Could anyone help me with this admissions question?

[RiddleyW]

My plan is to sell my house, rent very close to the school I like until admissions are complete and then buy a house (still very close to the school).

This isn't doing anything wrong is it? I won't have two addresses at any point so I can't see there would be any issue.

I know our area for catchment is you need 6 months of bills and a council tax statement for your house to be used as checks (and trust me they check!)
Bank statements won't work as they can be changed easily.

Check with your school for details needed but I've said before that if people do this and then move out area it is stealing placements and our area fines for this.

Also what happens if you can't find a rent or catchment changes (that's happened tons of times).

Thanks Gryffen - so in your area do you know what they do with people who've moved house in the six months prior to admissions? And how long you have to stay after admissions to avoid a fine.

The school has no catchment, just 30 places in order of distance (after other criteria are applied).

Our school asks for proof in the form of child benefit letter. (though that was years ago now)

We looked at renting close to the school, not for admissions but because we needed to move from our rented house and didnt want to leave the area....but they refused to rent to us as we had a child. I assume they had had a turnover of tenants who would rent to get into school and then leave. It cant be because of damage as they were more than happy for us to rent with a big dog but not with a child!!!

Actually, that's a very good point mrs! I suppose it's possible landlords would just say no. I'd be looking at renting a 3 bed house though so presumably they are usually rented by people with children.

Urgh it's so difficult! I'm just trying to avoid DS having to move schools once he's settled.

What do the admissions stats for school on question suggest would happen if you applied from current home?

Definitely wouldn't get in - it's about 2 miles away and nearest last year was 0.3 miles.

Is this primary a feeder school for particularly decent secondary? Or are you, in current home, in a school black spot where you're likely to miss out on several of nearest schools? I suppose pragmatically I'd be weighing up the issues around selling (what is your local market like), finding something appropriate to rent at right time in presumably a tight geographical market of say 0.1-0.2 miles of school and then upheaval of looking to buy. If all of that hassle and uncertainty is the only way to get out of a blackhole I can see why you'd consider (obviously no idea what timeline you're working with!) but if it was for a slightly better regarded primary am not sure I would put myself through it (mind that may be as the stress of our last move two years ago has only recently receded!)

Seeing as you are planning on buying nearby to the school, is there a particular reason for renting first, rather than buying straight away?

Is it that you don't want to buy that close to the school?

As to your question, I think if you have no other property, and this is reflected in your council tax, child benefit address, doctor's surgery registration etc then at the time of the application process, they would have to use your rental address.

However if you then move again shortly afterwards, they might consider your application to have been fraudulent and withdraw the offer. (Fines are the least of your worry - the consequence is that the place offered is withdrawn. This can happen even after the child has started at the school.)

The application is fraudulent if you rented 'in order to gain a school place' I believe. So there is nothing wrong with renting if you had other reasons for renting there. The fact that you rented there purely for the admissions timeframe does strongly indicate though that your main reason was to gain a school place. You would have to be able to provide strong evidence that you had another compelling reason for renting there, and then moved away involuntarily (landlord gave notice).

I am potentially in a black hole - we would have scraped into our nearest school this year on distance but that may change next year. No chance on any other school that I can see - it would have to be outside the borough I guess.

Also I want to move anyway, it's not a sideways move - we're doubling the mortgage and getting a much nicer house (hopefully!) much closer to the station for my commute. So we want to make this move regardless but are worried about the timing meaning we'd need to move poor DS' school.

Or he may not get a school place at all - at least I have no idea where he'd end up anyway. There is no safety option, all the schools in the borough are oversubscribed.

So we need to be moved by Jan 2019 and I was thinking that would be more likely if we aren't trying to do a big chain.

Sorry Brill crossposted - reason is timing, we're worried it's too tight to get done in time.

We wouldn't be renting just to get a school place, we'd be renting as otherwise we'd be homeless as we'll have sold our house. We's be renting in that area partly for the schools but presumably that's allowed?

