10 year old DS suddenly struggling to behave in class and hating school (Year 5)

[SockEatingMonster]

DS started Y5 so happy to go back to school and really excited with his new teacher. By the second week he hated school and had started to worry he had become "one of the bad kids". Nothing has improved since then.

He is doing well academically and is well-liked with a nice group of close friends who never seem to fall out. However, he says he struggles to do what the teacher says and that the work is boring. The boring comment would not worry me so much if it wasn't for the strength of emotion this boredom seems to unleash in him. Many days he will absolutely sob his heart out as he gets into the car because the lessons were "so boring". My DS hardly ever cries or gets visibly upset about anything, so I find this quite alarming. He feels he struggles to follow instructions and classroom rules and is always getting things slightly wrong (doing tasks in the wrong order, for example, or not realising that a general classroom rule does not apply to a certain situation). He says he tries so hard to concentrate and thinks he is doing really well, then realises he's got it wrong!

I have spoken to his teacher, who said he seemed easily distracted and has had a rocky start to the year. The teacher also acknowledged that he was on a challenging table, and would be moved next term. There are no concerns about his actual work and the teacher is strict but well regarded within the school, so I don't think it's a problem with the teacher either.

I have just looked back through all his old school reports and they are all positively glowing. A well-mannered, thoughtful child who puts 100% into his work, etc, etc.

There is no change in his behaviour at home and he is keen to try anything that might help. Towards the end of September we drastically cut screen-time and altered his already very healthy diet to remove pretty much all processed foods, sweets etc. It hasn't helped, although he doesn't seem to mind so we have stuck with it.

I don't know what else to do. I want to go back and speak to his teacher, but don't know what to suggest.

Make an appointment with SENCO, ask her to look at his executive function and processing speed skills, that with being 'easily distracted' could suggest he needs more help.

If school see nothing of concern, go to your GP on your own but tell them beforehand it's about your son, take a list of the things your son is struggling with and ask for him be referred for a SEN assessment. This paragraph is a big red flag as is the easily distracted comment.
He is doing well academically and is well-liked with a nice group of close friends who never seem to fall out. However, he says he struggles to do what the teacher says and that the work is boring. The boring comment would not worry me so much if it wasn't for the strength of emotion this boredom seems to unleash in him. Many days he will absolutely sob his heart out as he gets into the car because the lessons were "so boring". My DS hardly ever cries or gets visibly upset about anything, so I find this quite alarming. He feels he struggles to follow instructions and classroom rules and is always getting things slightly wrong (doing tasks in the wrong order, for example, or not realising that a general classroom rule does not apply to a certain situation). He says he tries so hard to concentrate and thinks he is doing really well, then realises he's got it wrong

It's a very common age for things to show up, kids saying school is boring in such an emotionally vehement way or becoming the class clown, both MAY indicate that they know they have a problem doing the work but they don't want to admit they are struggling to understand what's needed from them so their behaviour deflects from the actual issue.

Have a read of the SNChildren and SNChat boards on here, you'll see you are far from alone to have concerns about your child.

Thank you BlankTimes, I had a bit of a google and what you suggested does seem like it would describe what he can’t quite put into words.

When we talk about ways of managing the boredom it seems to me like the work is actually not all that boring, is just not delivering the high-interest he needs to get stuck in easily. I think he then probably feels anxious, but lacks the ability to put this into words.

I wonder why it only rears it’s head at this age? Maybe hormones or the changes in curriculum as they move towards SATs?

My guess - I'm not in any position to do any more than guess but I see it a lot on the SN boards, is that once a child reaches their limits they begin to behave differently.
Until that time, they've jogged along with everyone else, then something changes and that's likely to be a combination of a lot of factors. It affects different kids at different times.

In years 5 and 6, Hormone surges and maybe a realisation that they suddenly are 'different' and not in the loop. They don't automatically understand what their friends do and it's a shock. Their material at school is likely to be presented in a totally new way, more adult vocabulary is used which can be ambiguous therefore more difficult to interpret and it's less fun as it's focused on results.

Transition to secondary, everything's different, having to plan what you need for which lesson and each one is in a different place on an often huge campus.

Transition to uni once again a complete change of area, living accommodation, teaching styles and kids are expected to realise what difficulties they are having and seek the right help for that.

Kudos to you for noticing so quickly and for wanting to help him and for being open enough to think outside the box of "bad" behaviour must be punished.

As I said in my first reply, sometimes schools "see nothing" especially when kids are academically able. IF that happens, go to your GP with a list of things that your son struggles with and ask your GP to refer him for assessments.

Good luck in sorting it all out for him, you can!

The only thing I'd add is that the teacher has acknowledged that he's on a challenging table and will move him 'next term'. Why not now? Moving him to a table nearer the teacher, or with less disruptive children, could make a big difference. Why should he be allowed to struggle for another month? I wonder if the teacher can be persuaded to act immediately.

"doing tasks in the wrong order, for example, or not realising that a general classroom rule does not apply to a certain situation). He says he tries so hard to concentrate and thinks he is doing really well, then realises he's got it wrong!"

This sounds like my ds(10, yr6), who has traits of adhd/asd.(not diagnosed, it was inconclusive)

He tends to misinterpret the instruction by not listening until the end thinking he understood. He says sometimes he struggles to concentrate because he get distracted by a minor things. He can focus well if interested, but can totally switch of if not.
It wasn't a big issue in lower years, but certainly started to show more in upper primary.

