End of year 5, little or no progress

[WakeUpMaggie]

Ds is 10 and at the end of year 5. He's always been a little below the average and found learning to read a huge struggle but he has gone downhill in all areas this year. As of this year, the school have been testing the children regularly. DS is getting ridiculously low scores. I was told yesterday "just to warn you, he got 25% in his combined scores for numeracy and literacy". His problems are pretty much across the board :
Slow at reading. He can only read if he has a reading ruler (provided by me. The school never mentioned it)
Poor comprehension when he takes the SAT style test papers for literacy.
Terrible at maths. His teacher thinks he has dyscalculia. She said he just doesn't understand or retain any information relating to maths. For example he couldn't understand 6000ml is the same as 6l.0

He also has difficulty following sequential instructions. For example, if I said put your shoes on, feed the rabbit, put your cup in the dishwasher and brush your teeth he would be befuddled and wouldn't know where to start.

He has had an Ed psych assessment but it wasn't the full one as the school didn't have the funds a d mainly concentrated on maths despite me expressing concern about him not being a le to read without a reading ruler. They just clarified what I already knew to be honest, very low maths score, poor working memory and visual a d verbal processing a d suggested a referral to SALT.

I just don't feel I have any answers. He says the work is so much harder in year 5, so that would explain the sudden huge deterioration. I am dreading his end is year report.

Sorry this is so long. What should I expect from the school? Should DS be on the SEN register and if so, what will that mean? They have tried varjous interventions such as time with a TA, giving him less work etc but nothing has worked.

I could cry. He gets so upset when the test scores get given out. We have to apply for secondary schools soon and I really don't want him ending up in the bottom sets. I have already been told he may not pass the SATs. I feel so frustrated as he seemed OK in all other years. A little below average but not at the point of failing.

Really depends on what EP comes back with.

SALT may be important to. My dd has receptive language difficulties, so she struggles to understand lamguage, however her expressive speech is age appropriate. It has a significant impact on her education, but a teacher would not pick it up (nor could I). Only an in-depth assessment revealed this.

I'm wondering what an assessment would change. Can you please explain me the benefit of it?
Meggie- my dd is a similar one, also in y5.
Always in a low ability set. Struggles accros curriculum. Tutored since y2. Yes she does make a progress but we put so much effort in it.
School does not seem to see a problem. I spoke to her teachers in the past: she is bilingual and they believe that's the reason.
Reading is an issue, math problem solving also tricky.
Problems with hearing due to glue ear in the past, visual stress diagnosed.
Senco useless.

An assessment give you written proof of what the issues are. It also may give you additional people that can put pressure on the school to adapt to your child's needs.
e.g If I'm having issues I can phone both the OT and/or the paeditrician to contact the school to put pressure on them.

Seriously - don't worry about upsetting the school. In a year's time the school will be a memory and a badly printed leavers' hoodie - he's your son for life! Hell, I'm as supportive and as positive and reliable a parent as you can get with my own kids' school but when it comes to DD2's SEN issues - I'll put my foot down (politely and calmly and with good nature) when required without a second thought. Dreaded doing it recently having to call the SENCO to account as we'd had minimal SEN paperwork from the school all year (thankfully the class teacher + me tag team have been fucking awesome and had it all under control but I wanted it formalised for next year) but actually it's not made a jot of difference to the relationship with the school at all.

I really queried tests because there was an implication that they were the only evidence offered to a parent that a child wasn’t making progress. The OP should be able to see all work when she sees the SendCo so that a detailed picture is built up. I’m not saying schools don’t test but it’s not the only evidence they should have. Far from it. So just giving a parent a set of test results is minimal information. It is also comparing the DC with others. No differentiation in tests. 25% just tells you your child isn’t doing as well as the others but has no information about building up to the next level of understanding. It just says he cannot achieve anything in 75% of the test.

In the circumstances, the school needs to do a lot more and the teacher needs to be far more proactive. It all sounds a bit shrugging of shoulders to me.