If you've not already done it I'd look at how the sales market is going and speak to EAs. How quickly are sales progressing, chain breakdowns etc. It will also depend on what ability/capacity you have for a quick move. If the ideal enough home to buy came up under the 0.2 margin, could you/would you be willing to market yours to facilitate quick sale or are you needing top price possible to boost funds? For me I think my preference would be for purchase straight away and I'd need to weigh capacity to achieve that versus cost/stress of sale-rent-buy ....

Our house is on the market and we have accepted an offer but the bottom of the chain collapsed yesterday so that's what got me thinking that splitting the process would mean that it's more likely to go through by January. We don't need top price (and accepted a pretty low offer a week after it went on) but can't afford to move to the area if we do a complete price slash.

It's all feeling a bit intractable to be honest.

Oh what a nightmare. Is your current home likely to attract FTB? If it is then possibly easiest way to sell would be to restrict interest to no chain buyers but no idea if that would be feasible in your market. If not I suppose even with no upward sale you still have downward chain. How frustrating for you

Thanks Myrtle! I feel a bit better just moaning about it. I'm sure it'll all work out one way or another in the end but bloody hell it's stressful!

I think we're probably unlikely to attract FTB although we may get a buy to let type - I'd certainly take a bit off for someone not in a chain!

To answer the original question, it depends on the local authority and school. Some would accept that on the basis that you aren't owning and renting at the same time. Some might regard that as cheating, which means they could take your child's school place away even after they have started school. I think most would regard it as ok but it would be safest to talk to the LA about what you are doing. Make sure you send an email recording your understanding of any telephone conversations. That way you have a paper trail if they tell you one thing but then do something different.

Yes I must just call the LA I suppose. I wonder what happens if I call them having the sold the house and begun renting. I suppose they might say you have to not buy a house for x months but that does seem bizarre. Presumably they can’t say there is now no way for you to legitimately apply for school.

They have to allow you to apply. However, if they think you are trying to fiddle the system they may use the address of your current house, even though you will have sold it.

What you really need to do is sell the house by say October and then move into rental, on the basis of a 12 month rental. That would satisfy most LAs that your actual place where you are living is rented accommodation but just make sure you are not paying council tax after december and transfer to a local doctor etc. If the rental is definitely running till after your child starts in September then it should be OK but as PRH says speak to the LA. What you need to be saying though is that we have sold the house and are having to move into rented accommodation for at least 12 months, can you confirm that there is no issue with being in rented accommodation?
To me though there are two issues, firstly can you sell the house by October, you might be pushing that? Secondly are there houses for rent in the area of the school? Please be aware that certainly in my LA, the admission office has details of houses / flats that are close to popular schools and are regularly rented out. They are red-flagged and any application from these addresses will be singled out for a more detailed look at whether it is a correct rental or one solely for the purpose of getting a school place. If you still have any connection with the house when you apply you will be found out.

Hi admission thanks for your advice that’s useful. I think chance of house sale being complete by Oct is slim. Not impossible but not hugely likely.

I’m not quite sure what you mean by connection with the house. I won’t own it by admissions deadline (if I do I’ll just have to apply from there and see what happens).

12 month rental is fairly likely I think. I want to rent in the area while I try to buy and that can be quite protracted. Definitely food for throught thank you.

Is there any way of working out likely outcome of applying from where I am by the way? I can see I’m unlikely to get into any schools in the LA - where on earth do I start beyond that?

Sorry to be so clueless, I’m finding the whole thing a complete nightmare. Two schools within a stone’s throw of the house and it seems little chance of any place.

The LA has to find a place for your child somewhere. If you are in an admissions black hole the place is likely to be at the nearest school with places available. If there is a shortage of places the LA will push a school to accept a bulge class. That could either give you a place directly or free up a place at a local school for your child.

The LA may be able to tell you what has happened to children from your area in previous years, but that doesn't guarantee it will be the same for your child.