Please help me understand progress without levels (and 'level' this writing)

[KOKOagainandagain]

DS2's school don't seem to have a category lower than 'making expected progress' and it is very difficult to work out whether the gap between DS2 and peers is widening or whether his rate of progress is to be expected and is usual for him. The last level I have is 3a in May 2015 (year 4). I am guessing that teachers use the same descriptors to work out national curriculum points even if levels have been officially abandoned.

So, how would you 'level' this piece of work? Other DC read out their versions at a recent parents' assembly so I have some idea of what his peers are writing.

TIA

This is my point. Previously some things that Ds2 wasn't good at (forming letters, spacing, legibility, quantity) seemed to be ignored in terms of progress. This has determined the level of support he has received because he is good at other stuff. Well it seems that the other stuff (that meant he had made expected progress and didn't need more support for things like forming letters, spacing etc) no longer counts and he is no longer performing as expected.

Does that mean that DS2 now needs more support for the basics otherwise he will not meet year 6 expectations?

I have an NT Y5 who struggles with writing but is "expected" for reading.

Since last year, he's been in a literacy, spelling and handwriting group at school. His writing is similar to your son's- good ideas and vocabulary but not writing in the technical style required by the new curriculum in joined up. His school gets very high percentage of SATs at level 5 and level 6 so I assume that they are training DC like mine to get a high score as possible. This is annoying but I'm hoping that Ds can avoid having to retake in y7 which would be extremely embarrassing for him.
Fwiw, ds teacher said he'd be at the expected level under the old grading system or if he was a year younger (late August birthday )

What I don't understand is how the secondary school requirements in literacy are so different. His sister is in y8 and her English teachers rave about her creative writing which isn't under the same technical scrutiny that primary school children seem to be under. If she wants to write a short sentence she can. Ds seems to have writing targets that are all about very long sentences that use commas, semi colons etc.

Ds was marked a 3c at the end of last year - I'm surprised that your Ds managed a 3a.

I'm also surprised that DS2 was scored at 3a (but this was a statement to court so the school wouldn't have lied).

Eyebrows - ds2 was level 4c for reading a year ago.

It depends what criteria spaniel is using as there are no national standards except for Y2 and 6.

What I really don't understand (forgive my ignorance) is expected achievement - I thought it was the same.

But now DC have a lower level of achievement - level 3 is now level 2 etc.

But expected achievement is the same (4b) but we are wrong to think that our DC are on course because different achievement criteria is now measured?

Just tell us

Expected achievement isn't 4b

All we have are the writing objectives for years 3/4 and the objectives for 5/6, together with the interim framework assessment for end of year 6. there is nothing specifically for year 5 ( or year 3!) as the objectives have to be covered across the 2 years. different schools will measure progress through the objectives in different ways, they will split them ( if they do) between the 2 year groups as and how they want to and they will assess progress against them in whatever manner they like!

Ok - things have clearly changed and I have not been kept informed.

I dread to ask this ( in case the answer is 'expected ') but is there any other way, it would be helpful if this resounded with existing means of measurement, of determining whether or not Ds2 has made expected progress?

If this is the crap you are living with, I fully support NUT action on Tuesday.

