apology

[suzy86]

This is a situation I didn't think we'd be in (MY family I mean)
Long story cut short! My 10 year old nephew has been taunted and bullied by 1 particular kid for almost 3 years at school. Many many reports are made but because my nephew is no Angel nothing has changed. My lovely dad takes my nephew and my boys to school and collects them so my sister and I can work. Last week he took them as usual and this boy (the bully ) was screaming and taunting my nephew and when told to stop by my dad just became more aggressive. MY dad told him he would be talking to his parents and the kid lunged at my dad at this point my dad pushed him away. My dad admits he shouldn't have and that he lost his temper. Anyway the kid told his teacher and they called the police. My dad was arrested and spent 8 hours in custody (he was absolutely mortified and distressed). the police watched the cctv and warned my dad that in absolutely no circumstances can he push a kid away. No charges were made and he came home, gutted. Today my dad gets a letter from school saying he is not allowed on the school premises which of course means a nightmare for us all. He is devastated that his reputation is now ruined and honestly he is the kindest man ever. He wants to write a letter of apology to school bit is no good at writing and so has asked me to do it. Any advice.on what to write?

If other people are identifiable and unable to be edited out of an image you don’t have the right to the footage v

Ffs. Get a solicitor. If teachers are allowed to use reasonable force, then it’s unreasonable to expect other adults to just allow themselves to be violently attacked. Judicial review of the decision.

Or just lie down and take it.

Apology letter will do fuck all.

Reasonable force totally depends on the circumstance. I can think of very few scenarios where I feel it would be reasonable to actually push a child away from me, and I have been assaulted more than once (and that is in secondary). Eg. If totally cornered. From the description, I am not convinced this would be reasonable force.

Aims
This Policy is written using non-statutory advice from the Department for Education. It is intended to provide clarification on the use of force to help our school staff feel more confident about using this power when they feel it is necessary and to make clear the responsibilities of headteachers and governing bodies in respect of this power.
This advice is for:
 School leaders and school staff in all schools in England.
Key points
 School staff have a power to use force and lawful use of the power will provide a defence to any related criminal prosecution or other legal action.
 Suspension should not be an automatic response when a member of staff has been accused of using excessive force.
 Senior school leaders should support their staff when they use this power. What is reasonable force?

1. The term ‘reasonable force’ covers the broad range of actions used by most teachers at some point in their career that involve a degree of physical contact with pupils.
2. Force is usually used either to control or restrain. This can range from guiding a pupil to safety by the arm through to more extreme circumstances such as breaking up a fight or where a student needs to be restrained to prevent violence or injury.
3. ‘Reasonable in the circumstances’ means using no more force than is needed.
4. As mentioned above, schools generally use force to control pupils and to restrain them. Control means either passive physical contact, such as standing between pupils or blocking a pupil's path, or active physical contact such as leading a pupil by the arm out of a classroom.
5. Restraint means to hold back physically or to bring a pupil under control. It is typically used in more extreme circumstances, for example when two pupils are fighting and refuse to separate without physical intervention.
6. School staff should always try to avoid acting in a way that might cause injury, but in extreme cases it may not always be possible to avoid injuring the pupil.

