KS 1 Year 2 SATS approaching - parent evening next week !

[alisonmc]

Hi all, I'm new to this board but would like to gather some thoughts from those who are interested. My DS is currently a YR 2 pupil and will be doing his KS1 SATS in May this year. He is a G&T child and have been told since reception his is a more able child and have received above average reports for his two years schooling. Nothing to worry about I hear you say - but the other day I was having a conversation with DS teacher who said she has marked him as a 2B which is average for year 2. I have been a teacher myself in the past and have been doing practice SATS papers with him since before half term and he consistently gets 2A in both English and Maths and when he does the level 3 papers he passes these too. I am confused with his teachers grading - we have parents evening next week - what do you think my approach should be - I don't want to come across as a pushy parent, but I do want my DS to be recognised for his efforts correctly. Any advice would be great.

OK, I may be completely wrong here, but is the school judged at all on how well the children progress between KS1 and KS2. If it is, it is in their interests to keep the KS1 mark low.

Apologies to the integrity of any teachers I may have offended, it's just that I believe this has happened in dds school recently.

what you teacher has told you about the stats mark in completely at odds with the past reports on your child. I would take the

'I don't understand why he ahs done so well and is G&T but is considered average - has anything changed drastically in the past few months? If so we need to address it.'

My DS7 had parents evening last week and I was told that he is capable of a 3, but at least a 2a. No mincing words there!

Personally, I'd keep quiet about the papers done at home, as it will label you as a pushy parent. Out of interest, why do you do them if he is above average?

Also, as time goes on, you realize that Year 2 SATS are just a snapshot of them that particular Easter. I truly believe that no Year 2 child has the breadth of understanding of a Year 4 child, which is what a Level 3 means.

Thank you for your comments and observations. I don't see myself as a pushy parent, just trying to prepare my DS for what is ahead in May. He himself is quite keen to do these tests as he likes to better his previous scores, etc. He is quite competitive and plays football for a local junior team and likes to win !! I just would like to know from his teacher why from being an "above average" pupil how now he is just "average" - it does seem consistent with previous parents evenings and school reports.
Conceptually DS maths is way above average and it may be that he has inherited my love for the subject (Maths/Economics teacher in a previous life - now an Accountant) - I just love supporting DS in anything he does including his education - can't be a bad thing, can it?

I'm sorry but I am slightly stunned at the thought of anyone preparing their 6/7 year old for SATS

In my opinion, it doesn't make the blindest bit of difference except to the school and I certainly wouldn't want any child of mine at that age under pressure, however competitive the child was. Both of my kids knew nothing about KS1 SATS and are under strict instructions not to worry about/study for KS2 SATS.

I don't mean to be rude, I am just genuinely surprised at this

Just wanted to check, my understanding was that the Sats were not a reflection of the childs ability, but were an insight into teaching ability and schools standards? So by coaching your lo, you actually are making it look like the teacher/school is better than it is? Or is my understanding off? From what i have read they sats at this stage dont make any difference at all academically, although i can understand you wanting your son to be achieving his full potential.

SATS are a snapshot in time of the child, not the teacher. Of course, good teaching in Reception, Year 1 and Year 2 help massively! They are very political, in the sense that the scores for the year as a whole will be published, therefore it is in each school's interest to have the minimum number of children appearing to be below average, and a good number above average.

Tricky for you, alisonmc, as your expectations have been raised wrt gifted and talented. I understand that you want your son to achieve well, but in my experience the best thing to do is to support your son by doing anything sent home, and other than that to back off and let the school handle it. Best wishes! I think it's particularly hard for us ex-teachers!

Sorry to sound like an old bag - but do you really think that putting pressure on him a 7 is a good idea? What are you going to be like when he gets to gcse's. I appreciate that you used to be a teacher and probably know more than me, but does it REALLY matter what 'grades' he gets? The point is, the teachers can see from his results, what he needs more help with and act accordingly. Maybe he is so worried that he must do well for you when he is testing at school, that he is mucking it up. I'm sure the teacher knows what she is doing. Don't worry.

I suspect you are putting more pressure on yourself than him! Sit back and relax; there'll be more need for help in later years. And most children just want Mum to be Mum, not teach them

PLease, please, please I beg you, no more practice papers. I thought it was supposed to be teacher assesment and the children not knowing they are taking exams at KS1 anyway.