This is the Year 5 Writing Assessment Sheet my school uses, the number of objectives that a child is secure in over a range of genres will determine how far they have "progressed" through the year 5 objectives.
Spelling 1 I can spell word endings which sound like ‘shus’ spelt –cious or -tious e.g. vicious, delicious, ambitious,
2 I can spell word endings which sound like ‘shil’ spelt -cial or -tial e.g. official, partial.
3 I can spell words ending in -ant, -ance/-ancy, -ent, -ence/-ency e.g. tolerant/tolerance, transparent
4 I can spell words ending in -able and -ible, also -ably and –ibly e.g. adorable, possible, adorably, possibly.
5 I can spell words containing the letter-string ‘ough’ e.g. bought, rough, through, bough.
6 I can spell some words with ‘silent’ letters e.g. knight, psalm,
7 I can use knowledge of root words, prefixes and suffixes in spelling and understand that the spelling of some words needs to be learnt specifically.
8 I can use the first three or four letters of a word to check spelling, meaning, or both of these in a dictionary.
9 I can use a thesaurus
HW 10 I can write increasingly legibly, fluently, and with increasing speed, through improving choices of which shape of a letter to use when given choices and deciding whether or not to join specific letters.
Composition and Effect 11 I can plan my writing by identifying the audience for and purpose of the writing, using other similar writing as models for my own work.
12 I can plan my writing by noting down and developing my initial ideas, drawing on reading other writing where necessary.
13 I can plan my writing of narratives by considering how authors have developed characters and settings in what the class have read, heard and seen in other stories, plays or films.
14 can draft and write by selecting the correct grammar in my writing. I can use capital letters, full stops, question marks, exclamation marks, commas, apostrophes, brackets and hyphens correctly in my work.
15 can write pieces describing settings, characters and atmosphere, and include speech that helps show the character and their personality or mood.
16 I can draft and write by summarising longer passages.
17 I can draft and write by using words such as then, after that, this, firstly, to build connections in a paragraph.
18 I can draft and write by linking ideas across paragraphs using adverbials of time e.g. later, place e.g. nearby, and number e.g. secondly, or tense choices e.g. he had seen her before.
19 can set out my work correctly and use headings, bullet points, or underlining depending on the purpose of my writing e.g. letter, leaflet, information text, instructions.
20 I can give feedback on and improve my own writing and my classmates
21 I can give feedback on and edit vocabulary, grammar and punctuation to make writing clearer.
22 I can mark and edit work to have the correct tense throughout.
23 I can mark and edit work to have the correct subject and verb agreement.
24 I can read work looking for spelling errors and correct them using a dictionary.
25 I can proof-read for punctuation errors, including the use of brackets and other devices, such as commas or hyphens, used for the same purpose.
Grammar and Punctuation 26 I can change nouns or adjectives into verbs by adding suffixes such as -ate, -ise, -ify e.g. elasticate, standardise, solidify.
27 I can understand verb prefixes e.g. dis-, de-, mis-, over-, and re-.
28 I can add information to my sentences using relative clauses starting with: who, which, where, when, whose, that, or by missing out the pronoun
29 I can indicate degrees of possibility using adverbs e.g. perhaps, surely, or modal verbs e.g. might, should, will,must.
30 I can use devices to build cohesion within a paragraph e.g. then, after that, this, firstly.
31 I can link ideas across paragraphs using adverbials of time e.g. later, place e.g. nearby, and number e.g. secondly, or tense choices e.g. he had seen her before.
32 I can use brackets and can also use dashes or commas for the same purpose.
33 I can use commas to make my writing clear to the reader.

But as I said, different schools will have different assessment strategies!

mrs - what is expected outcome at the end of year 6 please? I really don't know anymore.

Ok, IN MY SCHOOL, we assess the children's writing against a list of objectives similar to the one above for each year group. the percentage they have achieved with give you a "level", so a child who-at the end of year 4 had achieved all the objectives would be assessed as year 4 advanced. To measure progress, at the end of year 5 they would be expected to be a year 5 advanced. similarly, if they had been a Year 4 beginning ( ie they were secure with around 25% of the year 4 objectives) at the end of year 4, then they would need to be at least a year 5 beginning at the end of year 5!

But there is no correlation whatsoever between an old level and a new! they are, as has been said measuring completely different things!

For year 6 we have, for this year only, the "interim framework objectives" and each year 6 is assessed as having met/not met/working at greater depth these objectives. what we will have next year is anyones guess!
Working at the expected standard
The pupil can write for a range of purposes and audiences (including writing a short story):
• creating atmosphere, and integrating dialogue to convey character and advance
the action
• selecting vocabulary and grammatical structures that reflect the level of formality
required mostly correctly
• using a range of cohesive devices*, including adverbials, within and across sentences
and paragraphs
• using passive and modal verbs mostly appropriately
• using a wide range of clause structures, sometimes varying their position within the
sentence
• using adverbs, preposition phrases and expanded noun phrases effectively to add
detail, qualification and precision
• using inverted commas, commas for clarity, and punctuation for parenthesis mostly
correctly, and making some correct use of semi-colons, dashes, colons and hyphens
• spelling most words correctly* (years 5 and 6)
• maintaining legibility, fluency and speed in handwriting through choosing whether
or not to join specific letters.

How does the assessment deal with DC with widely different levels - letter formation, spacing and higher level use of language combined with use of 'wow' words?

Sorry, to be assessed as working AT the expected standard, a child must demonstrate all of these criteria across a range of genre, it is not a best fit method.

Oh, and before the child can be assessed as working at the expected standard, they have to meet all the "working towards" criteria
Working towards the expected standard
The pupil can write for a range of purposes and audiences:
• using paragraphs to organise ideas
• describing settings and characters
• using some cohesive devices* within and across sentences and paragraphs
• using different verb forms mostly accurately
• using co-ordinating and subordinating conjunctions
• using capital letters, full stops, question marks, exclamation marks, commas for lists
and apostrophes for contraction mostly correctly
• spelling most words correctly* (years 3 and 4)
• spelling some words correctly* (years 5 and 6)
• producing legible joined handwriting

If they can't meet all of these ( and a couple of my year 6 children struggle with the spelling element and a couple with the handwriting element) then they are assessed as Pre key stage.

Oh dear! That's DS2 fucked then. Shame - he had so much potential.

It seems things are much worse than I imagined (cocooned in the 'fluffy' SEN world).

Instead of 'we are all doomed', how about parents and teachers work together in the interests of our children?

I wouldn't worry, next year it will all be completely different and we can all start again.

MY guess is that next year, the children will be assessed on the number of words they can squash into a piece of writing which have a minimum of 12 letters each, are in reverse alphabetical order and written upside down!

