, shared TA (shared between 2 classes) and the child who needs 1 to 1 has a full time assistant who does also help other children at times. Children who need extra support attend small group lessons of between 4 - 10 children run by a teacher. These are usually for half an hour before school starts.
I'm actually quite surprised at your ratios. I always thought one of the main advantages of private education was small classes and extra teacher or TA attention.
There doesn't seem a huge amount if difference.

22 including SEN and no TA? I would expect a lot better than that from private. I teach state school Y3 and even with funding cuts I have a class of 28 and a TA in the morning (although the level of SEN is probably higher than in private school). In my DCs school they have classes of between 22 and 30 and the KS1 classes have TA support in the mornings.

The teacher is expected to support all abilities is a line straight out of Michael Gove's mouth.

Cross posted.
10 - 12 in a class is much more what I expected from fee paying. I was surprised at those with 20+.

10-12 can be horrid for friendship groups. However, most of the parents who choose private in my area don't necessarily for class size. They are looking for:

Languages -DD's teaches French, Spanish, Italian and mandarin in years R to 6.
Specialist PE
Specialist music, drama and dance.
Additional facilities - proper theatres, swimming pool etc.
No SATS.

I agree- the basic maths and English lessons are not necessarily better in a Prep, and certainly not just because the class size is halved.

You pay (from Y3) for Science to be taught by a Science teacher in a Science lab, DT to be taught by a DT teacher in a DT workshop with big, built in equipment, daily sport coached by sports coaches and weekly matches for all, weekly drama and music taught by specialists and productions once/ twice a year on the stage, languages taught by native speakers etc etc.

Personally, I also pay for hotel style breakfast open at 7.15am and the option to stay doing planned activities taught by the teachers until 6pm as this enables me to work without worry.

Year 2 here. My child has 18 in the class and a full time TA. The children are sat on 3 tables - by ability for English/writing. They go into groups for maths and for reading and phonics.

The TA is there all the time. There is a specialist teacher for music, PE, and RE. I guess that’s when the teacher does the planning.

Oh also specialist teacher for french

Mine are in small classes 15ish and there is a TA for each class but I don't think she's necessarily in each class during the day. But they do have support and are read with every single day which is obviously great.

Meant to say specialist languages, sport coaches, science, DT, music and art.

That does seem like large classes for no TA in private. My school is capped at 20 per class, and almost all classes have a TA in the morning when the majority of maths and English are. No sets as we are too small (1 form entry) so all abilities are taught together.

I think the more important point is - is the high number of children to staff impacting your child? If they’re doing fine I wouldn’t make a fuss. It cold be they’re a relatively easy class with children at a similar level and support has been prioritised elsewhere due to greater need - you mention SEN about its possible the SEN kids are having additional support at a different time meaning they’re find during these lessons. If you feel your own child is not getting enough support it’s worth raising, otherwise if they’re doing well the ratio is clearly ok for them at this stage.

So many typos...sorry

Parents with children in private school Y2 & Y3 - what in-class support do the children have - especially for English and Maths?
Teacher and part time TA. I believe the TA takes the bottom set to a different room sometimes for extra help.
Is there a full time TA?
No, part time.
What is the class size? 21
When do they ability stream them for English and Maths? From early on. The groups are fluid though, they move up and down. DS is in the top group but if he feels he’s unsure about something he can choose to work with the middle group.
And are there specialist teachers for these subjects or are they taught by a generalist teacher?
They have specialists for music, science, PE and French. Class teacher for everything else.
I would prefer a full time TA but fees are cheap for a private school. He’s happy and achieving at the moment.

Not sure what it was for my daughter. My son had I think 16 in Y2 and 18 in Y3. R-Y2 had 2 TAs, so normally one mostly shared Y1 and Y2, but one of them had to take over the reception class for several months when he was in Y2 due to teacher illness and I don't remember how they juggled it after that. Y3, English with class teacher, maths with maths teacher. 1 class per year so no streaming till the scholarship class in Y8. A fair range of differentiation within the class in the younger years IIRC. By Y6 things ramped up academically and a couple of kids who left for Y7 would have been happier if they'd moved a year earlier.

Learning support was being increased within the school while he was there. The Y2 teacher was the SENCO when he started.

Youngest is yr 1, 18 in the class, there is not one dedicated TA for the class but there are three TAs who work with them and one is always present at maths/English. Can’t quite recall exact set up in yr 2/3 fom my older ones but they definitely set both my older ones in maths from yr 3.

And no real SEN as such but I believe there is extra phonics for those identified as struggling before school once a week.

Most private schools have 20-25 per class. 10-12 is difficult for the school to make ends meet and a bit small for healthy friendship groups.

Year 2, there is 12 in a class but it’s capped at 16. One teacher and Full time TA. Ability tables but not separated off.

Same class sizes in year 3 but max 20 in a class, still full time PA to support. Specialist maths and English teacher but not split into ability classes until year 4.

I would be kicking up a right stink in your shoes - people here get antsy when class sizes start getting towards 14/15, never mind 22 with shared TA.

Approx 22 children in each class
Y2 & Y3 have a teacher plus a full time TA
Set for Maths from Y3

Thank you everyone for all the v v helpful replies!
Those who don't mind sharing the school name privately - please do. That would add more weight to our (class parents) feedback.

yr2 - 16 in class, teacher and FT TA (same for recep and yr1)
yr3 - 18 in class with teacher. Seems to be some time in week with librarian and anither teacher also present, but I haven't really worked that out.
One form entry school.
Differnet tables for maths which represent difficulty levels. Lots of differentiation in class.
SENCO takes out indidviduals (inc DS1) for 1:1 sessions of 40mins.
DS1 also attends a twice weekly group (2x40mins) for spellings/english of 4 kids with a SEN teacher whilst rest of class do harder spellings/english.
DS has dyspraxia, dyslexia and is generally quirky.

Sorry missed a bit...
Specialist teaching for french, ICT, music, sport from reception
Specialist teaching for maths, science from yr3
From yr5 all subjects (except PSHEE/ form time) are taken by subject specialists.

Max class sizes are 16 YR- yr2, 18 yr3-4, 20 yr5-7 then two classes of 10 for yr8. Is a 4-13 boys day school.