North London prep schools- help please!

[angelpuffs]

Hello everyone
I'm new to mumsnet and would really appreciate some advice from people with experience of private schools for 4+ entry.
My May born DD will be due to enter school in sept 2017 at age 4 and we'd like to sit her for the assessments at NLCS, SHHS and Channing. We've applied to SHHS already, and looked at NLCS last week (and loved it). I know how hard all these schools are to get into, and initially I wanted to sit her for a back up school- we were thinking of Grimsdell. However we've decided that, instead of Grimsdell, the best thing would be to try for a small prep school which would be able to prepare her well for 7+ or 11+ entry to a good school, rather than her be at Mill Hill which is not great academically (so I've heard).
I'd love to hear opinions on any good prep schools that don't require the child to be registered from birth- I'm looking at St Christophers in Hampstead soon but don't like the idea of the staggered entry in reception and year 1 that they have there. Anyone know anything about Hampstead Hill school? I'm also looking at Norfolk house in Muswell hill but it's first come first served there, and non selective. It's so confusing! All advice would be welcomed.
Feel free to suggest anywhere else I haven't mentioned. We live in East Finchley so anywhere within reasonable distance of there.
Thanks xx

I would seriously think very hard about doing the journey from GG. That is a two hour round trip for you in the morning and a further hour in the afternoon.

You mean 2 hours round trip from GG to Habs??

If my DD was to attend Habs or NLC which are areas best to live if I also want to be as close to Central as possible and husband works at Bank? Thanks!

Sl280- how old is your daughter? Does she have a place at Habs/NLCS? If so, you might be best living towards north London somewhere on the northern line for your husband to commute to bank easily. Depending on your budget, Highgate/Hampstead? But I wouldn't choose an area to live unless your DD has been offered a place at these schools as they are by no means a safe bet!

You mean 2 hours round trip from GG to Habs??

No, not really. The actual drive takes about 30 minutes, but you know what it's like in the morning - the later you leave, the worse the traffic is and when they're little you have to walk them from the car park to school.

You would need to leave earlier to get to more local schools like SHHS or Channing because of traffic and parking.

Yes. If you leave at 7.40 (as suggested up thread) for an 8.30 start that is 50 mins. Then it takes 15 mins to get back to the car and out of the heavily congested car park. Then you are heading in towards London at the tail end of the rush hour which is easily another 45 mins+. Imagine 3 years of that (until your DD is old enough to get on the coach) and I think it is tough on the little ones when they are settling into school to spend nearly 2 hours in the car every day.

Both HABS and NLCS draw from a huge area because people do those journeys, but to make it relatively easy for yourself you need to be in Radlett/Elstree/Stanmore/Edgware/Mill Hill. That gives you access to the Thameslink, Jubilee Line and the Northern line which makes for easy access to the City.

Doesn't actually take 50 minutes though. leaving at 7.40 gets them there about 8.15 so they get to play with friends in the playground for 15 minutes before the bell goes. journey back also isn't that bad as rush hour is largely done - would say 30-45 minutes. I know lots of N Londoners who send their kids to Habs. It's arguably better than braving the traffic and parking in Swiss Cottage or Highgate.

Also some parents team up in the car park of Habs - so say you drive there every day, 2-3 days of the week you walk several girls to the school and wait until 8.30, the other 2-3 days you hand them over to the other Mum and you're out of the car park by 8.15 or so. Sort of a rota for the last bit!

'Word on the street when I did it was that NLCS and Habs had an informal deal whereby Habs took more summer borns and NLCS more winter borns at 4 and then habs picked up winter borns at the 5+. May have been just rumour! And of course habs don't do 5+ any more. I know someone at SHHS, 80% of the class are born between September and December, it causes chaos for parties.'

Oh, brokenmouse. You do talk tosh.
Please don't spread rumours. DD1 is a July baby and joined NLCS at 4+. In fact, they adjust their scoring to allow for age and take an even spread across the year. There is no 'deal'- informal or otherwise. Some girls get offers from one of these schools, some from both and most from neither. I also know plenty from SHHS who are summer born- they asess and adjust in much the same way.
I do not think you can generalise in any way about personality types at these schools. Very bright and ready are the criteria. I certainly don't think you can say either that Habs is more relaxed than NLCS.
It's really unhelpful for prospective parents to hear or rely on rumours. There is no secret handshake to get your DDs in. Tutoring is a waste of money. You can't game the assessments. If you have questions, ask the schools. They will not lie to you.

Horsemadmom- I was hoping you'd respond to this thread at some
point. Someone I know with a daughter at NLCS said there is a mix of personality types- and that certainly not all of the girls are the confident types. Her daughter is older but also entered at 4. I guess the only way to find out if my daughter is right for the school is to sit her for the assessment and see what happens.

I love sensible people and you are my favourite one today, Anglepuffs!

I doubt my husband would agree- I've become somewhat obsessed with NLCS after our recent visit there!

