DD oldest in year struggling socially

[Zodlebud]

There are so many posts about delaying summer born babies but I have the opposite problem.

DD1 was born very end of August. Of course we had worries about school but she has flown from day one of starting at school and it has never been an issue.

DD2 was born in the first week of September. More than ready for school and very socially mature. She is REALLY struggling with the social aspects of school.

Academically she is finding everything a breeze and really enjoying everything that school has to offer. However, playtimes and child initiated learning are proving problematic. She has lovely classmates but she just isn’t interested in playing the same sort of games as the others. She is the only girl in the Year with older siblings and I just think she is just used to playing with her older sister. For example, some kids are still into Iggle Piggle and she’s more Trolls and Mia & Me (Netflix). She has to wait around whilst other children get changed as she is always first. She is always the “good girl” doing as she’s told on the carpet and lining up etc. She is struggling with why the other children can’t just do as they are told so they can get on and do their work. She is often frustrated and bored at being held up.

Since nursery (which is part of the school) she has played with the children in the year above and we had big problems last year when all her friends moved into reception and she remained in nursery.

I thought it would all just sort itself out as new children joined the school and they all got older but if anything the gap is getting wider. She has no problem making friends and has had some terrific best friends over the years. It just seems a real issue with the mix that is in her Year with her.

School have always said that she “could well be in the Year above” and we’ve all agreed and kind of relished in how well she’s doing and not really thought much of it. Now she’s quite unhappy at playtimes and this morning there were tears.

School are being fab, keeping an eye on it and encouraging more inclusive play. I have always been of the mindset that kids should be just left alone when it comes to friendship issues but at what point do we acknowledge that this is a real problem?

If there was a possibility that she could move up a year should we at least discuss it with school? She literally missed the cut off by a couple of days. I know all the cons of being moved up a year and this wouldn’t be for academic reasons, purely social. She does a lot of phonics and numeracy work with the Y1 class already so I don’t think a move would be detrimental.

Are we mad to even consider it? I am at a bit of a loss as to what to do otherwise. School is independent so “normal rules” can potentially be bent.

Dc1 has a birthday first week in September. Also at an independent all through so we had choice of year, we chose to keep
Hi in the correct year group and generally have no regretted it . We did find that at every stage he grew out of it before the end IYSWM and we just tried to manage it . He definitely out grew Sixth form for example and all The petty rules and in retrospect College may have suited him better . He also out grew nursery before he went to school .But there have also been times where I think he really gained from being that bit more mature especially when puberty hits and you have the exam years. So I would say beware of making a decision for now , taking A levels at 17 could be more difficult for example .

I wouldn't and I say this as a mother of two October born children. Surely there are other children born within a few months of your child? Dd1 is in reception and is very ahead for her age and I've beem told a few times that she would be fine in the year above. I think in the long run though I'd rather her he where she is now. Things will be different, especially in highschool. My dd also tends to play with the older children at play time but reception and year1 share a playground. Could you maybe discuss with school her having that time with the class above? Once in juniors they're often all in the same yard anyway.

This wouldn’t be something most heads would be happy to agree to. Or are you in a private school?

It depends on the school and the intake at the school. If you went to a school with a strong academic reputation (Godstowe) I doubt this would be an issue. Quite a good group of children seem pretty advanced there in each year group and socially too. Even their Oxbridge/Imperial bound alumni that achieved academic scholarships to Wycombe Abbey stayed in their correct years. Is she in the right school for her needs?

Any private school can put her up a year but what do you do at 11 or 13? Be a year ahead all the way through which could be a disadvantage later on?

I really wouldn't ask to move her.

Part of the EYFS curriculum is about social skills and learning to get along with others. I think the school are taking the right approach in encouraging her to mix more with the others. Learning those skills will benefit her far more than moving up a year would.

