Should we be allowed to see what work our children do at school???

[SchoolMum66]

Wondering what is done at other Primary schools???...There is always a feeling at our school that the school staff do not like parents having transparency. There is a generally hostile/defensive stance towards parents. The latest thing is a change to morning routine. My children are in year 1 and 2, and we could previously come into the cloakroom and the classroom for drop off btn 8.40 and 8.55. This was invaluable to us as we got a few minutes to see what work they were doing - seeing stuff up on walls in classroom etc, and because their worksheets from previous day with corrections to be done were on their desks, so parents could see (a) what they were doing each day (as anyone knows if you ask a child what they did at school they say "nothing") and (b) more importantly see what they were struggling with so we can follow up at home. Perfect! Now we are not allowed into the building at all (staff guarding the door). The official reason is along the lines of 'safeguarding' (laughable in a rural school of 80!) and independence. None of us believe this is the real reason.
So what I want to know is what is allowed in other schools??
And what feedback parents get in other schools?? We have two parent/teacher meetings per year, stopwatch put on as we walk in the door for 10 minutes. And one 1/2 hour per year where we can come in to see the children's workbooks (30 children + parents in the classroom at once so can't talk to teacher, just a quick flick through). Other than this we never, ever get to see their work. The only information we have about what they are doing is the brief summary of the year on the curriculum page, but not detailed or specific and not scheduled. And NO feedback on our own child, except 2x10 minutes/yr.
It is made clear that we are never allowed to speak to the teacher, at drop off or pick up. We are told instead to write a message/question to the teacher and send with child. I have done this a handful of times and more often than not it is ignored. Are you able to speak to teachers at other schools??
So I am trying to get an idea about what other schools do, and if we can reasonably expect to know/see what work our children are doing??

because their worksheets from previous day with corrections to be done were on their desks

I think I'd be more ticked off with a school that had a worksheet and marking based approach to education...

Not being allowed in sounds very, very sensible, I am amazed most parents have any desire to beyond the beginning of reception!

When mine were in school, they had an internet portal thing . The parents could sign in (each student had a code) and see if there was any homework assigned, what the child's marks are , upcoming projects or trips, school newsletters, a class calendar etc
If you had a question, you sent an email to the teacher, as that way there is a record of everything, and the teacher didn't have to stay late every day talking to parents

We used to get an opportunity once a term , either as a drop in at start/end of school or parents' evening.

Our school has an open class once a month where parents can visit from 8.50-10. We get to see the morning routine and observe how the teacher and children interact. You are then invited to have coffee with parent council reps and the head teacher. I really like the openess of it all.

I used to have a quick look through my dds workbooks as well when I was in but I don't go as much now she is in P4. I tend to go to the first couple of the year it lets me get to know the teacher and the layout of the class. My dd has a physical disability so classroom layout is important to minimise falls etc

At DDs' old primary:

• parents not allowed in building in morning
• works-sharing once a term
• parents evening twice a year
• written report once a year
• access to teacher at end of day if needed, and can have a quick word in morning e.g. 'Cat died / Feeling poorly / Can I see you after school'

Our Dc go to a rural independent school and they are very relaxed.

I understand about the parents in the hall way but there is never more than ten per class so there may be a few parents hanging around but I can appreciate if there was 20+ it would be a nightmare !

We get a monthly newsletter, one for the whole school, one class specific, and one PTA. We know what are children are learning and my child tells me all about it after school anyway. I can see how his spelling/writing/maths is coming along from his homework, but I can contact his teacher any time. We have an open day once a year when we can see the work, and twice yearly parent evenings. During fairs we can see some of the work as it is hung throughout the school. Don't more than that really.

The official reason is along the lines of 'safeguarding' (laughable in a rural school of 80!)

Do you personally know that none of the relatives of those children are people who shouldn't be around their child/other children? No cases of domestic violence, no parents without PR, no sexual offenders etc?

Safeguarding is never a laughable offence.

Happens in rural schools too...

At our school in Reception and Y1, parents are expected to take DC to the classrooms, but hanging around to look at stuff or chat with the teacher is discouraged, unless it’s something directly relevant to that day. It’s a busy time of day and they don’t have time in the morning for general chat about pupil’s progress.

