Math and spellings in Y5... should I be worried?

[DopeyDawg]

This is what is being given out:

Math:
'find half of 10', find 1/2 of 20' (8 questions), 'find 1/4 of 12', 'find 1/4 of 40' (8 questions), find '1/3 of 9', 'find 1/3 of 15' (8 questions)'. This is first Math homework home for 3 years as apparently 'it's all done in class'.
Still working on 3 times table.

Spellings:
much, line, too, old, puppy, rabbit, same, boy, book etc
10 each week. No test.

Apparently, child is 'not behind'.

They are having a laugh, right?
Should I be seriously worried?

Dopey, I'm sorry you and your ds are going through this and I hope you both manage to get the support you need. I can't help with the education side but my dd aged 10 had similar issues with sleeping. She would go to bed at 9, read for an a hour and lay awake til midnight, I'm in the USA and mentioned it at a paediatrician appointment. She referred us to a Paediatric sleep specialist. He was amazing, asked us a billion questions and said to try only sleeping in bed. No screen time, no eating, no reading (we don't have screens or food upstairs anyway). Bring bedtime forward by 15 minutes a week. Sit in a different room if possible before bedtime but no laying down. Read for an hour, or do a puzzle, or draw, Lego etc, then go to bed, lights out. He made it very clear that beds are only for sleeping. Now my dd is asleep by 9 every night. Worth trying, lack of sleep was making us crazy. She's still not a morning person but getting 9.5 hours sleep a night.

Best of luck.

Thank you butterflies.
We already do the screens and food bit but he does read and write/draw in bed. He wont do it anywhere else so we thought a good idea but I can see where the sleep specialist is coming from - beds ARE for sleeping and that message needs to be re-inforced.

The Paed who dx him as ASD said he needed melatonin but local GP wont help.

The maths questions and spellings are not for an average ability year 5 - no.

Thanks, Berrie - I felt sure the LEA were not being transparent about this.

Would you say they were average for about Y3? (I appreciate that is a bit of a sweeping statement sort of question).

If you are in Scotland you can ask the school for dyslexia testing and legally they cannot refuse, get as much information together as possible and meet with the head teacher.

My dd sounds similar to your ds workwise and we are finally going through the testing now.

Probably. I would expect to be giving those maths questions and spellings to a below average group in year 5. Though I think as someone else said - the teacher might have a reason not to send anything too challenging for homework. The teacher might also not be very good/experienced/knowledgeable about this class.
I guess if you find those words are a struggle for him then you will know. Could he tell you verbally what half of ten is, 1/3 of nine?
I don't understand what the school has to gain by telling you he isn't behind if he isn't - very odd.
Clearly you have a clever and talented child who needs some help though. Good luck!

Oops -That should be 'telling you he isn't behind if he is...'

Not average for my Y3. Recent maths homework has beenVenn diagrams and acute/obtuse angles, and working on times tables up to 10.

Spellings have been things like: photography, incessantly, especially and historic. Current reading book (from school) is an abridged Nicholas Nickleby.

The work you cite in yourOP is closer to work currently being done by my Yr6 child, who has severe ASD and moderate learning difficulties

Although I should add dd1's spellings have been more like : community, amateur and computer. It's the maths work (halving/doubling and lower times tables) which is similar to what she is doing.

DS1 in year5 is doing more advances work than that. So is DS2 who is year 3. Both are quite bright. I would say that DS2 would do that homework in 15 minutes. The spellings look v easy to me too. We are in London.

Sorry I can't help re what you should do.

Our sleep specialist said not to use melatonin as the long term effects on children are unknown. We live in the Usa where you can buy liquid form over the counter and it worked well on dd on the three or four times we used it but apparently if you use it lots, it gets less effective. We tried magnesium too (most of the population is deficient and sleep problems is a symptom). It didn't work very well.....

The Scottish school system isn't the problem, the school is. Moving to England will only help if you find a good school there. Why not look for a better school in Scotland?

If you are concerned about getting him dyslexia tested then you just need to ask the headteacher. It's a fairly straightforward initial process using questionnaires and collecting work together, then a formal diagnosis with Ed Psych which takes longer to organise.

No, it's the School and the System.

For example: a SfLT recently told us that one of the reasons he struggles is because of 'his right (non Scottish) accent' and everyone laughed (except us, being nonScottish). I complained to LEA (as obv his accent doesn't affect his handwriting, for example). LEA agreed with school that 'NonScottish accent can affect things'. Now, to take it further I'd need an Independent Adjudication. I have been told by a lawyer that the Council has to approve the IA application (which obviously they aren't going to do). So, what now?

This is one (minor) example. There are many many more. More serious too. It seems clear from my research that the system in Scotland is both less structured and that there are less formal routes for complaint if needed.

I think the CforE is awful cobbled together politicised drivel.
The Curriculum in England may be too, but at least children are assessed so there is more chance of catching a child falling through the gaps.

'Just need to ask the HT'? No, not round here
That will be the HT who doesn't even reply to emails/letters?
They don't 'diagnose' in my area anyway.
They rarely even assess prior to High School.

Could you copy the LA Education Dept into any letters / e mails that you send to the HT? It is dreadful that you receive no response to letters or e mails.

I'd look at another school but appreciate that if you are living in a rural area that may not be practical. Are there any retired teachers that you could pay to tutor your DS? He may benefit from some one-to-one. A tutor could also give you an unbiased opinion as to how he is doing compared to other children of the same age in the Scottish system.

Also, is he getting any interventions at school? It is common in our area for children who are struggling to get one-to-one with a TA for maths or English.

I am a little confused about which school year he is in. Is it P5? If so, it may be better to compare to the standard in a year 4 class in England, since English children will have had an extra year of education in Reception. You may find he's not doing as badly as you think. Your DS should be able to tell you which group he is in for maths, spelling and reading.

Hi cloutie

It's the LA who wont answer letters / concerns. Can wait weeks for a reply and then it fails to answer a single Qu (such as 'can we please have results of spelling tests for this academic year?' or 'can we please see examples of work where you consider he meets his targets'). Just completely ignored. Letters discuss whether we are being 'sufficiently positive about school at home'. That type of crap.

No intervention at school. He had 6 lots of 30 min sessions last term.
Now he has 'met his targets' apparently and it's been stopped.
Yet they wont 'share the evidence'.
He cant spell 'house' 'book' or (sometimes) his own name.
He is in 3rd group in class (ie next to bottom).
Class has kids up to 2 years younger in.

Hmmn, that's tricky. In our area they replaced PLPs with Learning Journals. They have examples of work where the teachers think our DSs have met their targets. Do they have something similar in your area? It may be difficult for the school to refuse to allow you to see the Learning Journals.

I can understand the frustration with the school. The system can seem so opaque and I find it can be difficult to get a straight answer to a question. It sounds as though your DS may be on the lower side of average but isn't at the bottom of the class. If I were you, I'd step up the amount of work that you are doing with your DS out of school. There are some great websites with free materials. If you feel the situation is really bad I'd look at a tutor. There is very little mobility between spelling groups etc in our school and I worry that once a kid is pigeon holed it is difficult for them to move up if they are not being exposed to the harder work at school.

Sorry, but that's very basic stuff. Similar to what my DD was doing in Year 2.