Dithering over school application - help!

[glorious]

I'm really struggling to decide the order of preferences for DD's primary school application.

We have a good chance of getting a place at any of the three schools in question. Our LA operates a catchment system and all children in catchment got into the two we are in catchment for in all of the last 5 years. The third is a faith school and we qualify under the faith criteria and would have got in 4 out of the last 5 years.

So it does feel like a genuine choice and I keep changing my mind about what order to put them in.

School 1

• we live next door
• nice playground
• traditionally the school that people round here want to send their children to
• friends with children there think it's good
• I worry it's a bit complacent - ofsted raises concerns about higher achievers not being stretched and it has a very privileged intake. SATS results are not great.
• no open day and prospectus isn't even up to date. Doesn't send a good message to me about communication with parents
• no uniform, which worries me from a practical point of view

School 2

• new(ish) school in federation with another. This year is the first with a Y6 so no SATSs results to look at
• amazing new building
• good ofsted
• I really rated the headteacher and the whole ethos on the open day
• 15 minute journey in the wrong direction

School 3

• historically by far the most successful on paper - outstanding ofsted, best SATS results by a mile
• friends with children there rave about it
• one form intake and very family/friendly atmosphere which I think DD would benefit from
• 15 minute journey going past my husband's office and the station I will commute from, but a bit of a pain as it's in town
• 2016 SATS results were absolutely rubbish

Help! Which would you pick and why?

Not all schools did badly in the KS2 tests this year, some did better. A lot of schools were caught out by the changes to the syllabus and had not taught the pupils on these areas. You can say that is a one off situation or you can argue that is shows that a lot of schools were complacent about the changes. Did school 3 just assume that because they have had such success previously, everything would be OK. The mark of a really good school will be how well they respond this year.
Comments on school one about their lack of communication and out of date prospectus would worry me as it does show a significant level of complacency. If Ofsted are already talking about not achieving at the higher levels, they could easily become a school that would be considered "coasting"
School 2 is a two way bet. I would be positive about the federation with a school with a good track record but 15 minutes travel in the wrong direction would begin to annoy me after a bit.
I think the other thing that needs to be said is that all 3 schools are OK, they all have their faults but actually they are reasonable schools, compared with some others. My preference would be 1 (because it is local) then 2 and then 3 but you should go with the one you felt most comfortable with, which sounds like 2

School 1. Being next to the school is fantastic for a variety of reasons and the community feel you will get counts for a lot.

No way would I want to walk past a school to another.

Hmm. Which school do you think your DC would be happiest at? Close is a definite bonus unless the school is awful. Have you been able to look around them all? I know some schools don't do open days but if you ring you can arrange a time to look around.
As for no uniform it's easy to manage and you don't have a panic on a Sunday night to get uniform washed. Around our way the better primaries have no uniform.

School 1. Being next to the school is fantastic for a variety of reasons and the community feel you will get counts for a lot.

No way would I want to walk past a school to another.

This, x 100

I think gut feeling counts for a lot..

I would be going for school one particularly if you don't think you will be there till year 6. Beginning of school is about enjoying to learn. enjoying the learning to make friends.

I also would avoid one form entery..my DS has been in different class from another boy since year one , this would not of been an option had he not been in two form entry...

I also agree disregard 2016 SATS and do bear in mind SAts are not a about the child but an assessment of how a school has taught particualr skills to pass a test.

banging yes but school 3 did worse than school 1 and the sister school of school 2. It was one of the worst in the town. I'm not comparing across years, just looking at what they all did this year. I absolutely agree with your points on school one.

four I'm sorry you feel like that. I have a feeling this will be me whichever I go for!

Admission that is exactly my concern about school one. I think it probably is or will be coasting given the intake vs the results. I am no expert though. I also think they just presume they will get their intake and they don't really need to sell themselves, which I guess is true but it doesn't send me a very good message about parental engagement later on. But yes, they are all absolutely fine really.

Vino I have absolutely no idea unfortunately! I have been to all of them, just not all on an open day or visit.

Starlight yes that is an advantage of a bigger school. I'm not worried in the least about what my DD gets in her SATs but it's one of the only measures we have of whether a school is teaching effectively, which I do care about.

Hello glorious!

I think you have to go with your gut. Being close to the school is a big advantage, but the poor communication from school one might put me off. I'd still probably go with the nearest school, because of the convenience, and the sense of community. The school would have to be pretty bad, to outweigh these advantages, imo.

It sounds like they are all good schools, and your dd is likely to thrive wherever she goes.

It feels like such a big decision to make, doesn't it?

I am usually one for nearest school but school 1 sounds a bit rubbish. Not getting good results with a very privileged intake takes a serious amount of uninspired teaching, given that the correlation between parental background and school achievement is still very high, depressingly so. Our school didn't have an open day but headteacher would always make time to show prospective parents around during the day. They prefer it because it shows the school in action, and I loved that. Would definitely never select a school without seeing it!

15 mins on foot isn't much, our catchment school is that far. I personally would go for 3. My son is at a single form entry school which is indeed small (advantage: everyone knows everyone, big kids look out for the little ones, great community, disadvantage: underfunded, same 30 kids for 7 years), but I think as long as they've got outside interests and hobbies they'll mix with people from other schools too.

Good luck!

Oh hello cut how are you and DD? You must have the same choice to make! I've just noticed our thread has moved on, will pop back tomorrow and catch up!

Liliane yes exactly. The results aren't bad, just mediocre, but given the intake I do think that's a bit worrying. I will see what they say about a visit. And yes they are all close in the scale of things. It's a small place.

15 mins by foot is nothing. We drive 2 miles to our closest and catchment school. And you seem to have a good gut feeling about school 2 from what I can tell.

