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Outside of any primary catchment areas

122 replies

Devro · 12/07/2017 19:54

I know it's pretty early but I'm starting to majorly stress out over my child's primary admission in Sept '18.
We live in a catchment 'black hole', meaning we are surrounded by schools but are not in any of their catchment areas, with the exception of 2 Catholic primaries, which are not an option.
I have a preference but wouldn't mind getting into any of the non-faith schools, but I think it's not gonna happen unless we move into a catchment area.
I really do not want to move, and so at the moment the only thing I can think of is to move temporarily.
I know how people feel about that, but I don't think we'll have another choice, given the ridiculousness of our situation.
I suppose otherwise we'd risk being placed in an undersubscribed school miles away, and close distance is the most important thing for us as I'm a single parent, work full time and can't afford a childminder for drop-offs and pick-ups.
My question is now: What kind of repercussions do people face who move into catchment then move back to previous address?

OP posts:
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cantkeepawayforever · 13/07/2017 14:07

I have also taught a large number of children (many more than are withdrawn)from other faith backgrounds and none whose parents have chosen for them to continue to attend collective worship but not 'actively participate' - ie speak or sing. Reciting or responding to prayers, for example, is often explicitly represented as optional.

cantkeepawayforever · 13/07/2017 14:10

Tbh, your most likely issue with the Catholic schools is not that you don't want your child to go to them, but that they won't admit you: most Catholic primaries place Catholic practice very high up on their oversubscription criteria, way above geographical proximity.

Unless the schools are very poor, that usually means almost no non-Catholic children are admitted, however close they live.

2014newme · 13/07/2017 14:12

But if you move to Berlin you'll have the same problem should you ever return plus you'll be giving up what you say is a well priced rental. What will you gain?

prh47bridge · 13/07/2017 14:21

Just to clear up the deferring thing, you can defer until later in the school year and they have to hold your place for you. It is only if you defer for a full year that you have problems but that isn't an option for you anyway. Your child must start school in January 2019 unless you home educate.

Yes but there is a big difference between a non-faith school having a nativity play and Easter assembly etc, and a faith school starting each day with a Christian prayer and vocabulary I disapprove of etc.

All schools are required by law to have a daily act of collective worship that must be broadly Christian in nature (unless it is a faith school for a non-Christian faith). Some schools ignore this requirement or water down the Christian element to such an extent that it is unnoticeable. Some schools have a very strongly Christian assembly every morning, and that isn't always the faith schools. I understand your view that the Christian faith is not the neutral norm but that is how the law stands currently.

Lou898 · 13/07/2017 14:24

All addresses should have a catchment school attached to them. They can still be oversubscribed though dependant on the number of children applying from those addresses. Have you asked the local authority which school would be your catchment school?
I work in a school and our local authority has an address checker which tells you the catchment school which is linked to the address. This includes the catchment non faith and the catchment faith school.
Like others have said Local Authorities do check on people who have recently moved to ensure they are not trying to bend the rules of admission. They can request documentary evidence to back up applications.
I would look at checking to with LA what school catchment you would come under and take it from there.

cantkeepawayforever · 13/07/2017 14:29

Lou,

It is now the exception, rather than the norm, for there to be specific catchments.

Usually, schools' admission areas (once Looked After children, those with SEN and, in some cases, siblings have been taken care of - or faith, for a faith school) are simply circles radius around each school. The radius of the circle will vary each year depending on where successful applicants live.

And yes, this does lead to some addresses falling in between the circles...

NotCitrus · 13/07/2017 14:39

Be aware that the 'last admitted distance' for schools in Lambeth and presumably elsewhere is based on that at National Offer Day. In practice, children are admitted from further away by September. I'd also be very surprised if the nearby Catholic schools werent filled by children at least baptised Catholic, which reduces pressure on the other schools. One bulge class opening in one end of the borough can lead to 100 kids shuffling places
I'd apply for your six nearest/easiest non-Catholic schools - they dont need to be within Lambeth remember so look east and west - and take it from there.
If your daughter will have significant struggles in a mainstream school then get working with nursery, HV and other professionals on a EHCP to try to ensure support will be in place.

Devro · 13/07/2017 15:06

Thanks very much for all the answers everyone, I have a much clearer idea now of what needs to be done and how to approach this.

@2014newme moving to Berlin would be a last resort, as I can't afford to move permanently within London.
What I'd gain from moving would be plenty: avoiding a school with faith practice, first of all, school uniforms, long school runs, extortionate rent, classes of 30+ children, the list goes on.
We're keen to stay, but not at any cost.

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Devro · 13/07/2017 16:22

@paxillin Just FYI, I just checked the Admissions Code and it's not true that if you defer until child is 5 it has to start at Year 1, patents can request that it starts in reception class.

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Bear2014 · 13/07/2017 16:29

We live in Lambeth, everyone I know is more than happy with their allocated school. With regards to being 'forced' to go to a religious school, it's actually harder to get into them than anywhere - places like Corpus Christi in Brixton are SO difficult to get into, if you can't prove you've been going to mass for years etc you have no chance.