Again thanks for your thoughts. I do not want any more for my child than to be happy and healthy. It was DS school who allocated the "G&T" and "above average" tags to our son. DS is under no pressure from us as parents to perform, we just instill that he tries his best and that is good enough for us. However, once expectations are raised by the school itself, I can only find myself questioning the inconsistencies of its statements - How can a child now be graded as "average" but was G&T and "above average" at Christmas - it all seems a bit strange to me - do children lose a level between Christmas and half term ??? Strangely DS likes to feel pressurised - every weekend if a penalty in football matches is awarded he is always the first in the queue to take it - same at his soccer schools he attends throughout the year - he likes to receive certificates, medals and trophies for doing well. He loves coming home from school with "Star of the Day" and "Personal Best" awards as he knows he has worked hard and been rewarded. I don't think I am as mum doing anything horrid to DS - I am there for him every step of the way and we as a family are incredibly close so DS always has a lot of support in and out of school. It's a pity a lot more parents cannot/will not be bothered or interested to know where their children are at. A mum in the playground the other day thought her DD KS1 SATS were next year - I explained that it was this May and she said - "oh well it's not as if I can help her anyway !!" I rest my case ....

What case, precisely?

I asked a friend the other day when his daughter's SATs were; and he said he had no damn idea and wasn't going to find out. He and his wife are pretty senior academics.

You can know where your children are at without SATs. A lot of the time SATs will only tell you how well a child has been prepped to pass SATs.
The secondary school near us doesn't pay much attention to the KS2 SATs results as they are aware of the cramming that precedes them at the primary schools and apparantly most of the children forget a lot of the stuff in the period after the tests.

I suppose what I am trying to get across is that it does not harm any child if support is given and managed in the proper way - I have the experience and can do this with DS. Having been fortunate enough to had the experience of teaching 11-18 year olds, it is my opinion that the vast majority of children do not receive adequate education and support in Primary Years education and therefore struggle with the basics once they reach Secondary Education. I have witnessed pupils who are 11-12 years old that cannot grasp the basics of maths and whose literacy is the standard of 7 year olds - it's such a crying shame that if more parents had a greater partnership with schools and understanding of their children's abilities at Primary level they would be able to support their children moving towards Secondary education - these children would not be left to fend for themselves as so many are today. If my supporting DS with the basics of literacy and numeracy his a hanging offence then so be it - at least he will not have problems once he reaches Secondary school - I realise that I am doing the teacher's job for them - but at least it WILL get done rather than left to teachers who do not have adequate support and not enough time to focus on a 1-1 basis. FYI : I am also a school governor and a parent helper so know this as fact !

But you're not doing the basics. You're doing practice papers.

I don't get why you are given marks for him now anyway (iyswim) - why was the teacher giving you a grading for him in a passing conversation?

all you can do is ask the teacher in the parent's evening

we were told that the SATS mark is not only based on a test - it's the teacher's evaluation of the child too (in case they have an off day, which I imagine at 6/7 is still quite possible ).

Dd (yr2) has no idea what SATS even are!

Correction Motherinferior - the basics have been covered - we do Maths and English homework every week, reading every night since RECEPTION class - son is now in year 2 - Addition, subtraction, basic division and multiplication have all been covered in Maths including problems solving. DS currently reading Horrid Henry and Roald Dahl books - weekly spelling homework the norm ! Do you really think that as a former teacher I would even venture to give my son a practice paper WITHOUT him understanding the basics - I am not some person who has know clue on how to teach.

It would be like me asking you to sit an advanced Economics paper without you knowing the basic concepts of Supply and Demand or how the European Monetary System works or the mechanics of Hyperinflation !

I am a secondary teacher too.

I think year 2 is rather different...

I will not be doing practice papers next year.

I am not "bothered or interested" to find out when my yr 2 child's SATS will take place, or what they will consist of. The school hasn't mentioned them, dd1 doesn't seem aware of them, I think it's better for a 6yo not to experience any sort of exam pressure.

Which doesn't mean I have no interest in my children's education. Am just not bothered about SATs. I am very happy when my 6yo is enthusiastic about reading or writing or art or maths. Not really that bothered what she'd be graded in those subjects at her age.

they are so little still

OK, well our school doesn't do SATS so the gradings themselves don't mean much to me, but does 2B indicate that he has attained average, but at an earlier point in time eg 2B would be average for May, but he is likely to improve between now and then sow oudl get a higher score then?

I'm not so sure about the G&T tag tbh. it seems that this is awarded to the top 10% of the class, so even if the class doesn't have any strong performers the top 3 kids would be G&T. It doesn't meant that they're not grading accordingly - he could still be Grade 2B and G&T is everyone else ont he class was at the same of lower grade. I think that you are at risk of using this 2B grade as an absolute grade, whereas the teacher may be viewing it more relatively? Unless of course she mentioned that he was slipping, or that loads of other were now at 2A or 3?

And that, precisely, is my point. That's not the basics - it's the specifics.

Six year olds are terribly young. Whether or not someone's once told you they were above average or not.

I find it hard to believe that anyone could get this worked up about SATs.

my yr 2 child has been, in different classes with different teachers, put in the middle group of 5 for reading and maths, the top group of 5, and bottom groups as well. She's highy erratic and variable. It often depends on her mood on the day. I think this isn't so unusual at this age.