Secure ARE/Exceeding

[Kettlepotblack]

Hi everyone

My daughter is in year 2 and in a class where there are about 6 of them who are extremely good readers. The information received at the start of term stated that if they were on free reading by the end of the year, they were exceeding ARE. We have been informed that at present, although she is a free reader she is 'secure' ARE which presumably means there are aspects of her comprehension or other element that are not exceeding.

Am I right in saying there is a limit to how many children per class can be measured as exceeding? Is it 3 out of a class of 30? Or if necessary can it be down to teachers judgement? I'm just wondering as I'm wondering here abouts she is and that she may be lower down in the top group and if there is a limit then she won't be exceeding.

I don't need to be shot down in flames or criticised for taking note of such levels, I'd just like to know the answer!

Many thanks

In Year 2 ARE are national so she either meets them or doesn't.

Thanks - I'm mainly wondering about limits to exceeding ARE.

As molly says, I don't think there are limits. Especially Yr2 and yr6 are measured against national standard, so if the child exceeds, she is exceeding. If she doesn't, she doesn't. Nothing to do with where she stands in her class, I believe.

No limits on numbers. It may well be that there is just one tiny area where she is not yet ticking the "exceeding" box, and so can't be officially exceeding yet.

Do, she may be exceeding on her reading, but one area of comprehension still needs to mature etc.

You could ask the teacher?

I could ask the teacher, but I don't want to be one of 'those' pushy parents who wonders why she is not exceeding when she's doing really well as it is...it's just something I am pondering. The teacher has had a very stressful year and I don't want to look like I'm questioning her as is not a huge deal.

If all the class were exceeding national expectations 100% of the class could be assessed as exceeding. There are no limits set.

When you get the end of year report, it should break it down into areas? Unless you have another parent's evening due?

The teacher should be able to tell you fairly quickly - if it's like our school, the data is all charted etc.

Last year, 25% of pupils were assessed as Reading at Greater Depth ( exceeding) so a school would be worried if only 3 out of 30 reached this mark! However, as others have said, there is no "cap" on the number of children in a school/class who can be assessed at this level. There may be a number of reasons-poor understanding of the text as opposed to decoding skills, problems with specific types of questioning, a teacher reliant on test outcomes rather than ongoing assessment, a cautious teacher, the fact that it is only April and the teacher doesn't want to prejudge end of year achievement and probably a few others too!

Very helpful, thank you.

Her target is to start to make inferences so that guide makes sense - thanks very much.

Inference skills are hard to get for some children. I think that's why reading to parents is still important for kids who are good at reading. My ds has been free reading since reception, he still reads to me in yr5, and we talk about text afterwords. I can't do that if he only read it to himself.

No limits @Kettlepotblack. I'm a primary teacher.

I got the 3/30 from a yr 5 teacher so I wonder if it's different in later years. She didn't say it was a limit as such, but that was about the amount you would expect to be exceeding...

Just to add, so it was me that wondered if it was actually a cap as such.

Why would there be a cap?

Some schools work harder than others

Some kids have very limited language skills because of with a second language or parents don't read or they have unlimited TV time

Get you child some audio books so she can listen as well as you read too her (much higher level of comprehension) try wishing chair faraway tree type books

I may be mistaken but I think there is a cap in Early years....it didn't make sense to me either but I thought perhaps it was to make sure that teachers make sure children meet ARE and weren't jumping through the levels to quickly? Perhaps the 10% is a guide.. Yes she listens to audio books each night.

The Y5 teacher is talking nonsense. As far as a school is concerned the more exceeding the better their data.

You are mistaken there is no cap in Early Years either.

Ah, my mistake then! Thanks!

If children don't meet all the criteria for ARE they can't be awarded greater depth it's that simple.

Yes I see that, because it's greater depth of ARE, not an entirely new set of targets..?

I think you maybe mixing up with 10% of class used to be classed as G&T? So 3 out of 30. It wasn't like that for ages. My ds went through old NC, but even then, there was no limit to the number of children who got LV3, which was exceeding expectations at the time.

Best thing you can do is to work on her inference/comprehension skills, if that's what stopping her to get exceeding, rather than worrying about if she gets exceeding or not. It's nothing to do with other children. It's to do with her own ability.

@Kettlepotblack, 3/30 is not a set number, but the Y5 teacher is right in that it's unusual to have lots of children exceeding (I only have two in a class of 31, and I teach Year 5). We test though, rather than teacher assess reading, and the tests are really difficult!

The 10% used to be cited as the average number of Gifted and Talented children in any one class. It’s outdated now though.