Who can use reasonable force?  All members of school staff have a legal power to use reasonable force.  However at Xxxxxxxx we do have staff trained in MAPA training which included training on how to ‘hold’ and ‘restrain’ a child safely’. Children will only be held or restrained when they are putting themselves or others at risk or damaging property. Three members of named staff are MAPA trained in 2018 19 and they will be called to assistant in any incidents where children need to be physically taken from parents / carers or moved to a safe space. Phsycial contact will always be the last resort and children will always be given opportunities to move themselves to safe spaces. See Appendix A with more detailed information.  This power applies to any member of staff at the school. It can also apply to people whom the headteacher has temporarily put in charge of pupils such as unpaid volunteers or parents accompanying students on a school organised visit. When can reasonable force be used?  Reasonable force can be used to prevent pupils from hurting themselves or others, from damaging property, or from causing disorder.  In a school, force is used for two main purposes – to control pupils or to restrain them.  The decision on whether or not to physically intervene is down to the professional judgement of the staff member concerned and should always depend on the individual circumstances.  The following list is not exhaustive but provides some examples of situations where reasonable force can and cannot be used. Schools can use reasonable force to:  remove disruptive children from the classroom where they have refused to follow an instruction to do so;  prevent a pupil behaving in a way that disrupts a school event or a school trip or visit;  prevent a pupil leaving the classroom where allowing the pupil to leave would risk their safety or lead to behaviour that disrupts the behaviour of others;  prevent a pupil from attacking a member of staff or another pupil, or to stop a fight in the playground; and  restrain a pupil at risk of harming themselves through physical outbursts.

Schools cannot:
 use force as a punishment – it is always unlawful to use force as a punishment.

Not sure if that guidance detail is directed at me, as if so, I'm very familiar with it but still stand by my last post. Obviously nobody here was present during the incident, but to push a child sounds extreme.

Considering the boy is the issue i think he should be required to be suoervised at all timesincluding going into/out of school. Even though he is preumably 10 he obviously needs it.
Someone lunging is clearly risking themself and others including being accidentally knocked over when someone tries to defend themself.

The school should imagine this as if it were another child (not a GF), the person instigating is at fault and you need to be able to move someone away from you.

No, I cross posted with you. It was to give the op some info

Thank you all for advice, the apology is not intended to reverse the decision it's because my dad has been taking children to and from this school since I was of school age (33 now) and feels dreadful so wants to say sorry. The day before this incident this kid was being aggressive again to my nephew and my mum who was doing the school run. she reported it but nothing came of it. I have never ever known my dad to be aggressive and this has caused upset to everyone. The police told him to try and forget about it and move on from it bit he's not finding that easy. Bullying affects everyone

I honestly wouldn’t apologise as such, it implies guilt. Just like you’re told never to apologise at a road accident. I would phrase any letter very carefully.

youbethemummylion yes I did say it has an impact on me but never asked how to change the decision just asked for advice on the letter. That's all.

I've tried to write it carefully. Ultimately there is no grey area on what happened because it's all on cctv and police were satisfied there was no force just intention to keep the child at bay. The letter apologises for the situation I suppose and makes it clear that my dad has utmost respect for the school

Teachers are given powers to use reasonable force in schools.

Why has your dad had that power withdrawn?

A 10 yo is the age of criminal responsibility. If he attacked your dad why wasn't he arrested too?

My letter would be this

Dear HT,

I respect your decision to ask I do not enter school premises because I pushed away one of your pupils who lunged at me.
I am not proud of my actions and accept my immediate response to defend myself by pushing him away have led to your decision.

I will be waiting at the gates for x and x from now on and dropping them off there.

I am once again reporting the bullying by child a towards my grandson.
If child a continues then we will be reporting to the police as they are clearly more effective at dealing with these situations

Regards

Xxxxxx

I'm not sure how helpful that letter would be but I'd bloody want to send it.

thankyou v much that letter is very useful. The child is clearly seen lunging (say the police) but they also say the child doesn't make contact because my dad stops him from doing so. When the child went into school after the incident but before he told teachers he lunges at my nephew and a staff member has to hold him back. Still nothing has been done. The incident seems to have overshadowed one of the big issues, the persistent bullying and threatning behaviour

I wouldn’t be happy about this at all. It is possible to contact the police yourself if your child is being threatened by another child. If you feel the school isn’t doing anything there will be a complaints procedure to follow. I couldn’t just leave him in this set up (I know it is your nephew but still)

The police were made aware of everything and they said it needed to be addressed. I've encouraged my sister to push hard for this to be resolved but it seems she is reluctant to make waves due to this incident. He is my nephew so it's difficult for me to get directly involved in that area and my family are so upset by the whole thing .... I am totally aware of how bad the incident sounds to others but I only wish u knew the impact it's had on my dad.

