Advice Needed for Reception refusal appeal

[AppleCat78]

Hello. Hoping for some realistic advise on appealing refusal into our first pick school for DD who is due to start reception in Sept. We’re located in Wiltshire. Basically our daughter is settled with the worlds best childminder, who is only able to accommodate the school run for our first pick. We didn’t get an offer, and where she was originally 3rd on the waitlist, she’s now dropped to 4th.

We’re a military family, and have worked really hard to create a stable environment for DD, and the support we get from our childminder is the only thing that keeps me going as a working mom when hubby gets deployed. We did try to find care that accommodated the other school that is truthfully closer to where we live when we first moved here, but there was zero options that worked available. The school we prefer is not that far away as the town we live in is small.

Since applying, we’ve also found out we’re expecting with #2 due early July. We have already arranged for our childminder to take #2 when I go back to work in Feb when baby is only 7 months old. We cannot lose our childcare as this completely screws our family over. I cannot give up the place for #2 and feel sick at having to find a new setting for DD, removing her from her new sibling and an environment she knows, trusts, and is settled in. I don’t pick up until 6pm and having to pick up two children at two different settings means we won’t get home until 6:30/6:45 at night meaning our already limited time together as a family on week nights is significantly reduced as once we get in it’ll need to be straight into bedtime routine for DD - no bonding time as family, and no bonding time for siblings. Not to mention the stress that would be having to drop off at two locations. We already drop off for 7:30am and would have to leave even earlier. This whole things has made me absolutely sick and on the verge of tears all the time.

Advice needed - what are my honest chances of success based in the above? Or how would I be able to determine if a mistake had been made? The walk to school would be via a path vs road so not sure distance, not that it actually matters as the childminder does the school run.

I think CatMuffin may well be right - the siblings for the 2016 bulge class will have taken up more of the higher admission criteria.

I don't understand. You say you 'cannot' give up the place with your childminder booked for #2. Why can't you?? You are not planning on using the childminder for #2 until February next year, surely she won't penalise you financially for giving up that place?

Find a lovely childminder who does drop offs to the school nearer you which DD has been allocated, then book #2 in there as well. Then they are both together, drop offs are simple and they can bond etc And because it's only May, you have plenty of time to settle DD in with the new childminder before she starts school.

If it took a bulge class in 2016,so 90 rather than 60, thats the issue. Any of the 90 kids with siblings 2 years younger are ahead of you.

The letter giving your school allocation should have said why you didn't qualify for a place, but if not the LA should be able to tell you. You need to check you were considered in the right category and that, for example, the distance used for your address was correct.

Most admissions authorities don't give priority in regular admissions rounds to military families, other than allowances for not having a permanent address when coming back from abroad and moving.

As the appeal would be ICS, if there was no mistake, then you would be relying on persuading a panel that the decision was unreasonable in a legal sense. Your childcare arrangements wouldn't do that I'm afraid - it is a very high bar to pass.

And i agree. Its time to get realistic and start looking for other childcare..

With an admission number of 60 this will be an infant class size appeal. As others have said, that means you can only win if a mistake has been made or the refusal to admit was unreasonable. The bar for a decision being unreasonable is very high - essentially it has to be a decision that no rational person in possession of the facts could make. There is nothing in your post that suggests an error or an unreasonable decision. You should, however, check that you were placed in the correct category and that the home to school distance looks right. If either of these are wrong you may have a case for appeal.

As PatriciaHolm says, most admission authorities don't give priority to military families in the normal admissions round. They can give priority to children who attract the service premium but they don't have to do so. Note, by the way, that your child is eligible for the service premium. It is not dependent on you moving. Simply having a parent in the armed forces is enough. This will give the school some extra funding.

Even if this was not an infant class size appeal I'm afraid your problems with childcare would not win an appeal.

We were in the same dituation last year (except that the school allocated to us was almost 3 miles away and abysmal, 4 primary schools less than 1 mile away didn't have a place due to siblings/people living closr by). we had the choice of vhanging childminders (and accepting a crap school) or go private. we went private. Not a chance for an appeal as my choice of childminder is not the schools problem.

You will be off work from July to February. Give up your childminder. You off work will be great stability for you dd as she starts school and save you £££££.
Then arrange a new CM for when you go back to work.
The other option does the allocated school have a breakfast and after school club dd could go to the see if your CM would have dd in the holidays?
Personally I would opt for 1st option

You’re right. I should stop working and paying taxes, which helps fund public education so I can move into a council house and claim benefits - but hey, might get the school I want....

horrible attitude! Do you expect the school to give you a place because of what works your childminder? I expect the PP suggested you just stay at home because you're talking about how you will never see your child etc but that's not the schools responsibility is it? Maybe look at working part-time and relaxing a bit.

So it hinging on one childminder, the school you got is closer. Then very little Im afraid - the only chance you have is proving that there are no other options.

To be honest I think you come across as very rigid in your thinking - as much as this childminder has been brilliant for you there will be other options for you - rather than spend time on appealing something you have very little chance against look at solving your childcare issue - there must be a lot of childminders for the school you have

No grounds for appeal
We had similar concerns and found a new childminder

Your childcare issues are not the schools problem. An appeal on those grounds will fail.

However your maternity leave us well timed to give you a bit of leeway. Keep your place on the waiting list of preferred school. You're not at the top but you're not far off the top of the waiting list.

If still no place by September, start DD at school 2. You'll be on mat leave so able to do school runs. Schools have to wait 2/3 weeks to see if any children just don't turn up in September. It happens. If you stay on the list you may well find you get a place by Christmas and you can move DD.

If not, you can use that term to sus out new childcare ready for February.