Few days ago, he was telling me that he thinks he definitely have adhd, since he feels and sees his surroundings so different from others. Only good side was that he thinks it's cool, thanks to Percy Jackson.

Getting him an eye test and a hearing test might rule out some reasons why he might have started struggling in class.

I caught the SENCO very quickly on the playground this morning to ask her the best way to make an appointment to discuss my worries about DS. She was lovely and said that she had already spoken with his teacher about him (he's already on her radar for unrelated reasons), that he is polite and well mannered (phew!) but not listening properly and making lots of silly mistakes as a result. She's been his class teacher before, so she knows him quite well.

I didn't get a chance to discuss anything else as she had a class to get to, but she's going to chat to his teacher and come back to me.

I'm feeling really positive about it. Thank you for the hand hold and all the suggestions. It wouldn't have occurred to me to speak to the SENCO. I'm also going to have a lurk on the SN boards and see what I can pick up there.

Oops, I posted without refreshing the page and missed a load of replies.

He has minor hearing problems, which is why he is on his table (nearest to the teacher) and had his last eye test in May, so should be all ok there. Good thinking though!

I also wondered why he hadn't been moved earlier, but I wonder whether his teacher feels he has more to learn by being where he is? I will definitely ask! They do move around a bit during the day, so he does get a break.

We thought he might have ASD when he was little irvineoneohone. He certainly has some of the traits! However, he doesn't struggle socially, so I think that might preclude it? He does get completely absorbed in whatever he's doing, more than other children I think, and has quite a narrow range of interests. For example, he prefers to stick to the same narrow range of authors and re-read books than try new ones.

I don't know much about ADHD, so I will have a google.

I'm hoping that whatever it is, the SENCO will have come across it before!

Is it possible the teacher has taken a dislike to him and now feels irritated by him constantly and picks on him, this could then stress him and cause him to make more mistakes? Just throwing another possibility into the mix as it started at the beginning of the year but he was fine in previous years. I'm sure a lot of accusations of teachers picking on a child are unfair, but it can happen occasionally.

The teacher also acknowledged that he was on a challenging table, and would be moved next term.

It could well be that he's already working harder to cope with the class environment and being on a challenging table is pushing him beyond what he can deal with.

I have some diagnosed conditions pretty sure older two have traits of them though no diagnoses and I've seen this with them - absolutely fine then get sat with difficult group/individual often in hope that their good behaviour rubs off.

The teacher usually realises and move but have had one dig in with DD1 – it was all her and/or our parenting it was awful made home life really bad for several weeks finally was due to see head teacher and she had a meltdown in school which shocked the school as she’d been model student – lead to questions and as soon as she was moved her stress levels dropped and her behaviour at home went back to normal – though rest of that year with teacher she was more on edge and she noticeably relaxed then next school year with new teacher.

I did worry about that initially MarysInTheDyson, but having met the teacher and listened very carefully to what DS has to say, I don't think it is the case.

That's awful bigKiteFlying. I'm must admit, I was worried it would get written off as bad parenting, which is the main reason why we've stuck with low screen-time / low sugar. He's a sweetheart at home - helpful, non-argumentative and very, very independent, so I'm pretty sure it's not something we've done.

Thinking more about his table, the layout of the room is such that there is only 1 table close to the white board and teacher's desk, with all the other tables in a kind of U along the back wall. I imagine that the teacher uses that table for children that need closer supervision and children like DS who might struggle to hear from the back. I suppose they are reluctant to move him further away from the front in case his hearing problems make things worse, but also reluctant to move the more challenging children further away in case they disrupt the class. I might suggest they try DS a bit further back, as his hearing problems are pretty minor in comparison to his concentration problems!

Would he be better off trying to work with children that are of similar ability? I don’t know of naughty tables in schools I visit. It’s counter productive and the children act up more if they are labelled. Yes, he could be near the front but with children who are of similar ability to him. He needs to feel he fits in and sitting with children who have understood what to do can be helpful. Often they discuss the work with children nearby and this should be encouraged.

Sorry, I missed your reply @BubblesBuddy. They are moving the tables around today, so we will soon see!

I don't think it was meant to end up as the naughty table. Out of the 4 children who were on it there were 2 who are known to be disruptive, DS who has slight hearing problems and 1 child who seemed to be there quite randomly. The class's 1 other disruptive child was on another table, so it could have been worse!

I am hoping DS will find things easier on a different table. I don't think it's the whole story though.

No, the table probably will not be the whole story but not being labelled might help. Best of luck.

I hadn’t thought of it that way.

Anyway, he’s got home and he’s now on a table with 2 immaculately behaved children and... the other disruptive child!!! He seems pretty pleased though and says he thinks the teacher has spread out the “silly children” to 1 per table. I’m encouraged that he’s seeing himself as one of the non-silly children. The other 2 children are pretty bullet proof, so hopefully the mood on this table will be a bit more focused.

He said he had a good day, although the topic work was “so boring”. They did a solid afternoon of maths questions which he said he really enjoyed though, so I’m thinking that ‘boring’ might mean ‘task was so open ended I got overwhelmed and didn’t know where to start’. Hopefully I’ll get a chance to chat to the SENCO this week and get her thoughts.