OTOH I wouldn't worry about school 3's SAT results for 2016 if they were generally good before. As pp's have mentioned, last year was a bad year for all schools.

And school 1 - I wouldn't place too much store on the Ofsted report if it has good parent reviews. Have you been to the school? Could you organise a visit to the school prior to 15th Jan? I had a last minute one in early Jan when DD went.

Which one does your child prefer? Or which one did she seem happiest to visit? That is how I have chosen when all options seemed equally good.

Yeah, we're in the same boat. Except I know exactly which school I want as our first choice, it's the other choices I am dithering about. Hopefully dd should get into our first choice and it won't matter!

You said one of the schools is a church school, do you have a preference either way? Has your dd seen any of the schools and what did she think?

15 min on foot may be nothing in some areas. In other areas it would mean that all be DC in the imediate area go to a different school. A friend of mine sent her DS to private school 15 min drive away. She is now sad that he never sees his friends in the local area, park, at local activities as there are 5 state primaries within 1/2 a mile and almost all go to them. We however can't go to the local shops, parks, local event etc without seeing lots of their friends... If OP will be walking/cycling to the school and then back to the train station in the opposite direction thats an extra hour every day

I'd go 2,1,3 personally. I'd be concerned about the says tbf. Our school did better this year.
Our walk is twenty minutes to our school and it was fine even when DS was in nursery there.

cut DD saw 1 and 2 and liked them both. 3 asked parents not to bring children which I thought was a bit off until I saw inside - it's tiny and the parents didn't even really fit! She's more keen on 1 and 3 as she knows older children at both.

Although we are genuinely members of the faith (go to services and help out in a significant capacity and have done for over ten years) we are not very orthodox and we are both nervous about the kind of thing she might be taught. So faith school isn't something we're at all set on. Good luck with your preferences and hopefully you'll get your first.

Smelly I won't be doing all the drop off and pick ups. It will mostly be DH and au pair except on my non working days. So that's not a huge issue. But yes I do like the idea of always bumping into friends, especially as an only child.

Tomorrow yeah it's really not that far, though very busy junctions for school 3.

Do they have crossing guards at those junctions?

School 1 definitely. Having all of your friends from school around you makes a huge difference.
Just meeting your friends in the local park or on your way to the shop etc makes a big difference.
We live in a village and DD goes to the local school, she now goes by herself in year 6. We also live across the road from the park and there are always people calling for her to play out.

No crossing guards but all the main ones have pelican crossings. I'm more worried about it cycling than walking (we have a seat and trailer). Fine with us but not with an inexperienced or wobbly au pair cycling!

I think we're inclining towards school 1 , especially as she's not going to be there by key stage 2 and possibly not by year 1 even.

I would go for School 1.

It's not just for proximity of the school-but of the whole school life.

Think ahead to parties, after school activities, play dates etc and it will all be so so much easier at school 1.

Take the school 15 mins away-what if her friends live 15 mins away on the other side making play dates a pain and everything slightly harder and more time consuming. It adds up....

School 1 with au pair will mean this is easy-and being part of school community ideal.

I am finally-after moving house and changing DD school - finally in the right place for school and it has honestly made us all so much happier.

And remember if you get it wrong you can always revisit later-but I would definitely start with school 1.

Good luck

I'm with Biscuitsneeded and think you're local to me.
If you've visited all three schools in person, then go with your gut feeling. Go with the school where you feel you can work with the leadership, the one that fits your family ethos (for want of a better expression).
And do ignore the SATs they have really messed everyone about, the marking and tests have been changed so much that they are harder and need quite different preparation now. My DD just started Y4 (in what I suspect is school 2b) and we've already had a talk on how to support/encourage certain things that will be tested in SATs now.
If you think you're not going to be around till year 6 then really go with the school you think fits you best, and don't worry about statistics and OFSTED, things can change quite quickly. Personally I love it that most of my kids friends live only a street or two away, they'll be walking to school together soon. As well as being 15 mins away I suspect that school 2 might have a more spread catchment.
Oh and I went to a non uniform school. Not an issue at primary I would say but I guess my memory might be hazy!
Finally: I know people in all three schools and they're all very happy!

I know often ofsted reports & SATS results are all people often have to go by when choosing a school but most teachers will tell you ofsted isn't accurate so don't just go by that & this years SATS were the first under the new curriculum & it's common knowledge that they were very hard. Plus, if you're just applying for Reception now, SATS are a long way off.

You definitely need to go for gut instinct & talk to people you trust with kids in the schools you like. Try to look around while the kids are there (open days are good to get to see the school but if they can't get open days right!) for a true picture. Have you asked School one to be shown around. Maybe they don't believe in open days. I'm not aware of any open days for Primary schools where I live, just Secondary.

Living close by is a huge bonus. We opted for a school we loved the feel of but it's a short drive away, which is fine 95% of the time but if/when the weather gets bad, it's a pain. Also, we live in an area of new builds with a few different schools so none of the the kids on our estate go to the same school, so all of our kids friends live a drive away. Again, fine when they're 4/5 but when they start getting to Y5/6 & want to walk to/from school & go to friends, they're totally reliant on you.

Don't envy you, but like I said, you need to go with gut instinct! Good luck.

If you are not going to be there by KS2 and maybe not even Yr1 then there is no doubt I'd just got for the one on my doorstep, even if it wasnt great ... reception is just about learning to be at school and having lots of fun learning... the rest is actually irrelevant

Have you made your decision yet OP? I am in a similar boat, and really stressing about the impending deadline...will start my own thread now I think...

[waves at glow]

Thanks for all your thoughts. We think we're going to go for the closest, as many of you have said. Who knows how long we'll even be here so may as well have an easy time.

Betty good luck. I'll see if I can find your thread.