How good are these results?

[Nostarwhere1]

My DS is in Yr 2 of a private school. I recently attended a parents evening where I was told the following:

My DS had recently taken some tests. The average score in the UK is 100 and he scored an average of 124 over the 4 papers, which were: Maths, English?, VR and NVR.

I wondered:

Which tests would these be?
How good are these scores. Ideally I would like to know percentiles.

School don't seem to want anyone to know which tests they are.

Well, how are we supposed to know? Talk to the school... You pay them to educate your dc, surely they can tell you what tests they are using!

I'd be assuming it was like IQ tests, where there's a normal distribution around an artificial "average" of 100.

On that kind of scale, 124 is very good, but not OH MY GOD GENIUS. A quick Google suggests 95th centile.

But STEALTH BOAST MUCH?!

Cocktail Queen- Appears you did not read my last sentence.

Mrs- yes, it is easy to find percentiles for IQ tests and as I fall back I could guess that these are probably somehow roughly equivalent to IQ. However, with subject names mentioned (math and English, at least) they seem like ability test rather than IQ tests.

Well duh.

I meant that maybe they're scored like IQ tests - that is, they rank them and then give you a number.

No, I did read your last sentence! Thank you

just thought that since the school is private they should be happy to give you info on what tests they have been giving your dc - otherwise the results are meaningless, no?

Sounds like a version of the 11+ - though obviously scaled down for Year 2.

If you want to know what they are you'll have to ask the school. There's literally dozens of these sorts of tests.

And Mrs Hathaway was right. If it's a standardised score this 100 as the mid point, then providing they use the same standard deviation then the centimes are exactly the same regardless of whether it's IQ, English or ancient Hebrew.

I think it is a bit strange that the school won't tell you what the tests are or what the scores mean.

I'd imagine they don't tell you what the tests were because they use the same tests every year and if it became common knowledge what tests they were using some over invested parents may get hold of some copies and cheat. Which distorts the scores on the test slightly.

They should have explained the results better. And I'm not totally sure of the point of an average score over all those subjects.

Thank you for replies

I do post on this board occasionally, but changed my name for this post. I am new to the UK and just thought that it may be relatively obvious to some of the people on this board which test had been done. The only reason I wanted to know which test it was so that I could hunt down the percentiles myself, if aomone didn't come up with them.

Rafa- yes, I assumed this was the reason they weren't forthcoming with the name of the test. They did give me individual scores, which I didn't want to make openly available. It surprises me that with DSs math score he was still not in the top set for math. Think I may just ask his teacher more about his math.

just google percentile and standard score and dozens of tables come up, it doesn't matter which one, that's the whole point of standard scores! A score of 124 gives you a percentile score of 95

Some people need to learn some manners.

This whole "stealth boast" crap pisses me off no end. MN can be great if you have problems but god forbid you have a question that involves a child who is something other than average or below.

It surprises me that with DSs math score he was still not in the top set for math

Top set for maths is just the top X pupils. If your DS is the X+1 pupil, he will be in the next set down. Also, the test score may not be representative of his day-to-day ability as show in class.

Oh, and not everyone knows what a bloody standardised score means. If no one has ever explained it then it's not the sort of information you just absorb by osmosis.

I wouldn't have had a clue what those results meant either.

Well done to your ds, Nostarwhere. :)

Thanks Soup. My first post explained it fairly calmly, I thought. I didn't eye roll until OP was snippy first.

And you're right, it isn't a stealth boast.

Aren't they just Year 2 SATS, or don't private schools do them?

With regards to not being top set for maths it may be that there is a very strong cohort.

These sound like they could be NFER Cognitive Ability Test scores? About two thirds of kids will score between 85 and 115, so it sounds like your DC did well. However, Yr 2 is too soon to tell if this is a future predictor, and the only way to get consistency is yearly testing to see if similar scores achieved at Yr 4, 5 and 6.

They may be something else entirely, but seems the best way to find out is to actually ask the school. They can't refuse to tell you. Besides the fact you are paying the fees, it would seem odd for ANY school to test a child and refuse to tell the parent what test had been done; and the implications of the testing?

The most useful question to ask the school is probably 'where does this put ds in terms of expected progression and attainment at this point in Y2?

If the 'average' score is 100, then it would make a difference whether the 'expected' parameters are 50-150 or 75-125 iyswim..

Or 'how much ahead of 'average' is he'? is another way of putting it.

But yes people are absolutely right that you need to ask the school. Although they've already told you that he's 'above average' - was there some more specific information that you wanted?

This link might help with providing more info, but it looks like your DS is on the 94th percentile? It may have been more nuanced for the school to give you individual scores for each area, rather than an average...

[http://www.nfer.ac.uk/research/centre-for-assessment/standardised-scores-and-percentile-ranks.cfm]

A lot of private schools use the CAT scores (which can't be practiced or prepared for!), as it's also a major predictor for the schools that can be applied for at 11+. They send the scores to prospective schools with the headmaster's report, if it isn't already in the normal school report.

However, doing them at Yr2 is pretty early, as at 11+ schools are only interested in how consistent the scores are at Yrs 4, 5 and 6. They can vary massively before that.

All said, regardless of which test it is, it sounds like your DS is doing REALLY well in Yr2. The key will be to let him enjoy learning for the love of learning, and his natural ability will, no doubt, shine through!

They could also be PIPs testing. I would go back to school ask them what tests they are and what the centile are.

I'm guessing that they are NFER tests. Private schools like to use these. The scores use a bell curve. 100 is average. Anything over 132 is considered to be within the top 2%. I think 124 will be the top 15% butte he actual figures are in the Nfer website (if it is those tests).
The school should tell you what tests they are using. Especially as it is a fee paying school.

A link which explains it and shows the bell curve.
www.nfer.ac.uk/research/centre-for-assessment/standardised-scores-and-percentile-ranks.cfm