34 in Year 1 Class

[Happydaze123]

Hello, hoping someone can help!
My daughter is in a 2-form entry reception class with 17 children in each class (34 children total in reception). She has thrived in this environment, I feel largely due to the small class size.
In Year 1, the school are combining the 2 classes into one. As infant class size is 30, they are getting around it by putting x4 of the children on the Year 2 register which has space to accommodate. Those x4 children will only register in the morning and afternoon with Year 2 but then will move over to the Year 1 class straight away.
I'm really uncomfortable with this arrangement and feel my daughter will struggle with the larger class size. There will be 1 teacher (job share) and 2 TA's in the room.
What do you think of this and what would you do?
Thanks in advance xxx

LA's can broker new schools but they must be free schools, although that may change. So it not true there can be no new schools. Just no new LA schools.

If the schools is good and you have confidence in the teachers, I would stay. My DD was taught ina class of 33 and it was fine but we had brilliant staff. You have no guarantee of getting a class less than 30 in many schools now because the funding is based on 30. It always was actually. 17 cannot be cost effective and must reduce the money available in the schoool for other things. It is not sustainable and I expect they are facing a huge deficit budget which they are not allowed to have. It has to change.

If enough move it will reduce to 30. Perhaps this is what they have in mind?

My son starts reception in September, he will be in a class of 20 or less. His school take a maximum of 45 and was not fully subscribed this year. I do wonder what they will do next year. They take 45 as there is a local infant school that feeds in so has to retain 15 places for them. We chose it because it is so small, but with not all places taken I know it will be a funding nightmare for the school and how they get from R-3 is going to be interesting.

I'd be approaching the governors for a formal response, though if you are considering a transfer there is a chance four other families will too...

Hi - again thanks for all your responses. It really helps hearing everyone's different viewpoints.
The school has x60 places available per year group. The school went into special measures just before applications were admitted for my daughter's reception intake. As there are a number of schools in the local area, others voted with their feet and went to different schools leaving an unusually low intake for 2016/2017. For reception 2017/2018 they again have an intake of 34 (for 60 places).
I have a meeting with the headteacher next week so will find out more then. The whole set up just seems dodgy and I don't like the idea of 34 in a Year 1 class. We only got told about the set up this week so a bit short of time to do much about it now!
Thanks again for your help/advice.

Is there any reason why Y2 and Y1 cannot be mixed year groups. In effect this is what they are doing by putting 4 into the Y2 children. Although 4 is too few.

If they should have 60 but have 34 their budget will be shot to pieces. It means getting rid of staff. They could change their pan temporarily to 30. I have seen schools do this and there appears to be capacity elsewhere. This is what happens when parents lose faith with a school. You surely did not expect it to stay with classes of 17?

Obvious solution given the Reception intake is also above 30 but far too low for 2 separate classes is to mix Y1 and Reception to create 3 classes spanning those 2 years. perhaps 1 pure R, 1 mixed R / Y1, 1 pure Y1. 68 could give a 24 / 20 / 24, favouring the mixed class to give the smallest number in there. still too small t be economic, though.

How many are in the current Y2? Creating mixed classes all the way through KS1 may be the only way to get to economic but legal class sizes.

Hi - I know that 17 in a class is economically not viable. Although I wondered if instead of 1 teacher and 2 TA's why not have just 2 teachers instead? Poss similar budget and keep 2 classes (until Y3 anyway!). But I thought most likely scenario was x3 mixed Y1/Y2 classes (which would be about 28 in each). X

It would be more usual to have a pure Y1, a mixed Y1/Y2 and a pure Y2 - though i agree that uniform mixed classes can be fairer and thus perhaps more successful.

You'll just have to ask the head why they are pursuing an illegal class size strategy - if they are in SM, they will have Ofsted breathing down their necks and I suspect they won't be pleased about breaches of the law on class sizes....

Regardless of how it has happened they cannot have 34 in a class with a single teacher in Y1 unless 4 of the children are excepted. From what you say they were expecting to have 60 in the year so it is very unlikely that any of the children are excepted. They can mix with other Reception or Y2 if that allows them to get down to 30 per class. They could also put a few of Y2 into a mixed class with Y3. Provided the majority of the pupils in the class were in Y3 the infant class size limit would not apply. But they cannot play games to get around the limit and budget restraints are not a valid argument for breaking the law. As the previous poster says, doing things like this will not help them get out of special measures.

Tomorrow is my last day in a Y3 class of 34 where I'm the TA with one teacher. I have also been the TA in a mixed Y2/3 class of 33. One teacher with two TAs wouldn't worry me if my child was happy and making progress. The TAs could be more qualified than you realise. Myself and another TA at my school have both been teachers but now work as TAs for more of a work/life balance.

I think replacing the two TAs with a teacher would be unlikely to happen for money reasons and unless there are extra rooms the two teachers would be in the same classroom and from experience, apart from in Reception, I can't see how this would work.

Coconut,

In Y3, it's legal - I routinely teach KS2 classes of 31-33.

In Y1, it's illegal due to the Infant Class Size regulations. Whether it is practically possible or not is beside the point- the school is deliberately choosing to break the law by underhand tactics, and i hope that if the head and governors don't sort it out, Ofsted lands on them like a ton of bricks.

Are they still in Special Measures?

I would be interested in hearing how they explained the class size issue to HMI/Ofsted when they visit.

Although, best not to go at the Head with that statement, obviously!

Yes they are still in special measures!

HMI are not going to be impressed with 34 in a Y1 class, however they're spinning it with 4 of them registered on Y2 class list. They will surely have to explain the 34 children in the classroom when HMI visit - and they will want to know how they're trying to justify it - and they can't just leave 4 children in Y2 during those days...

Can't they just have two mixed Y1/Y2 classes? I would've thought that would be the logical way forward?

The cost of 2 TAs won't cover the cost of a teacher, unless it is a newly qualified teacher. Many schools in special measures are not allowed to employ NQTs. I agree agreeu they should either be running mixed Reception/ year 1 classes, or mixed year 1/year 2 classes if they want to avoid having two different key stages together.