School does not seem to see a problem. I spoke to her teachers in the past: she is bilingual and they believe that's the reason

As a bi-lingual familiy living in the world of special needs with a variety of diagnosis in the mix I can tell you that the bilingual aspect of your daughter is a red herring. A convenient one.

It can even be something parents afraid to see beyond because of the alternative.

What does a diagnosis do? It helps the child have support put in in place even at college level when for when extra time can be given during exams for eg.

suggested a referral to SALT

Did this happen @WakeUpMaggie ?

I think that should be your next step before you shell out more on repeat tests with another EdPsych.

Push for meeting with SENCO at school.

Sounds like potentially a processing issue, could be linked to dyslexia and dyspraxia and related conditions.

Get him seen by a specialist and get a diagnosis and definitely push to see the school SENCO asap too.

Believe me, bottom sets aren't all bad behaviour. My bottom set year 7 are my favourite class, I totally love them. They're hard working, gorgeous kids doing their best and I enjoy every lesson with them. No real behaviour issues at all. A higher proportion have SEND so we have lots of strategies and differentiation to help pupils.

A good SEN department in a secondary will help no end, but shout, jump up and down and be 'that parent' to get what he needs

Thank you all. I spoke to a private Ed psych who recommended I didn't get a repeat report as she said she would just be duplicating what's been done. She did suggest a dyslexia assessment at a specialist centre.

Do any of you know what being on the SEN register would achieve?

Should I be trying to get a EHCP? I don't think he's that bad but don't want to miss anything. How would that be a benefit?

We have the choice of two secondary schools in our town. Both similar so we were going to put the closest first. Is it worth me speaking to the SEN department at the schools when we apply to gauge the difference? I don't even know if you can do this. I have heard through the grapevine that one is better than the other.

Do try to get him on the SEN register. This will ensure he is given targets that the teacher needs to help him try and meet. I have found that low children in a class are often passed over because the teacher would rather put their efforts into children they know will show more progress. When children are on the SEN register teacher and the school are more accountable to show progress so he will get the attention he needs.

The schools I have worked in always try to deter parents from getting private assessments because the school has to pay a percentage of any support the child might need. Get the dyslexia test; it might help to secure extra support at school.

If the school has shelled out for an ed psych he is already on the seen register.
The Ed psych has, by the sound of it, done a pretty full assessment. The frustration you have is waiting for the report so you can see the actual scores and plans. I sympathise but Ed psychs get very snowed under at this time of year as everyone wants their kids seen by the end of term so reports do tend to pile up.
The Ed psych has already identified a number of issues (working memory, processing, speech and language) and the way sen works by law is that an assess, plan, do, review cycling approach MUST be followed. He has had the assessment and a plan is being devised (admittedly rather slowly). The school will then have a better understanding of what to do to support your DS and this must be done and reviewed. It sounds like communication has been quite poor. It sounds also like no one has explained sen processes. But it sounds like it is is hand and plans are made or being made in support of your son.

Btw well done to that private ep. Getting another assessment before seeing the full scope in writing of the previous one is pointless, and as most assessments can't be repeated within a certain timescale the second ep would be very limited.

Thank you.

Oldbirdy you sound like an expert. Thank toy for the explanation. You're right, communication is poor. They haven't said he's on the SEN register but I understand now. I am new to SEN although I don't think I should be given DS has been there since nursery! Would you advise me pursuing the dyslexia test?

Also, should I be looking at a EHCP? Particularly with secondary school applications coming up.

I would find a primary that is a better fit for your son. It IS worth it to move him for Year 6.
His current school is 'high achieving' so its strengths are with more academic pupils.
His school doesn't appear to give him the support he needs. They don't seem to even understand what support he needs.
If you have any choice in secondary school, choose wisely too. It's tempting to go for those with great exam results but I'd look for a school with great support.
It may just be a 'wobble' that will sort itself out- my son made no progress Yr3( transfer to KS2) but he did catch up. Plus,- the SATs are more difficult than previously. He has another year to learn and practise.
I'd definitely go for the detailed Ed Psych ( auditory processing difficulties may be one possibility) and consider a tutor- he may do much better 1:1

Thank you. He is very happy at the school and tbh I have no idea which school would be better. They all seem to be criticised in one way or another. I can home school next year which I ha E considered. He has a tutor already but I am thinking of finding a SEN tutor. Good point about what to look for at secondary.