My friend was a September birthday and moved up a year when she was 5. All was fine for a few years, but she started to feel very young in the year by the time she got to 9/10 years old. Also by this time she also had no academic advantage because her early lead had fallen away as later developers caught up. At 11 she had to repeat the year because her very academic public school would not accept her a year early. But when she went to the new school at 11 she suddenly felt like a 'queen bee' because she was suddenly the oldest and felt more mature. So not a 'bad' experience at all, but if you move your DD up a year, be prepared that she may have to repeat a year later on.

My DD is also oldest and I understand what you're saying but the others will soon catch up. I think it will be harder for your DD to settle in a class where they've all done a year of school together already.

My DC1 is summer born, although not August, and I remember thinking how huge the difference seemed between the younger ones and the ones who were 5/almost 5. There are also one or two of those children in the class who did seem 'older' even then.

They are now in the juniors, and whilst I still notice some differences (not counting physical size differences, although some of the younger ones are now taller or as tall as older ones) I do think the gap is closing. From the perspective of myself regarding my own DC, I do feel they are in the 'right' year group.

At playtimes, are there children in the class above that she plays with, especially as she already knows some of them through literacy work? It's perhaps not an ideal solution long term, thinking of when she is in year 2 and those children are in the juniors (if they are separated on the playground), but a lot changes in a couple of years at that age anyway.

My personal worry about moving her up would be if things did start to level out, and it became that she was perhaps too young for the year above.

Also, I don't know about your specific school, but at the start of year 1 in DC's class, some left the school, and others joined the school (and in later years, but it seems that's a common time for children to move schools). It's possible that in a couple of years the class may be quite different.

The school would probably find it difficult to accomodate that, unless they had an unfillable place

I think - from the experience of my DS1 - that you will find the gap closes and she will begin to find one or two children more on the same page sooner rather than later. And its not always linear either - it won't necessarily be those who are older in the year.

My November born DD would love to talk about / play Mia and Me with yours, OP no one else seems to have heard of it!
She is also academically ahead of her class, the good girl / teacher’s helper and very much a rule follower who doesn’t understand why other children misbehave. In some ways I do think she’d be happier in the year above, but actually I think it’s better they stay with their peers. I’m sure it will even out over time, and actually social skills are one of the main things in reception. Your DD (like mine) needs to learn how to play with children of her own age and find her group.

Don’t move her up a year. Later, when it come to sitting exams, university entrance and interviews, that extra year in school will be to her benefit, as she’ll be a year more mature and more able to cope with the pressures of that stage of school.
Move her now and she may benefit for a year or two but suffer for it later.

I assume the reception playground is distinct from the rest of the years, how does it change later?

DD has very few interests in common with most of her year group, and never has (although she's not the oldest in the year, but summer born) and will often prefer her older friends with similar interests.

However she never found being constrained to her year group enough to cry about, just played. I'd be trying to find out more about the tears, rather than simply think changing years will solve all the problems, there are still plenty of kids interested in childish things in DD's Y2 according, but of course there will also be less who are not.

We have had this exact problem with my DD who is very early September and extremely bright and ahead anyway so she’s way way ahead of most of her class. It wasn’t so much of an issue in reception/Y1 but this year in year 2 she’s really struggled. She was friends with a lot of children from the year above and used to play with them at playtimes but they moved on (same school but infants and juniors are on different sites) and she just didn’t relate to her peer group. We considered the moving up a year also as she’s always done extension work with the year above anyway but socially in future I think it would not be great.
What has helped is the teachers have done a lot to encourage playing together, and broadening the types of games and interactions at playtime. And luckily another boy joined who is very bright and she gets along really well with him.
How many are in the year group? We have a small year (19) and a very young year too, at least 5 of them have August birthdays.

We had this problem, ds being born in winter though not the oldest in year, but very mature for age and found early years very difficult.

