has anyone managed to successfully appeal against infant class size limit?

[fluffybunnies246]

Hello. I've got a bit of an unusual situation. We moved last academic year, and my 3 kids ended up at 2 separate primary schools due to there not being space for all of them in any one school. We appealed to get our reception age child placed with her brothers unsuccessfully due to the infant class size limit of 30. There were 30 in the class at the time.

Fast forward to July. I applied again for my youngest child to enter year 1. Again, the school rejected her. This time because there are now 32 children in that year group, meaning 2 got through on appeal.

I've got the forms for appealing…but I found the whole thing so awful last time- like I was a terrible person for daring to appeal- that I'm wavering as to whether I should actually do it. Both schools are not the nearest to our house- that was full. In distance the youngest is the nearest, then the older boys (going into year 3 and 5). We also appealed for the boys to go to the little girls school unsuccessfully. That experience was even worse- another parent (governor) basically telling me how inconsiderate I was to even think about it! And the boys don't want to go there anyway.

My situation has changed since the first appeal. I am now a single mother, with no support network around me. I didn't tell them the first time, but I have depression for years, and obviously, now their father has left I'm under a lot of strain. I have to drive the kids to school…my car is unreliable, I don't have a job (had to give it up to move and am trying to get another) so can't afford a new one. When it's broken down the school run has been difficult- one location would be fine, and walkable, 2 was a nightmare, so that now I just don't bother even attempting it if the car doesn't work. My daughter is really feeling the effect of her father leaving. She wants to be with her brothers. She is not sleeping, and said to me the other week "daddy doesn't like me, because he left, and my brothers school doesn't like me because they let other people in and not me". She knows that there are new reception people as her brother told her. I have tried to reassure her that none of the things that have happened are down to people not liking her, but it just worries me what is going on in her head.

The boys don't want to move school again and I don't blame them. They are very, very happy at their current school. My eldest is very bright, and I had a real battle getting him to his previous school as he was 'bored' all the time. He's also very quiet and slow to make friends (but when he does they are strong friendships) and although I don't think moving would be good for either of them, I think it would have more of a negative impact on him. Given that the kids have already had a lot of upset in their lives, I don't really want to cause them any more.

So, I think I have reasons for appeal. But I'm concerned that they are not good enough for the local authority and that once again, if I go, I'm just going to be treated like I'm wanting to deprive every other child at the school of a decent education just because I want all my children to go to the same school.

I'd really appreciate any insight into anyone else's experience, as I don't know anyone in real life who has had to appeal against infant class size limit.

I used to sit on appeals panels.

None of those factors will get you over the hurdle for an infant class size appeal, sorry. They are all very hard things for you to deal with, but the only way you can win an ICS appeal is if there were errors made that deprived your child of a place, or if the decision was unreasonable (which in law means 'so perverse that no reasonable person could have made that decision).

We would be deeply sympathetic but there will be many parents who have to get children to two, three or even four schools which all start at the same time. Logistics are not a grounds for appeal.

Being separated from siblings is hard, but again, many children are. If it was an infant/junior set up, she wouldn't be with the other children anyway.

I suppose what I'm saying is that you've said 'I have an unusual situation' but it's actually really, really, common.

The behaviour of the governor was inexcusable. You have the right to appeal. No-one should make you feel bad about it.

I won my own infant class size case but that was in unusual circumstances. I have helped some parents to win ICS cases. It is possible.

Having said that, I'm afraid an appeal is unlikely to succeed. The rules set by the government (not the local authority) are that there are only three grounds on which you can win an infant class size appeal:

• the admission arrangements did not comply with the Admissions Code and as a result your child was deprived of a place

• the admission arrangements were not administered correctly and as a result your child was deprived of a place

• the decision to refuse to admit your child was unreasonable

There is nothing in your post to suggest that any of these grounds apply.

Occasionally I have come across cases where a sympathetic appeal panel has admitted even though, within the rules, they should have rejected the case. It is possible that could happen for you but the fact they are already 2 over the limit makes that less likely. So if you appeal I'm afraid you need to accept that it is a long shot and you are unlikely to win.

The other thing, which may comfort you, is that the 2 over class size may have had special circumstances that allowed them to be admitted despite the rules (e.g. a looked after child or child with a Statement/EHCP who has moved to the area).

