Help me! Maths Q

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I never did the basics in Maths, I'm sort of learning it at the same time as my child. She came up with what I think (and I may be incorrect) is the wrong answer to a question but I actually don't know so I left it and didn't say anything.

This is what she told me.

Anna has 4 apples, Paul has 4x as many apples as Anna, how many apples does Paul have.

My answer to this would be a simple 4x4=16

Her answer was 20.

She added the original 4 to the 4x4 sum, otherwise, Paul would only have 3 lots of 4 more than Anna and he should have 4 lots of 4 more than Anna.

Is she right? If she is right - hooray, if she is incorrect then can you tell me why in simple Year 2 terms.

There's a reason I did Arts based subjects.

I think you are correct - the answer is 16, although I have to admire her two stage approach!!!
The reason is that the question says 4 times as many. I think the question she has answered would ask about how many more, although I can't think of the exact wording.

4 x 4 =16 asked in a "practical" way. I think your dd's error of adding 4 x 4 to the original amount is probably fairly common so I would leave it wrong for the teacher to explain and correct. If explaining myself I would say "4 times as many" is the same as "4 lots of" and get out a packet of Smarties to illustrate.

You are right. Break it down. Using your answer if he had twice as many it would be 8, three times as many would be 12 and 4 times as many is 16.

If your daughter was right then Anna would have had 5.

So the wording of "many" or "more" makes a massive difference and now I don't actually know whether she said many or more. I will absolutely leave it to the teacher. I can help my daughter with pretty much anything except maths.

Thanks howabout that makes sense to me. I think my problem is that her way also makes sense to me depending on the context of the question.

My ds's school has a little maths booklet for parents explaining the method they use and wordings, etc. as well as one on their website.
Can you ask your dc's school for one, if they have it, or make one for parents, so parents can help children with homework?

I agree with you.

If he has 4 times as many he has 4 'lots' of what she has got - 4x4=16.

However, I don't think '4 times more' is generally used. If you have twice as many apples as Fred, you wouldn't say you've got 1x more, would you?

I agree Galena - that's why I said I couldn't come up with the wording
Yes to asking the school for their maths policies - they should have them available for parents. look on the web site, or approach the class teacher.

I think the two stage thing would be like 400% increase? So .100% is 4, and increase of 400% would be adding 16?

That makes sense in my head.

Talking to another parent, I think they've started doing SAT papers to find out where the class has weak areas so they can concentrate on those.

Not directly related to the actual question, but, as a rule, when DS and I can't agree with an answer I just tell him to put whatever he decides and let the teacher correct and explain if it was wrong.