If your daughter has legitimate SEN, which it sounds like she does, you can probably get her into pretty much any local school you want as that criteria comes above distance to the school.

BrieAndChilli · 13/07/2017 16:32

If you decide to defer a year you will have to apply next year as usual, you can't apply this year, defer and wait for a place to come up at your preferred school then start at that school in reception, you will have to put an an application next year instead along with everyone else and all the normal criteria apply.

cantkeepawayforever · 13/07/2017 16:41

Devro,

However, it is worth pointing out that deferral to the following year is ONLY available if your child is summer-born, meaning that the 'term after their 5th birthday' 9the point when they must legally be in school) is the Autumn term of the following school year.

Your maximum deferral is to January 2019 as your DD is autumn-born.

On the SEN point, you need an EHCP naming the school (the equivalent of a Statement) as the school to meet their needs. That requires both a very significant level of SEN AND particular provision at the school named.

The vast majority of children with siome SEN do not get to 'choose an Ofsted better school' , because 'having a Good Ofsted' is not considered a reason for the specific school to be named in the same way that e.g. having an autism base, or being the only school all on a single level, would be.

The degree of SEN required for a full EHCP (like a Statement) is also very high. As a rough rule of thumb (there are obviously exceptions to this) , if a child does not need pretty much full-time 1:1 care and support, the level of SEN is unlikely to be sufficient.

HarveySchlumpfenburger · 13/07/2017 16:46

Can I clear up the deferral issue.

All children have a right to a school place from the September after their 4th birthday. However they don't have to start until they reach statutory school age. If a child is offered a school place the school MUST hold it until the child reaches statutory school age providing the child starts by the end of the school year.

For summer born children who wouldn't reach statutory school age until September of year 1, parents can request that their child starts in reception but schools are not required to agree to this. If they do agree you would need to make an application for a place at the same time as all the other reception applicants for that year group.

prh47bridge · 13/07/2017 17:34

I just checked the Admissions Code and it's not true that if you defer until child is 5 it has to start at Year 1, patents can request that it starts in reception class

Deferring for a full year is not an option in your case. However, as RafaIsTheKingOfClay says, if the parent of a summer-born child chooses to defer for a full year parents can request that the child starts in Reception but the admission authority does not have to agree to the request. Most admission authorities will only agree if there is evidence that the child has significantly delayed development.

Devro · 13/07/2017 20:06

@prh47bridge et al yes, I'm aware that my own child wouldn't be able to defer for a year, but only til Jan '19 - but my friend's child is a summer born child and this will be v important info for them as they have no interest whatsoever in having their child start at the age of 4.

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GreenTulips · 13/07/2017 20:32

Why do you think should my child go to a bad school when others don't?

But the way you speak you sound like your DD should have preference over everyone else.

These are the rules and criteria for school places - for everyone

There shouldn't be bed schools - every child deserves a good education - but your fighting at the wrong level!!

If you want the best then go private - same as everyone else

Out2pasture · 13/07/2017 20:35

Private seems hard to find in Lambeth.
Nothing around the oval.

IrenetheQuaint · 13/07/2017 21:03

I'm finding it really hard to imagine where the OP might live in Lambeth. Éspecially given that Lambeth doesn't HAVE catchment areas as far as I'm aware - aren't admissions done by distance?

EssentialHummus · 13/07/2017 21:08

irene - I raised this earlier, no reply. I think OP is using catchment to mean last distance admitted.

Out2pasture · 13/07/2017 21:31

Ashmole is outstanding and Reay is as well the only two I see oversubscribed

IrenetheQuaint · 13/07/2017 21:33

OP: have you looked at this link, which shows the last admissions distance for Lambeth community primary schools for 2017? There are a couple of very popular schools where you have to live within 500m to get a place on Offer Day, but they're very much a minority.

www.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/default/files/NOD-Rec17-HowOffersMade-community-schools1.pdf

Out2pasture · 13/07/2017 21:34

Wyvil, and Herbert Morrison again outstanding. If anything the faith schools less so

Out2pasture · 13/07/2017 21:38

But Lambeth does have 64 primaries

Devro · 13/07/2017 21:39

@GreenTulips I have honestly no idea what your problem is.

I'm less than 10 minutes away from 5 public non-faith schools - all of which we can't get into most likely unless a miracle happens - because we live in an admission-by-distance black hold and nobody cares.

Can't you see that THIS is unfair? My council is supposed to provide reasonably distanced schools to ALL people living here, and we are being failed by the infrastructure of this borough.

Then there are a handful of faith schools, which apparently as others have pointed out wouldn't admit us either even if I wanted to.

So... you think I should, what, quit my job and go on benefits in order to commute to a school miles away because someone has to go to them?

Simply not gonna happen, sorry.
I'll try and get a SEN statement because actually, yes, my child probably should get preference for a multitude of reasons, but if that's not the case I'll find another way.

OP posts:
longestlurkerever · 13/07/2017 21:39

If there are catchment black holes then it is likely the Council will put a bulge class on somewhere if it doesn't sort itself out on the waiting list, stressful though that would be to work out. A place in a faith school would count as the Council fulfilling its duty though.