My friend was 3rd on the waiting list at our school, she started at a neighbouring school, 2nd week of term she got a phone call asking if she was still interested in the place, she said yes and her DC started new school the next morning.

Once term starts, its entire possibly that those above you on the waiting list won't want the place anymore if they've started elsewhere.

Why would the children need to be at two different child minders?

I thought military families were excepted children and got priority for places.

I thought military families were excepted children and got priority for places

Children of military personnel are excepted if they are admitted outside the normal admissions round. During the normal admissions round they are not excepted.

Schools can give priority to children eligible for the service premium but this is not compulsory. Most schools don't. So most schools do not give priority to military families.

Military families do get special treatment when moving into an area due to a posting but that does not apply here.

"I thought military families were excepted children and got priority for places"

Only for admissions outside the main entrance rounds.

You might be able to make a case for exceptional social need based on demands on military families, but unless OP applied for that category (if the school had one, not all do) and thinks she was not included in it because of maladministration, this doesn't have the makings of a successful ICS appeal.

(I'm a military wife, you could try asking the welfare officer or the Families Federation, but I think you'd be told essentially the same as above)

”You will be off work from July to February. Give up your childminder. You off work will be great stability for you dd as she starts school and save you £££££.
Then arrange a new CM for when you go back to work.”

Yes of course. You won’t need a CM anyway. Settle DD into school yourself, take plenty of time to find a new childminder and get both children used to him/her prior to returning to work in February.

You haven't mentioned when your DH will be deploying. When is that happening and how long for? You might be able to find additional temporary childcare or domestic help during a deployment - I'd start with SSSAFA - or use his allowances to pay for an au pair, or a mother's help to take DC1 from CM to school and back

He’s actually away right now, fingers crossed he gets back the week before baby is due. He’s then due to deploy in Feb for 8 months - right when I’m due to go back to work. We looked for childminders that accommodated the school we got into last year - literally not one that does the school run to that school. I’ve looked again this week to try and get a sense of what’s out there right now, again, nothing for the school she got into. Me not working isn’t an option, neither is going part time. I have an amazing childminder who I trust completely, have zero concerns or issues with, and am in the same page 100% in terms of discipline and parenting approach. The options for alternative care are extremely limited if not there in the times I’ve looked, so it’s not simply a matter of ‘sucking it up’ and turning myself into a martyr. It’s about being forced at this point to give up extremely good childcare for my DD who’s attached and settled, and for a baby who will be just 7 months old - depending on arrival - who call me a bad mother, but as a working mom am not willing to put into the care of just anyone simply because they have availability, dismissing setting/level of care offered. Which at this point doesn’t exist in to accomodate the needed school run anyway. So while it sounds like my chances are slim to none, I’ll press on with the appeal as would rather go down fighting. Then end up in a position 6 months down the road with zero childcare and having to return to work. Mat leave starts on my due date and returning to work on the 4th Feb, so would need childcare arranged no later than mid Jan for settling in.

What is your Plan B?

It is fine to embark on an almost certainly hopeless appeal, as you are now aware of the tiny chance of success (I presume you've checked that they have you in the right category and the distance is correct?) - as you say, feeling that you have 'fought your best fight' can at least give you some sort of closure.

Historically, what has movement from the waiting list been like (school receptionists / secretaries are usually goldmines of this type of information)? Is number 4 in the 'never happened in living memory' category or the 'oh, we often admit to about that number by mid September as it turns out some have gone private' one?

Otherwise, what is your Plan B? You may state that stability is vital - but that doesn't make a solution appear. Nanny? Nanny share? Au pair? After school / breakfast club? Nursery that does before and after school care? Have you spoken to the allocated school and asked about childcare used by current parents? is there a school parents facebook page where you can ask the question / find someone in the same boat willing to e.g. nanny share?

Apple - am not sure how much notice/interest your DD is taking in going to school? You are right insofar as you've nothing to lose about the appeal but all I'd say is be excited for your DD going to school - not about a specific school as the last thing you need is stress about her expectations as well. But you'll also need to progress a back up plan for childcare if the appeal fails - have you spoken to the allocated school about what options other parents use?

The thing is apple it doesn’t really matter whether we all agree that it’s going to be hard for you to do the school run ( and I do)
It’s about what an appeals panel will rule based on very strict criteria and childcare issues aren’t actually relevant in a Primary School appeal.
There are some very very knowledgeable people on here that are kindly offering you advice, your situation isn’t their fault so there’s no need to get so stroppy with them. They are actually trying to help you by managing your expectations

cantkeepawayforever is right a Nanny if you can afford it or maybe an au pair for your eldest if you cant is an alternative

The thing is there really can be no options available to you - I think you have become so set on this childminder being perfect you are ignoring all the other options - what is it about the others you find sub par

Would an au pair be an option? In the event you do have to change childcare provider. Or even a nanny share? I don't have experience of these myself but have seen them suggested for these situations where there isn't a readily available provider. Not sure if the cost would be prohibitively greater but something to think about. Au pair would give your daughter one on one and might be a good support for you in DHs absence.

I hear you, but none of this is will impact the appeal.
My dh has lost a job (now runs his own business to be flexible) and I have now lost 2 jobs due to child with significant medical needs and not being able to work, make all her medical appointments, hospital admissions, be back in time to collect other kids from school/nursery etc and generally had to rearrange every aspect of my life to fit round the kids and their needs. It's a nightmare financially and yes, I've had to claim disability benefits etc.

I think you are trying hard to make it work for your family and I see your point, but you do come across as 'entitled' to have a situation that will work for you, when in reality some things in life are not in your control. If you don't live close enough to the school you are not entitled to a place, whatever your work/childcare situation.

Can you look at nurseries for the baby?