Would any of your children be eligible for school transport? It might be worth seeing what the policy is and whether you exceed the walking distance or it is an unsafe route. It is usually shorter for KS1 children. That may help with the logistics. It is unlikely that your older children would have much time for a younger one whilst at school and may well have different playgrounds. I would try and make the best of the school situation but apply again for years 2 or 3 as vacancies can appear. Does the school still know you want a place?

The distance is 2 miles for KS1.

I suppose my situation is unusual around here. And I never met anyone in my previous city who had it either, despite ridiculous oversubscription in schools. In general, the boys school is very undersubscribed…it's just that year.

Thanks for telling me what they take into consideration on the panel though. I just wonder though…how exactly am I meant to get my children to school, or pick them up on time, with no funds to do so and no-one to help out? I can't afford breakfast club/after school. Both schools are within 2 miles walking distance…we live in an extremely hilly area though and it takes between 30 and 45 mins depending on whether you are going down or uphill to get from one school to the other…public transport round here (market town) is terrible. Do you think there is some scope to help me with actually getting the kids to school despite living within the walking area, until I manage to get a job? As even in the car, sometimes it takes me 45 mins to get from one to the other if the traffic is bad, and the buses are not frequent. I also have to personally drop off each child…I can't just stick the boys on the bus and let them make their own way there. I just don't know how I am actually expected to do it, and the threat of court action, or fines, concerns me deeply.

and yes the school know I want a place! They have to put up with my persistent lateness…

Honestly, I feel for you but the answer is 'no'. The appeals panel can't give your DD a place because they feel sorry for you. They can't bend or break the rules.

The LA only have to provide transport if you live 2 miles from the allocated school (and then, only if there wasn't a closer school that you could have had a place at but rejected).

The responsibility for timely attendance lies with the parent and unfortunately the fact that you have children at a different school is not a reason for lateness (they would say). Practically, though, you can't be in two places at once.

Is there a different school that would have places for all three of your children?

The school situation is dire in England. I can offer no help OP but you have my sympathy.

How do they expect parents to do multiple school drop offs when they start at the same time?

I actually asked before we moved about school places- I phoned up the council as we were going to rent, and thought it would be best to look for housing where we would have most chance of getting places. They were no help- just told us to find somewhere to live then get in touch. When we got an address I was told to phone around the schools to find places- this was lengthy and not very fruitful. Most schools round here are small rural schools. There was no-where within walking distance that could accommodate them all, the schools that they ended up at were the only ones with any places at all. At the first appeal, they said that there were places at a school 3.5 miles away, although they hadn't offered that as an option when I had said that I was having difficulty finding places, and my children had already been at school a term by then. The other school is not really an option though, as public transport wise it's half a mile walk to the bus stop, then bus journey, then nearly another mile at the other end! Which would take us far over the 45 minutes that they suggest.

It's a bit Kafka-esque…you have to get to school on time or be fined…but you have to be able to be in two places at exactly the same time, even if you are a single parent!

Just really to reiterate what has been said by others. The reality is that any appeal will be an infant class size appeal and the very limiting nature of the rules mean that no matter how much sympathy the panel has for your situation , there is no way that you should win the case.

I have in the last three months had numerous cases of a similar nature and only one was successful because of a mistake by the admission authority.

There is a significant problem around pupils who are moving into an area. In theory the latest legal clarifications to the infant class size regs give slightly more leeway in that the admission authority has to consider when making the decision not to admit whether the pupil could be considered as an excepted pupil under 2.15e of the regs. That says children who move into the area outside the normal admissions round for whom there is no available school within reasonable distance. The problem is that reasonable distance has been defined by previous legal decisions and it allows most admission authorities to say a place is available in X school because it is within reasonable commute distance. It is also only the one pupil being considered not where is the nearest school with places for all siblings.

Most admission appeal panel members are frustrated by the infant class regs in situations like yours where it is obvious that finding places for all siblings in one school is the obvious need.

Speak to the head at one of your children's schools- given your circumstances, they may be able to offer a free or discounted place for your child/ren at breakfast club.

Good point Tether.

I suspect that your DC are eligible for pupil premium. Does either school use that to subsidise breakfast club?

Counter argument
It isn't any good for your children nor the other kids to be in such a large class. It will be crowd control at best and those who need additional help won't be getting it.

won appeal due to not being able to be in two places at once

That is not grounds for winning an infant class size case. Either you won on some other basis or you were incredibly lucky.