Hi there. I saw your post and had to respond as a Year Five teacher. Firstly, I am sorry your DS feels this way- the school should be trying to make the testing feel less formal or pressured. Unfortunately, testing is now regular in most schools.

We test ours every half term now and although I don't necessarily agree with it- it is becoming common practice. I try to let my children know the testing isn't serious and is just for us to know where they are but I can imagine some find them stressful. The only advantage I have seen so far is that children have become so used to tests that SATs don't seem as scary (or so our yr 6 children told us). We do analyse our data and then carry out support groups for children who need it so the school should be doing more to support your DS.

The curriculum is harder now so he may not have dropped in progress as such- just the step up to the next level of work is harder.

Please if you can afford it-get a private consultation. We are grateful to those parents because once they've been carried out we will have an action plan of where they need help and can apply for funding etc. Unfortunately schools just can't afford full assessments. We have to fight for each one and this year only five children were seen as that was all we could afford. They won't be annoyed so don't feel bad.

Lastly, you are the parent so you know best.

@wakeupmaggie
No, don't pursue dyslexia testing until you know what the first EP is saying, and have seen their report. Your efforts would be best placed in pressuring the school and EP for a proper meeting WITH the Ed psych AND her report before the end of term so that everyone, including next year's teacher, has a proper understanding of identified needs and strategies ready for next year.

An EHCP will depend on what his scores are, whether the school has properly supported him, (the phrase in the SEN law is "used their best endeavours") yet, how much progress he makes once a proper plan is in place.

There is a useful guide to process published by special needs jungle with the DFE, let me see if I can link it for you. It gives flow charts explaining processes.

specialneedsjungle.com/new-format-for-snjs-send-system-flow-charts/

Decide on dyslexia testing once that meeting with school and EP takes place.
Otherwise you are stabbing in the dark when in reality the EP may be satisfied that their findings explain his issues (apart from his speech and language where they have made appropriate on - referrals).

I was just about to paste the special needs jungle flow chart and I've been beaten to it.

If he's been having interventions in school and ed psych time he should be on the school SEN register. I think sometimes there's a tendency for schools to chug along through the processes and forget the parental involvement part of it - I've had to call my own kids' school (which is fab) to account on that one recently myself.

I think if you have the means to obtain private reports I personally would - but that's as someone who's had to go through the system being unable to pay for them and the waiting is a killer! Our school are also having a bugger of a time at the moment in that any referrals they try to put through (particularly to Speech and Language) are just being bounced back at an obscene rate - the SENCO's amazed we got DD2 through, seen and onto the waiting list to be honest as I think it's the only kid this year they've had any success getting through the system!

Thank you all for your time and hugely valuable advice. I will take a look at the flow chart after work. DS has been in intervention for as long as I can remember. It's something I raised in year 1 when I found out DS was in intervention for all their sessions. I asked if this seemed odd to them and why hadn't I been told. That went down like a lead balloon. When I say intervention I mean the sessions outside the class with a TA. He's in one for maths and another for hand writing. When I originally asked for SENCO involvement and why he wasn't on the SEN register they said the intervention with the class ta was not over and above normal support (or words to that affect) so wouldn't trigger a SEN query. I was a bit seeing as he was in all the sessions and had been from the start. I am just not sure what they mean support over and above normal levels. As far as I know they don't bring outside agents in routinely but I guess they mean he wasn't being seen by an OT or SALT. But he wouldn't because they didn't refer him. it's all very confusing.

My ds had difficulty concentrating and follow multi-step instructions.
It has improved so much since he started martial arts. I think it may worth a try.