I feel sorry for your dad... the 10 year old boy sounds like he has a lot going on for him but it does not excuse the bullying...

I’m not sure how you can continue to have respect for a school who have allowed your nephew to be continually bullied

I understand you are unable to be directly involved but your brother or sister needs to move him and quickly

This won’t improve your DN will have no self confidence left

Why does he wants to apologise? Does he really feel sorry for what he did? From your OP, only thing he did was to defend himself and children. And apology won't change anything about school's decision.

Please be very careful as to what happens next. Did the incident happen on school premises? If so - the school can ban him. If it happened off of school premises then I don't think they can. Of on school please ask for a meeting with the chair of governors/HT to discuss this. There are 2 issues - the bullying and the grandad. Both are linked together as if this kids wasn't bullying then your dad would have no issue with him. Given the police have dropped the matter ask why the school have still banned your dad. Ask what is being done to keep your children safe. The incident in the classroom where the child is being restrained is very relevant - if staff are required to use force then how is what your dad did any different. Be very careful how you talk about bully as he may well have additional needs. This doesn'take his behaviour right but does change how the staff manage it. As for the practicality hopefully the school will work with you to have the kids collected and dropped at the gate. Given the length of time your dad has been doing drop offs with no.issues ask if this ban can be temporary. See if they give anything. If school refuse all your requests and refuse to work with you on keeping your children safe then move them.

You need to rethink that letter.

A criminal charge is not the same as a civil suit and they absolutely could sue whether the police go ahead with a charge or not.

A letter admitting guilt could be used in a civil suit. At least where I’m from.

And I would imagine the school have banned dad to cover their arses in a similar vein.

Honestly I think you should ask for a meeting with the head and chair of governors. If this is the full story then it's really not on that someone can be banned for protecting their child from violence in a none harmful way. Sounds like it was dealt with in the only way possible, and yes as a teacher I've got between teenagers fighting and pushed them apart

I actually that the ban is deflection.

Ban grandfather for defending himself against a bully rather than admit they've failed to deal with the bully and failed to protect a member of public from him on their premises.

Personally I'd be trying to speak to someone (perhaps lawyer?) about how best to proceed. But do not apologise for self defence.

I think before you submit any apology you need to read the appropriate guidance that the school should be following which is Guidance on Controlling access to school premises, published 27 November 2018.

What it says is

"Schools can bar someone from the premises if they feel that their aggressive, abusive or insulting behaviour or language is a risk to staff or pupils. It’s enough for a member of staff or a pupil to feel threatened.

The school should tell an individual that they’ve been barred or they intend to bar them, in writing. Letters should usually be signed by the headteacher, though in some cases the local authority, academy trust or proprietor may wish to write instead. The individual must be allowed to present their side. A school can either:

*bar them temporarily, until the individual has had the opportunity to formally present their side
*tell them they intend to bar them and invite them to present their side by a set deadline

After the individual’s side has been heard, the school can decide whether to continue with barring them. The decision should be reviewed within a reasonable time, decided by the school. "

From your posts it does not seem as though the school have followed this procedure but just gone immediately to "your barred". I would reword the letter to ask that before any final decision is made that the school follow the procedure above and let your father put his side of the situation to the school. There is every opportunity if the school do carry out the correct procedure for your father to verbally express his apologies and regret for the incident whilst making the point that it was him being attacked that caused the incident.
The other part of the guidance is that it is not meant to be punitive long term and that if the school do consider that a ban on entering the school grounds is necessary that it should be short term, for instance till the Easter holidays. In the interim your father can take the three children to the school gate and then the three will have to make their own way into the classrooms. You could alternatively argue that once the children are on the school grounds that the school is "loco parentis" and therefore need to make arrangements for collecting the three kids at the school gate. That might just clarify the school's mind as to how to handle this situation.