It is every bit as good as it looks. Best of luck and remember that many girls who don't get places at 4+ join at 7+ or 11+. If your DD is right and ready for the school, they will see it.

So horsemadmon you wouldn't agree that children should be prepared for the 4+? Slightly disingenuous to say that without mentioning that your kids went to HHS which (I know from experience of relatives and close friends) spends a lot of time doing things that are relevant to the assessments, and that your kids are now teenagers so your experience isn't exactly recent. There is indeed a year at SHHS in the last three years intake where the vast majority are born from sept to dec. It may be an anomaly but it exists.

For what it's worth the while we were on the tour for Highgate the head mentioned that Highgate takes 60% fall babies and that NLC does not attempt to keep any balance and ends up with almost all fall babies. I don't have a girl so I haven't investigated myself but might be worth asking them the direct question.

There is a huge difference between sending a small child to a good nursery and paying a tutor to sit one-on-one. Some of DD1's NLCS classmates went to HHS, Mulberry, Golders Hill etc and some came from Montessori, church playgroups and even no regular pre-school experience at all. A 4+ tutor is pointless. Unless, of course, you don't read to your DD, talk to your DD, do puzzles, do arts and crafts. A good pre-school that does learning readiness will benefit any DC no matter what type of school they go on to. When the Heads of NLCS, Habs et al say this, they are not lying to you-
Tutoring for 4+ is a waste of money!
I can also assure you that the SHHS year with an autumn glut was anomolous. Girls are assessed with others of the same birth months- September girls are seen in different sessions to August girls.We had a busy party season in late June and early July but that was down to the July/August girls' parties squeezed into the end of the school year. 5 girls in DD1's year. But only in reception. By year 1 we did joint parties in 2s and 3s to avoid clashes and killing every weekend with sugar-crazed little girls.

Hi Monster,
60% autumn babies at Highgate (3+ tour?) is down to first come first served registration. My DS was born in December and we were clueless so didn't look for preschools until he was 10 months old. We couldn't even get on the Highgate waiting list by that point. I have no idea why they would comment on another school.
Do feel free to ask NLCS if it will put your mind at rest.

Fair enough, it was an anomaly. Pretty rubbish for summer born children that year though.

We will have to agree to disagree on whether sending your child somewhere like HHS is akin to tutoring.

The difference between autumn and summer born DCs disappears very quickly. It looks huge when you have a toddler but by age 6, it's impossible to tell. DD1 was so tiny when she started that we had to special order her school shoes because she was wearing an early walker size and I had to have the smallest size school pinafore hemmed by 3 inches.

I think the worry with Autumn born v summer born is that when they do the assessments, they are only just older than toddlers- my DD will be 3 yrs 7 months at assessment time. However I have heard many stories- including from NLCS themselves- that the spread of girls is genuinely taken from across the age groups and that they expect more of Autumn born girls at assessment than they sonic summer born ones- one reason they assess them separately in order of birth month.

Was meant to read "do of" not "sonic"

Highgate might be first come first served for 3+ applications, but it doesn't make any difference when you're born since they don't accept applications until the children are, at the youngest, two and a half. It says on their website that for children born between Sept 2013 and August 14, the window for applying is March-May 2016.

I'm really surprised that they'd admit to having all Autumn born children as that's sort of admitting that they just take the easiest most mature children and offer very little value-added.

Mind you, since all 3+ admissions process must be a total lottery then taking the oldest is probably as good a way as any. There is very little evidence that you can pick out the bright ones at such an early age with any accuracy.

I disagree that the difference disappears by 6. Almost all the research I've read indicates the difference in outcomes is still present even at CEO level jobs. The last study I read was on Fortune 500 CEO and there was nary a one born past April. If anyone has other data I'd be interested to see it.

The tour we were on was for Highgate entry at 7+ not 3+. Just for clarity - even at 3+ Highgate is not first come first serve - there is an assessment. It was the head of the Junior school who passed comment on NCLS. He was pointing out that they (Highgate) do at least give spring and summer borns some spaces (even if it's only 40%). They make an active attempt at balancing the year. I do think it's a question worth asking of any selective school when they are judging them so young. Just because they assess then in separate groups by month of birth doesn't mean they take equally from those groups.

The likes of Golders Hill sends almost all its girls (I don't think there was even one left by year 1/2) to likes of NCLS, so perhaps it's worth looking at their nursery. The Avenue and Annemount also loose a few each year at reception to the same selective schools.

Sorry I was unclear, I know that Highgate isn't first come first served in terms of admissions, but it is in terms of applications because it has a cap on the number it accepts even to be accessed. But someone up thread was suggesting that a younger child might not be born in time for even their application to be accepted.

It's a bit of a shocker that as many as 60% are autumn born since it should be around half that. Honestly these private schools crowing about their results over state schools when what they do is cherry pick the easiest to teach...