The teachers bring DC out to the playground at hometime, and are usually available to answer quick questions, but if it’s likely to take more than a few minutes, parents are asked to make appointments.

IME, if the teachers are aware of an actual issue that’s cropped up in school, e.g. DC struggling with working at school and could do with support out of school, then they’ll approach the parents about it rather than wait till parents evening or until a parent asks them about it.

Parents evenings are 10 minute slots, and the DC’s exercise books etc are set out so parents can see their own DC’s work then.

We have to leave DC at the door. We can have a very quick word with the teacher.

There are several opportunities over the year to go in a see work in addition to parents evenings.

Even when I was in a primary school in the 80s, parents never came in.

I would never have got ds into a classroom full of fussing parents! He struggled enough with the ones who insisted on going into the cloakroom.

There is nothing vaguely unreasonable about what you have said the school have introduced

As other have said, this is all pretty much normal.

Now we are not allowed into the building at all (staff guarding the door). - normal. Many schools do allow parents in to drop off in reception, at least for the first term, but many don't. As a governor of a primary school, the idea of 30+ parents (and others - GPs, random relatives..) wandering the halls of a morning unchecked always gives me the heebie jeebies! I can see it's nice for the parents but the problem is that it is an easily abused privilege.

two parent/teacher meetings per year, stopwatch put on as we walk in the door for 10 minutes. - normal. 30 children in a class - that's 5 hours of parents evening, assuming everyone sticks to their 10 mins.

And one 1/2 hour per year where we can come in to see the children's workbooks (30 children + parents in the classroom at once so can't talk to teacher, just a quick flick through). - normal. Actually, my primary does this once a term, and gives about 2 hours to it so it's a bit more flexible. They also have the books out at parents evening so you can come a bit early and look at them. Maybe suggest this?

The only information we have about what they are doing is the brief summary of the year on the curriculum page, but not detailed or specific and not scheduled. - do you not get any newsletters? Our primary sends this weekly with a brief summary of what each year are doing.

NO feedback on our own child, except 2x10 minutes/yr. - do you not get a written school report at all?

It is made clear that we are never allowed to speak to the teacher, at drop off or pick up. We are told instead to write a message/question to the teacher and send with child. - normal. Whilst many parents would stick to the only talking when necessary/quick mention that little freddie is a bit off today, many more don't and it becomes unmanageable. Often it's better to have stuff in writing too.

I have done this a handful of times and more often than not it is ignored. - that's not great though, of course it isn't.

If you feel that you would like more engagement, a good place to start maybe to suggest perhaps being able to look at books on a termly basis?

Wow.

Saw the title and was fully prepared to defend you & say of course you can see your kids work. I'd presumed teachers weren't letting you see anything at all.

Your safeguarding comment is just astounding. Would you think it laughable if an adult with convictions for child abuse was sitting next to your child in the classroom? Or following your child into the toilet? Or setting up a video camera in the toilet? All possible with that number of parents in the school in the mornings.

Rural does NOT mean safe.
Small does NOT mean safe.

There is a reason why adults who want to work or volunteer in schools have DBS checks.
Do not presume that because you know all the parents that you actually 'know' everything about them.

You sound like a right pain in the arse tbh, no wonder they stopped it. That level of contact is normal. Ask your child what they did at school!

2 out of the 3 schools my kids have been to have been playground drop off. The 3rd was cloakroom for reception and under (although I was swiftly told to stop that by DS2 who is an independent sort)

And whilst I don't know what they're doing week to week, I do get homework/spellings, and everything gets sent home at the end of term (I presume to save on their rubbish bill!) so I can see what they've done, if not what they're doing.

I think this is fine.

We have a slightly more controlled approach in our school - they have open class days where parents can come in at pickup and go and see all their workbooks etc, which are out on the desks. Roughly 3 times a term, and the staff have an 'open door' policy so at any time at pickup we can go in the classroom to talk to them.