Always preferred older company and been sent to older years for some lessons in ks1. He found playground in ks1 very hard.
What I thought was that being with older children for him was easy. They treat him as a younger child and they listen to him and try to accommodate, while same year group children are more selfish(to his mind) and only pursue their needs. I think ds found it difficult because he didn't have maturity to understand playground dynamics and wanted to do it his own way. But I think it's part of learning. They need to learn to negotiate and compromise.
By yr3, he was fine, he now has lots of mates in his year group and having fun.

I think the problem is more the mix in her Year. Two classes of 18 split roughly 50/50 girls and boys. She is the only girl with a Birthday in the first term, although several boys do, and also all the other girls are first borns which I think does make a huge difference. It’s all the boys with older siblings.

She’s a girly girl so not really interested in playing the boys games. Y1 and reception share a playground which is probably not helping too much as she just wants to play with the Y1 children she was friends with in nursery.

I don’t think we would move her up, it’s just she seems so frustrated and miserable by it. The school gets another class in Y3-4 and more children join but that seems a long way off.

School are on it and keeping her busy but when your child is unhappy you just want to try and fix it.

Thanks for all your help ladies - much appreciated!!

No harm in having an informal chat with the school. Going up a year is one (more drastic) measure, but there should be other things the school can do.
Presumably with only 18 in a class, the teachers will have noticed if your DD appears frustrated/unhappy.

I would really encourage her to play with the boys if you think they are the older ones in the year with older siblings. After all it’s a mans world (unfortunately) so I think girls need to be equipped to see it as normal to be equal - what a great place to start her journey of equality if you think the boys are (currently) the more mature ones in the year anyway.

My ds used to play mainly with girls in ks1. He was not into rough play, and preferred more mature company of girls. His closest friend was very girly girl.

I really understand your reasons for thinking this would be a good idea, but I can't help thinking that the gap should close as time goes on.

I was a year ahead at school for logistics reasons. If you're academically capable it's fine. I had a year out before university and got a 1st class degree so all these people saying you damage her future chances and summer born etc I don't agree. If you have the capacity you rise to the challenge. I know my DS could do it if he needed to. I was on the short side at school til I was about 15 and am now much taller than most of my school friends!
I would see what your school suggest.

I also think the idea that you are socially ahead because you like certain Netflix programmes is a bit one dimensional. Often the children who are socially ahead organise games, find like minded children and thrive because they are more organised and "worldly". Try to get her to see the positives in being older and that playground chat at school is not all about TV programmes you have or have not watched. That's maturity, isnt it?

I noticed a massive different between the September born and my children (all summer birthdays) really until Y3/4 and usually the younger formed a group and so did the older children.

I think you would put her at a disadvantage being the youngest in the year, but I suspect the current situation won't sort itself out for quite a long time. Have you considered just moving her to a different school?
If there's no places, you could always just put her down on the waiting list and at least you're doing something, it may well be when the time comes she doesn't want to move.

Moving schools feels too drastic but it is something we briefly considered. Thing is we are very happy with the school, love the ethos, academically she is doing brilliantly, and there is a real balance to their approach. The sports and arts are just as important as the maths and English. It's also non-selective which is something we are adamant about at this age. School have also been on this issue and working with us on it so I really have no complaints. They have put various things in place to help her but they have admitted she really doesn't seem to have anything in common with most of the children in her class and is wise beyond her years. It is most likely just waiting for the rest of the class to catch up.

I guess the non-selective point could be part of the problem. More than a handful of children in her year failed to achieve a place at another selective school in the area (well, actually they were already in the pre-school there and were told they could not continue into reception). The majority of the girls are April onwards birthdays. The boys on the whole are rather bolshy which is just not her. As I mentioned above I think it just an unlucky situation with an odd mix of birthdays and gender split of the children.

My husband and I have decided that we will wait another year or two and potentially move her at 7+ if things haven't improved. Things were better this morning at drop off so fingers crossed it's progress.

Bubbles - yes of course this all based on what TV programmes my child watches............. Constructive comments only please.

Zodle my DD is a first born so I don’t think you can put it down to your DD having an older sibling. It’s just her character