Strictly speaking no one knows what the expectations for Y6 will be next year. We have an interim framework that applies for 2016 but it will change next year. This year we were drip fed information almost up to the bitter end and I've very little confidence that next year will be any better.

Thank you all for explaining it to me.

Before levels were abandoned, the school used to give us progress data at parent teacher evenings including copies of targets for each level with those that had been met highlighted. I was reassured that 'best fit' meant that we could just ignore the fact that he had never met the handwriting objective.

Last year his English book was full of reminders to use spaces between words as there were none and this made it very difficult to read, it was also full of comments to use full stops - he could write a paragraph with none. But he still got 'expected' in his end of year report. Have things changed since then?

Does this have to be handwritten? Can I have his Statement amended at AR to specify that he is to have a scribe or use a computer for assessments?

He is supposed to be able to use a laptop now but the school are reluctant to let him. Even though they have iPads etc, they gave him something from the 1980's that only displays a couple of lines at a time and is very 'laggy' so DS2 prefers not to use it in lessons. But he is doing 45 minutes of touch typing practice each week and can type twice as fast as he can write.

I am going to speak to his teacher. He is supposed to have new handwriting intervention overseen by an indi OT (ASD/dyspraxia). Before that the NHS OT gave the school advice and resources but the school said that DS2 did not want to do it. DS2's difficulties with writing are due to his conditions not the teaching of the school. The school has taught handwriting to the expected standard and the other children have beautiful handwriting.

Even if he is allowed to use computer, he still need to work on his punctuation and spacing when he is writing. Maybe you should work on that with him during summer? Or is he ok with it when typing?

Nothing has changed from last year, I think, writing was always about neatness, punctuation, spacing, content, grammar, spelling, etc.
I think the assessment was wrong.

All of this gives schools are real problem when Ofsted arrive. They are going to have to show progress, in all year groups. Woolly notions of progress will not be acceptable. We use Target Tracker which is a computer based system but it is based on rigourous teacher analysis of success and evidence based understanding of the curriculum by each child. It gives the school a clear picture of where progress is being made and where it is not. Except, that teachers have become quite reluctant to say whether children have really met the curriculum statement or not. Lots of discussion is taking place! It is not easy and, as a result, our progress has dipped. We do not want to over-gild the lily it seems! External moderation has confirmed most of the teachers assessments though but some have been identified as being too low. We can, however, be confident that what we are reporting to parents is accurate. Of course the new curriculum has not helped progress either and Y6 have had a gap to close which is bigger than it should have been. Y3 also.

Anyone who is not clear about assessment without levels really should ask the school for a parents' evening. It is not acceptble that parents are asking for equivalents to level 4, 5 etc. Schools have a duty to inform parents about the new system even though there are clearly problems with it!

Spacing is not a problem when he is typing. Punctuation remains a problem. Once he has met a target (observed on 2 or 3 occasions) he doesn't seem to retain what he has learnt. He will use speech marks but not the basic stuff of full stops and capital letters, or commas.

I think that the school prefer him to write because, if he is not motivated by the topic, he writes very little and this is not increased by typing. Somehow one sentence looks worse when typed. When he is motivated he writes up to 100 words but they are difficult to read. If the same is typed and can be easily read, the lack of punctuation and the fact that the writing doesn't make sense is more obvious.

I think his previous assessment was wrong too. He was 2a in September but 3a by May. That's the 'tribunal effect' and, unfortunately, to be expected. But the new system is even worse because the exaggeration would be hidden as both 2a and 3a would now be in the same category of 'expected', if I understand what you are saying.

If there are no national expectations until year 6, there is the possibility that Ds2 will not meet expected standards at that time, but by then it will be too late to do anything as primary education would then be over. This would be almost impossible to challenge if schools are able to set their own expectations in other years. What's to stop them (apart from morality) from saying that everyone has met expected levels and saving some money supporting DC struggling with some specific aspects of learning despite being able. Oh, I've just remembered that DS2's school are already doing this - that's why there is no category of not meeting expectations. God, how depressing.

I have experience of the BOG in DS2's previous school and was familiar with Target Tracker and the precise progress data this delivers. We use to be given precise information but now the information given to parents is wooly. I had assumed that TT was no longer used. Why are teachers reluctant to share this data with parents if they were using TT both before and after levels were abolished? Data has always had to be translated from National Curriculum Points to link to levels. Why can't the school tell us NCP and expected NCP for each year. We can handle the points! I will ask DS2's school if they use something like this:

www.viscountbeaumonts.leics.sch.uk/National%20Curriculum%20Level%20Expectations.pdf

Also, re your previous post of ignoring earlier years and starting afresh each September - I thought the aim of TT was to collect longitudinal data to allow progress to be measured across Key Stages?

Is literacy internally marked for KS2 SATs? If it is I expect that DS2 will achieve 'expected' and then his secondary school will have to break it to us (and him) that this is not the case.