My child is only in reception so I'm sure it will change as they get older. But they are great. We have an online learning journey that the teachers upload photos and videos to of things they do at school. Some are group things others are individual. The school probably add between 1-3 things a week on average. It is a delight to see what they get up to as completely agree like getting blood out if a stone trying to find out from my kids. No idea how the teachers manage it though, must be a pain in the arse. The software is called tapestry and you can add comments in to the pictures for the teachers to see. The teachers use some form of pad in the class but as we often get several notifications at once guessing they go through it in bulk every week. Some of the stuff is quite generic in that it is a photo tagged with a specific learning objective that I guess is from a standard list that the teacher must select. They can add more specific notes too which does happen but mostly it's just nice to see what they are doing.

Why is safeguarding 'laughable' in a rural school of 80. I think your school's original policy was lax, and I would have complained about that, not this!

What you describe sounds like hell on earth for the staff!

I’m guessing that they started by allowing parents in to drop children off and certain parents have push, push, pushed the boundaries until the situation became an intolerable mess of safeguarding and privacy concerns.
I’m willing to bet that they’ve had trouble shepherding you all out, too.

Presumably the staff have either had a collective breakdown or there has indeed been a safeguarding incident. Perhaps a parent has understandably complained. You won’t be told about any of that, by the way.
Why on earth do you need to know all this information? Don’t you trust them?

We occasionally speak to the teacher (Y1, more for us as DS has some special needs) but don't go into the classroom unless I'm last to pick up and need to look for something!
Communication is via diaries and they sign to say it's been read. Sometimes it's important for the teacher e.g. hospital appointment.
We email the SENCO, see bits and pieces he brings home, and then have reports feedback.

I think there has been a shift in parental attitudes to dropping children off at school in the last 20 years or so. I have always dropped off at the entrance to the school or they walked a bit. We are rural and several miles from school. All parents seemed happy with that after a few were unsettled in YR and they became more confident. Email and notes was the best method and I used to put a note in the reading log on book change day (rarely).

When DD2 started at a local prep, parents were everywhere because, somehow, these little darlings needed more care and attention from Mum and Dad. Far more had separation issues becuase the expectation of walking in by yourself was absent. A friend expected to speak to the teacher of DD every day! Just to say "hello and how is she getting on?" Its just ridiculous. Another parent, in Y1, actually stood outside the classroom window crying with their child crying on the other side of the window inside the classroom. I would have pulled the blind down! Therefore, I do think parents and children should have rules of drop off and there is no need to be in cloakrooms or classrooms every day. Visiting once a year on an open day and going to (two) parents' evenings with books available to see works fine. Parents see homework so have some idea of progress.

Regarding the curriculum, the best schools give a curriculum summary for the term, not for the whole year on the web site. That is usually a bit too general. I really valued termly curriculum information because it included books to read, places to visit and what you can do to support your child if you wish. It is an excellent resource and should be encouraged.

DD is at a middle school (year 5 to 8)

Two 'book look' evenings a year plus parent teacher consultation once a year.

If you want to talk to the teacher you just email them direct. All the teachers email the parents at the start of the school year and introduce themselves and say 'please contact me if you need to'.

Can also email the HT, deputy and SENCO direct or email/ring the office and they will pass on a message.

The school is very open to parent feedback and suggestions.

To be honest though, looking through a maths jotter of endless sums doesn't really inspire me in any way. I love looking at her art work and reading her English book though.

Children play in playground until head teacher appears at the top. Children file up the ramp and met by teacher at the door. Haven't accompanied my daughter to the classroom since reception. She's now Year 2. Parents evening and emails allow me to see what she is doing and also the homework she brings home helps me see what she enjoys and finds easier that other things.
Whether there are 8 or 800 children in a school, none of the Safeguarding measures are 'laughable'. Incidents of abuse can happen anywhere, and do happen. I applaud your school for ensuring they are keeping your children safe. If you have concerns about aspects of school then I'd contact the teacher.
Quite frankly, I imagine the teacher would like to crack on with the day she/he has planned rather than waiting for milling parents to leave.

My youngest is in reception and the TA's from each year group come out at 8.50 and watch the children file into school (90 children per year and each year group has its own entrance door).

Parents can have a brief word with the teacher/TA before and after school. Anything lengthy would be a pre-arranged appointment.
We get a weekly newsletter and a photo sent by email of our child taking part in work/play/activity.
2 parents evenings per year.
Can view work during open afternoons (3 per year)
Art work usually comes home at the end of each term.